Versarien Share Discussion Threads

[rogerthegrouch] 30/6/2020 21:57

“We may hear a positive outcome tomorrow regarding YG, but my assessment is we will not. There will be delays”

Sounds like you are hoping for this outcome to support your cantilever position?

“The share price is currently loaded with 90% hope value and the market will be unforgiving”

Are you telling us this so we all sell our shares?

“Ratchet mechanism will really affect PIs wealth if market sentiment startS to measure VRS on its trading performance”

We’re doomed, we’re all doomed

“merely to point out the investment calculation that a levelheaded investor should be making”

Translates to ...please sell your shares in the morning so I can buy the dip and cantilever back in.

It’s not binary in the slightest and good luck with any dip tomorrow. I think we had a taste today how shallow or non existent it will be. Scary times if your sitting on the sides with a ‘very significant’ amount of money.

[tim3416] 30/6/2020 21:51

I can assure you ridicule you are certainly not on the same page as holiday funds and cotswold sparky

[squire007] 30/6/2020 21:48

We are listed UK, so uk time one would assume, anyway its not happening just yet, so chill till it happens. And it will ...

[mavfav] 30/6/2020 21:47

Depends if you are a remainer as that would mean well keep changing the date till it suits us lol It's not that relevant to me as I don't worry about what I can't control Ridicule I do sometimes wonder if we are in the same library, let alone floor, section, row, shelf, book, chapter etc let alone page But I do like a chuckle I know nooothing

[grabster] 30/6/2020 21:39

Many thanks to various posters this evening, regarding China.

I have two minor points which I'm sure one or more of our posters will be able to answer.

1. Does "by 30 June" mean the day (today) ending at midnight UK-time? (2.3 hours remaining). (Which I presume is the case, as it was detailed in an rns to the UK stockmarket). Or does it mean midnight HongKong time? (per Versarien HK as the contract partner). (Already gone past midnight there - in fact went by in time for an rns after hours here if required)

2. The newly appointed Chairman - who I understand has worked with the company before now(?) would surely not have wanted his arrival made public days before a date such as 30 June if he was given any grounds to suspect imminent negative news re China.

[ridicule] 30/6/2020 21:28

Holiday funds 8 and Cotswold. I think we are all broadly on the same page. My point was to emphasise that a Failure of the 5% event, scheduled for today, to happen will be significant. This is because nothing else can happen in what is a quite complex model until the 15% investment stake is resolved.

I did not refer to the option for a £1 purchase for YG’s stake within the JV in my last post because it wasn’t relevant to the timescale implications that I was trying to highlight. I do have views on that clause and I do not think it is designed to be punitive. I think VRS are aware, as vice versa has picked up on, that there are many other investment options within China other than YG. Clearly the Chinese institutions wanted YG to be the vehicle, including BIGT and VRS will have gone along with this. The option to purchase that stake for a pound is to give Versarien the freedom to bring in another Chinese partner who can raise the money and is prepared to invest having shown the Chinese institutions that despite their best efforts YG could not deliver. In fact, if you listen carefully to Chris Leigh‘s comments during the investor meet the company session, he specifically says BVT will be the vehicle for China, regardless of who the stakeholders are. I do not think VRS have any intention of retaining 100% of the JV. They Will want to be able to buy the potential YG stake for a £1 so they can move it on to somebody who can produce the investment required

We may hear a positive outcome tomorrow regarding YG, but my assessment is we will not. There will be delays VRS will exercise their option once they have identified, if they not have done so already, a new potential investor stakeholder in the JV.



They need to come out with an RNS that clearly outlines the latest position because with a 77 million market The share price is currently loaded with 90% hope value and the market will be unforgiving unless they can see the new route forward or one of the long-standing collaborations starts to deliver large revenues.

I disagree with those that say this is all positive. Lanstead are now in the game and their 24 month long ratchet mechanism will really affect PIs wealth if market sentiment startS to measure VRS on its trading performance, rather than its prospective Unicorn status. We want China to move forward on schedule, despite my reservations over China. Or we need a large order from one of the collaborations.

VRS will not continue running on Hope given the amount of time they’ve already been doing that. This is not to question the ultimate destination, it is merely to point out the investment calculation that a levelheaded investor should be making

[woodpeckers] 30/6/2020 20:50

So lucky to have Iain Gray on board...contacts can be invaluable....

"The announcement also included a £15m government investment in GKN Aerospace’s new technology centre in Bristol, which is expected to open in 2020. The facility will focus on the development of next-generation, fuel-efficient aircraft, employing 300 engineers and collaborating with the UK research community.

Elsewhere in the aerospace ‘sector deal’ was £13.7m to support SMEs to commercialise technologies and a pledge to increase the number of women in aviation.

Professor Iain Gray, director of aerospace at Cranfield University and chairman of the UK Aerospace Research Consortium, called today’s announcements “an important step” to protect one of the crown jewels in UK industry."

From Dec 2018

[woodpeckers] 30/6/2020 20:34

"Going on to say “The Global Technology Centre will enable GKN Aerospace to create a world leading facility for research particularly in the areas of wing configuration and construction, meaning intellectual property, skills and knowledge is retained in the UK."

[woodpeckers] 30/6/2020 20:27

30June2020
GKN Aerospace joins Graphene@Manchester as Tier 1 partner

“Graphene has the ability to increase the life of products in-service and reduce cost, for example by reducing the need for platinum in fuel cells,” Russ added. “We look forward to working with the University and the local ecosystem to explore commercial applications that meet the growing demand for more sustainable, lighter-weight technology, with increased functionality.”

[tim3416] 30/6/2020 20:05

Keeps it interesting dave, it certainly keeps you coming back ;-)-NOTHING is straightforward with VRS-

[alchemy] 30/6/2020 19:57

It was a collation of things already announced worth £5 billion.I'm a huge Keynesian and fan of Roosevelt and his New Deal but I don't think we benefited from his Dudley Speech.Two sentences , I could write hundreds.

[davemac3] 30/6/2020 19:40

NOTHING is straightforward with VRS

[andymoore07] 30/6/2020 19:39

I missed Boris's speech, anything to do with upgrading the TFL signals in there?

[vice versa] 30/6/2020 19:29

Versarien must have credible options with other Chinese investors. Otherwise inserting the backstop was a massive bluff that may or may not galvanise our negotiating partners. Some of these are:- Jinan,Qingdao, Bo Guan & the 29% rejected offer entity. J.S. may have a few other ideas too. To enable negotiations to commence in earnest with these potential partners a clean break would have to be made with C.I.G.I.U.'s good auspices as facilitator. This is crucial to maintain good faith in China and, especially, solid relationships with C.I.G.I.U. and B.I.G.T. going forward. To not take the backstop option - if things are not concluded in time - would be to be playing fast and loose with the other potential partners' timelines and thus patience.

[jointer13] 30/6/2020 18:38

all coming together.

[jointer13] 30/6/2020 18:37

all positive for me as well cotswold.

re james stewart.

Mr Stewart is currently Managing Partner of Menlo Partners LLP, an investment and advisory company with a particular focus on technology companies operating in the UK and China. Prior to founding Menlo in 2013, he spent 25 years in the private equity sector, latterly as a Partner at ECI Partners LLP ("ECI"), one of the UK's longest established private equity fund managers, where he was involved in a wide range of investments. James joined ECI in 1996 having formerly spent time at Arthur Andersen & Co. (Management Consultancy Division), N M Rothschild & Co. Limited and as an Investment Director at Rothschild Ventures Limited.

Following Mr Stewart's appointment the Company's Board now comprises James Stewart (Non-executive Chairman), Neill Ricketts (CEO), Christopher Leigh (CFO), Susan Bowen (Non-executive Director) and Iain Gray (Non-executive Director).

Commenting on the appointment Neill Ricketts, CEO of Versarien, said: "We are delighted to welcome James to the Versarien board. He brings significant business and transaction experience to Versarien that will be particularly valuable as we progress our commercial partnerships and international expansion strategy.

"In particular James has considerable experience of doing business in Asia and a wide range of contacts that will assist Versarien. I look forward to working closely with him and the Group being able to utilise his skills and experience as the commercial adoption of our graphene and other 2D materials accelerates."

[cotswoldsparky] 30/6/2020 18:30

I have a slightly different take on the arrangement. Just gone back to have a more in depth look at the RNS from March and do a bit of digging in China again.

Firstly, the backstop.

“If YG fails to procure a definitive agreement for Versarien for the first Versarien Share Subscription due by 30 June 2020, Versarien shall be entitled to purchase from YG all its equity interest in BVT at the nominal price of RMB10 (approximately £1) and YG shall accept such purchase of its equity interest.”

Then the contractual arrangement.

“YG and VGHK will each subscribe to an increase in the share capital of BVT, in an amount of RMB1 million (approximately £121,000) each so that VGHK and YG shall each hold 50% of BVT's registered share capital. BVT will retain its name as Beijing Versarien Technology Co., Ltd ("BVT"). The capital contribution to BVT by YG shall be paid in cash instalments within one year according to the business needs of BVT.”

So, if YG hasn’t yet subscribed for shares in BVT, the backstop is moot. I presume that the people running YG are business savvy and will only make a cash subscription to BVT when they have put forward a proposal for investment and VRS has accepted it. So, as far as I see it, neither party have anything to gain or lose out of the arrangement. This clause is effectively irrelevant, but probably a contractual necessity to make the deal time-bounded. These dates can usually be changed by agreement of both parties.

Looking at company registration sites in China, it appears that VGHK still owns 100% of BVT. So there is nothing to buy out if the subscription fails. This backs up my theory that YG will only invest in BVT when VRS have accepted their proposed subscriber.



Most likely scenario, IMO, is that YG have made an introduction and due diligence is being carried out. In this case, they may already have an agreement in principle, or a conditional agreement, in which case I wouldn’t expect to hear anything until the acceptance process has completed.

I’m going by the ‘no news is good news’ theory about this, partly based on the research that has been done recently. There is clearly a lot going on in China + James Stewart joining. All positives for me.

As an aside, those looking for alternative translations of Versarien can add Weixin to the list

Quite a bit to consider there but the bottom line is YG don't have an equity interest in BVT so can't be bought out. 

[jointer13] 30/6/2020 18:14

it does'nt have to be agreed today (be nice if it was)there's always the possibility it just needs that little bit more time (you know how these things work)
but after today we have the option of using the backstop.

at the end of the day if it comes to it what's a little longer in something as big as this.

having said that it could drop anytime.

exciting times ahead.

[jointer13] 30/6/2020 17:48

ip and know how worth far more than the mc alone, imo by a long way.

dont forget the 'uniqueness.'

[alchemy] 30/6/2020 17:41

So the marcap is 77 million .Juncture is the word . It's worth 77 million at this juncture .At 8 32 tomorrow when some of the vectors have worked through it won't be 77million.How does China work with AECOM if "this" isn't agreed?One of a myriad questions.What is priced in that shouldn't be ?What is not priced in that should be?

[holidayfunds8] 30/6/2020 17:35

Hey Ridicule,

Below are the exact words from the 25March RNS, relating to the 'Backstop Arrangements':
"If YG fails to procure a definitive agreement for Versarien for the first Versarien Share Subscription due by 30 June 2020, Versarien shall be entitled to purchase from YG all its equity interest in BVT at the nominal price of RMB10 (approximately £1) and YG shall accept such purchase of its equity interest."

The key phrase to focus upon is "...Versarien shall be ENTITLED TO purchase..."

David

[tim3416] 30/6/2020 17:27

Lol, good point mav ;-)

[mavfav] 30/6/2020 17:25

In fact he's not bought back in yet so I got that wrong