Zamano Share Discussion Threads

[value hound] 08/6/2016 16:03

Maybe another bid coming?

[battlebus2] 08/6/2016 15:50

Moving well today.

[the_owl] 02/6/2016 19:11

Thanks chaps. Owl Top tip:

1) Set up Paypal account, and a payment link
2) Send link to company requesting your refund (they may still try to refuse but this SAVES them money, so they won't refuse for long)! If they still do, send to their CFO!
3) Receive credit next day .... no name, no address, no account details, nor cheque needed.

My first Paypal credit arrived today in sum of £30.

Hey, I'm 300% up on my Zamano investment ...lol

[the_owl] 01/6/2016 22:05

Thanks - but its not really about getting the money back is it (though I must admit Zamano are now chasing me to do just that!).

I just do not want to give them my name or address - which FWIW (together with my mobile no.) is probably worth a lot more to them than the £10 they owe me !!... because what's to stop them now selling it on to 5 similar 3rd parties, and them in turn sending me dodgy texts??

No. I've resolved the matter, written it off, confirmed the number is blocked, cancelled EE contract and taken out a £5 one which gives me similar benefits.
BTW - asked them for c10 pieces of info about my own data - all very basic stuff. They provided answers to just 2 - despite my chasing. I have contacted M Connelly - Zamano CFO, and asked that my Paypal account be refunded.

1 month, and the £10 loss will be no more. Each month thereafter I'll be better off by £10 + VAT :-)... sod Zamano, their 3rd parties, and our UK tootless regulators who allow these practices.

Final thing to do to wrap up the situation is to contact EE, explain in the strongest terms how their TP operates, the impact on EE customers, and suggest it blocks them, and all such companies - choosing instead a different company with some ethics.

Battlebus - I agree its not relevant to your investment. EE probably won't do anything and they'll still have Vodafone. Just putting it out there as it epitomises a culture in one of their revenue streams, and maybe some of their investors will also see this, and think twice - but its only a minor income stream I agree. END

[aleman] 01/6/2016 09:23

valuehound - they can't pay out a dividend until they clear accumulated losses on the balance sheet. They could restructure the balance sheet through the courts if they wanted but there will be some expense involved with that and it would be a distraction from the quest for a merger or acquisition. I'd like a dividend, too, but I accept it is unlikely until accumulated losses are cleared, which might be in a couple of years at the current rate of profitability.

The_Owl - I could be wrong but my understanding is that Zamano is unlikely to be at fault. They run a mobile text payments system. To blame them is like blaming Barclaycard for receiving dodgy goods you have ordered online. Barclaycard would be the one charging your account but somebody else would be ripping you off. We know credit cards do lots of good business and are regulated yet people still get ripped off by dodgy suppliers. I understand it is the same with Zamano's payment system. Lots of good work gets done but it's the dodgy content suppliers that draw the headlines. I stress I do not know this for certain but that is my understanding from having read some online forums. I do sympathise with you and hope you get your money back and that somebody gets fined for what has happened to you. (I can imagine that Zamano would be very unlikely to talk to you about being ripped off for legal reasons, even if they knew full well what had happened. I would just hope that they would cease taking more payments for the supplying company or companies that have provided the supposed "content".)

The following links might give you some information that might help you get your money back from Intrugo:

[bonio10000] 01/6/2016 08:56

I fail to see the logic on how a company operates not being relevant to its valuation.

They have previous as well.

[rndm355] 01/6/2016 01:15

They have been pretty clear that they are hoping to make an acquisition or merger so a dividend policy is not the priority.

I agree that the disclosures could be a lot more helpful to investors though - so I recommend calling the company for anyone who has or is contemplating a serious investment here. They were very generous with their time when I called them and I got through straight away.

[value hound] 31/5/2016 22:51

I agree - and just to reiterate my previous point as it seems to have been lost now; Wexboy didn't write about Zamano in his recent two long posts "The Great Irish Share Valuation Project" yet at one time I think he said it was his biggest holding and I think he reckoned to speak for 14% of shareholdings when requesting (via an open letter) that they pay a dividend.

So did he sell after they decided they were more of a "growth" stock!? :-) They didn't even make reference to any kind of intention to ever pay a divi with the finals - nor did they even explain why they had no plans to, despite increasing net cash by €1.7m during the year to end up with €6.3M at the end of the calendar year.

Just the increase in net cash would represent around 1.7 cents per share / equivalent to a yield of 6% even if they only gave us half the free cash flow generated! So what gives here; what's the incentive to hold and are they in it for their jobs / salaries / prestige - or to represent the interests of shareholders as the law demands? If it's the latter, I know I'd prefer a "normal" dividend.

[battlebus2] 31/5/2016 22:12

All this isn't really relevant to the current situation at Zamano, well not for my investment.

[the_owl] 31/5/2016 21:13

Oh, Aleman - comeon.

Are you saying they don't know who is abusing their services? ... so they don't do any verification on who is putting charges through them? ... specially if they've been burnt before.

They do know who it is - they've confirmed it to me!

The charge is definitely from Zamano (even if via another TP in this case MBB).

[the_owl] 31/5/2016 20:04

Guys, however you look at it, Zamano charged my phone bill. Who gave them the authoritry to do that? It wasn't me.

I am currently trying to obtain a) the purchase contract and b) the terms and conditions and c) the dates of the perceived subscription. I ask them 4 questions, they answer 1 - so its hard going!

Sure ITS POSSIBLE a 3rd party pop-up banner ad could contract with another 3rd party payment system, who then contract billing with Zamano, who contract with EE, who then charge me through my mobile phone bill - but its Zamano who took the money. They know who they are dealing with, and willingly allow it.
You should also know my initial query was with Intrugo who said 'its not us, your number is not on our system ...we've become aware recently of another company using the same text no, so are rather iritated by this...'

How the hell can I track back through layers and layers?!! For all I know the 3rd party could have given Zamano a wrong number (perhaps a '6' instead of a '0' or something).

Looking at various forums, this has been going on for a long time with these companies. I wouldn't mind if it was simply an expensive mistake because I accidentally clicked on a banner ad - but as I say I hardly use my phone at all for web, texts or calls, and never click on banner ads, nor do I download apps with these on.

FWIW - I note a vicar who never uses his phone, nor checks his bill unknowingly had £200 of charges with same company!!

I have no problem with premium rate numbers if they are a) used legally b) the terms are clear c) Purchaser is aware they will be billed.
In my case, none of these happened - I just got a £10+ charge on my account for what? I don't even know what services I have been provided with so that I could say 'yeah, ok well I've paid so may as well take advantage' ... so I've been charged for absolutely nothing. Very much doubt I'll get my money back - I note several people have contacted Zamano giving their name and address, but no cheuqe has been sent. Who know's they may have 'sold on' the address information to another Marketing company along with the phone number, so another 3rd party could then use the same method ??

Where is the regulator in all this!! It's 2016 ... not 1996!!

Regardless, I'd not personally invest in a company who includes this as an acceptable practise. I can easily afford it. Many more vulnerable types, teenagers perhaps cannot. Will they complain ... of course not!

[qut] 31/5/2016 17:23

I agree texts are probably the major means of communication. If I get a text, I always read it straight away, whereas emails, etc, sometimes go on the back-burner. How often does it happen that someone sends you a text to say they've emailed you??! Shows they think that all texts are bound to be read + more quickly than emails!

[value hound] 31/5/2016 07:26

I see Wexboy didn't write about Zamano in his recent two long posts "The Great Irish Share Valuation Project" yet at one time I think he said it was his biggest holding; did he sell after they didn't pay a dividend?

[rndm355] 31/5/2016 02:30

Owl, Zamano have had legal problems and received large fines but that was several years ago. The regulators looked at what was going on and insisted on some changes. You may think that they are due for more legal problems but given that people who regret signing up for premium texts tend to be angry and to complain, and the company's fairly long experience of dealing with them and with the law in this regard, their current position might well be watertight.

And yep it's true they have a diversified income stream, not just direct to consumer.

Look at the multiples attached to this share - it's priced as if earnings will collapse anyway. If earnings don't collapse, it's a huge bargain.

The CEO got a prestigious new job at a very large media company.

[rndm355] 19/5/2016 11:05

The problem with emails is that anybody can make as many fake/anonymous email addresses as they want. An SMS sent or received verifies a person's identity. SMS is also superior to apps because every phone automatically can send or receive SMS messages, no app download required. Doesn't matter whether you are Apple, Android, etc.

[aleman] 19/5/2016 09:44

I don't get many email updates. I would not want my email clogging up even more. I get too many as it is and can't always read them in a timely manner. I keep trying to convince businesses and insitutions not to send me any more! I have no problem with text updates. I'm not drowning in junk texts yet. I don't know if that is typical. Maybe I'm lucky. Given the a choice between the two, I'd choose texts in a second and opt for no emails unless absolutely necessary..

[pj 1] 19/5/2016 09:36

Thanks for the responses-ok, slightly different angle.

All DPD, TKMAX,AMAZON.John lEWIS, UK Mail and Hermes, Waitrose, all text AND email our delivery and communications.

If they were your own Business's (perhaps some are?)would you pay to communicate the same information twice? Or would you want to save costs?

Personally I receive and send far more emails than texts

I'm not trying to knock the Company at all, just part of my research.

[aleman] 19/5/2016 09:15

Text alerts for courier delivery times. Text alerts from schools as event reminders or for snow closures. Text alerts from car repair services to collect your vehicle. Text alerts from dentists as appointment reminders. Text alerts throughout my online mortgage application process at each stage of approval. Text alert systems that keep customers and employees informed are one of the most effective ways of maintaining contact with them . I get more texts than ever and a growing proportion are business/institutional ones, which is ZMNO's targetted growth area. It's a strongly growing sector. We could yet have text alerts for train or plane delays, delays on your usual route to work. blood test results, Formula One or yacht race updates. There is still a great deal of potential growth.

ZMNO is also targetting mobile payments through carrier billing. This is potentially very lucrative but has lots of competition from other copmanies offering similar carrier billing software and from different payments systems. ZMNO do have some useful contracts signed with Irish carriers in this regard but it is in its infancy. It could bloom or wither very quickly.

[battlebus2] 19/5/2016 08:52

I don't think SMS is dying anytime soon imv.

[rndm355] 19/5/2016 08:44

ZMNNO is cheap because it's a text message business, and everybody thinks text is a "dying technology".

[pj 1] 19/5/2016 08:34

How much of their business is by text message. Isn't that a dying technology? TIA PJ