Versarien Share Discussion Threads

[superg1] 07/12/2016 07:39

Cougar

I don't particularly want the herd here. A few others it seems had been keeping quiet about VRS. Having noted lack of posting or interest in the others in the sector it was obviously safe to do so.

Nano is an example, once they read cadmium free and saw DOW it went completely. Nano graphene (GNPs) appears which can go into 1000's more products than Qdots and no one blinks. Furiously defending the cadmium free claim over there and completely ignoring the huge advantage here.

It's not just about few layer by the condition of the few layer post production. Whatever VRS are doing they manage to get few layer in numbers, high purity and retaining very important properties. Then there are the factors of GO and RGO along with changing properties to get the best results if needed.

That ignores all the dross where companies are calling product graphene nano platelets when it's not. It's often graphite nano platelets and I'm guessing the name difference derives from the massive change in performance of few layer to multi layer in some aspects.

Technical grade lithium and EV grade lithium are separated by a fraction of a percent in purity and the value soars for EV grade.

Having got all the above right you then need dispersion etc.

Having got that then some GNPs work and others don't. I had conversation with someone recently and why some work and others don't hasn't quite been worked out yet. As far as I know VRS GNPS work for various uses, it could be down to the production method retaining key properties.

Hence we find a large OEM appears at speed buying £100k worth with no doubt more to come as that it seems was the 2nd batch and bigger than the first.

[cougar99] 06/12/2016 23:12

It's been hailed as the “miracle material” for years, yet graphene investments are just heating up...

[cougar99] 06/12/2016 23:09

supergy1 - thank you for continuing your stream of research.

As regards "If you took a popular share with a herd on it and .... " then if all does indeed to start to fall in to place for VRS during 2017 then we'll probably see the herd in to VRS.

Seems useful this Graphene stuff:

Fujitsu Develops World's First Gas Sensor to Apply a New Principle for Graphene Use

[superg1] 06/12/2016 20:29

Anley

See how such a simple question can lead me off down another research route. There is so much to consider and look at. Companies put it in news but few seem to read it, digest it and follow up on it.

So ignoring all else, IF they are signing up with Airbus at any point which hasn't really been a hot topic, then I'd rather be in wondering if that would happen rather than fighting over building a position against others if shares got tight after such an event.

The others are the OEM as yet unknown, Absolute engineering which looked very exciting to me, Bromley on the sports and probably the baseboard too. Then the 9 others which may include Dyesol re the solar panels and Evodental re the PEEK stuff. I'll have to try and work out who the other 7 are but they do mention blue chips and other OEMs.

But if you look at AAC and the mention of things moving quickly and expectation to mention customer product launches in the coming months.

AAC already have this lot as customers.

BMW, Ford, Honda, Jaguar, Landrover and Leyland.

British Gas, BT Telecom and EON

I'm ignoring the thermal side where GE and Thermacore were doing tests in the past.

Oh and the comment in recent news.

130 potential customers are currently testing our copper foam products as a result of our global distribution deal with Mouser Electronics Inc and we are seeing further orders, both from our distributors and some customers, thus demonstrating market interest.

Don't forget they turned down deals of 500,000 to 1 million units per month as the orders are too big too early on for them. They said that at the open day and the CEO stated that in an interview. I assume such deals would have amounted to around £10 mill to £30 mill per year. But it would be madness to spend a small fortune to set up the production line for the one customer to change their mind.

So 12 collaborations on the graphene side. Unknown amount of customers trialling their GNPS. A large OEM diving in at speed out of nowhere and as as yet unidentified. Then the bits about Airbus, CT, Victrex and PEEK are very interesting.

Such is the nature of a start up you either wait until things become embedded and well known with the risk reduced or you gamble based on the research and company comments.

If you took a popular share with a herd on it and someone whispered that an Airbus guy popped into their offices to ask if he could use the toilet then they would be going daft over it, screaming BUY BUY all over the place..

[superg1] 06/12/2016 19:53

I tried Airbus and start ups having spotted those bits and this popped up.

August 2016

[superg1] 06/12/2016 19:51

Just some bit I coming across in the search PEEK has already replaced some parts with Airbus



THis one isn't the peek I was looking for but it shows the intent of airbus and no way an I getting in that. It must involve lightweight composites



I did note this line in that

'Airbus made an initial $150 million funding commitment for its new venture capital unit, which is seeking out investments in disruptive technologies to speed up innovations in aerospace.'

Then a line in another report on the same topic

"However, Airbus is now investing heavily in startups"

[superg1] 06/12/2016 19:37

Anley

I think there is to be another open day coming over Carbide way. So you can visit them after the Airbus, Lockheed, Rolls Royce, Landrover, BMW, Nike, BASF and NASA deals have been signed. Should be plenty to talk about then.

[superg1] 06/12/2016 19:18

I'll start with Airbus as that's what kicked off this bit of posting. Airbus are a partner of the National graphene institute

June 2016

The CT Engineering collaboration and the message in the news.

Paul Chinnock, General Manager,CT Engineering Group UK, commented: "Our work with Versarien will allow us to develop a whole new generation of aerospace components with market leading material properties and performance levels. The unique combination of CT Engineering's position as a first tier supplier to Airbus Group specialising in advanced composite research and design, and Versarien's proprietary graphene technology, will rapidly move this venture forward and produce a range of innovative products that will disrupt the current aerospace component market."

4 months before that Iain Gray was appointed as a non exec director at Versarien.

Who is he?

"Iain has spent his executive career at the highest levels within the aerospace sector, initially with British Aerospace before becoming engineering director of Airbus UK."

He lists himself as MD for Airbus for 28 years.

The recent find by Serratia went on about Victrex PEEK which is what VRS have done trials on with great results.

Than that comment which showed Airbus Victrex and Versarien in the same article.

Airbus Group Innovations highlighted its advances in addressing recyclability and process reliability through its new ThermoMELT process, Versarien Advanced Composites presented its work with CALM on innovative new Graphene-PAEK nanocomposites, Indmatec, pioneers of extrusion deposition printers for PEEK, discussed its equipment manufacturing developments and CALM gave an update on recent research projects funded by EPSRC, Innovate UK and DSTL, demonstrating the rapidly growing knowledge now available about both materials and processes.

Note Iain Gray is the ex chief exec of Innovate UK. DSTL is the Defence Science and Technology Laboratory.

The if you look at the pdf I posted

storage.aicod.it/portale/eurocoating/file/ESAM-HPP_-_agenda_-_200716-2-1.pdf

Conference on European Strategy for Additive Manufacture with High
Performance Polymers

The presentation of a group together (Sept 7th) are by Airbus, Victrex and Versarien.

recent interims

Significant advances made in the graphene division with pivotal collaborations formed to develop and commercialise graphene enhanced products in targeted markets including:

o sports equipment in collaboration with Bromley Technologies

o 3D printing industry in collaboration with Absolute Engineering

o aerospace industry in collaboration with CT Engineering

o a further nine collaborations with other partners


"We have established collaborations with a number of partners and look forward to announcing graphene enhanced products over the coming months as they are launched by our customers."

So it seems obvious that VRS are very well connected with Victrex, CT and Airbus.

Having picked through the VRS investor day bits as in the last post this lne has caught my attention

Efficiency of melting of nanocomposites increased by graphene.

Now I'm sure I just read something like that today on the PEEK/Victrex or Airbus similar topics so I'm going to hunt for that now.

[superg1] 06/12/2016 18:37

The list they out in presentations

Automotive
Aerospace
Marine
Light-weighting
Strengthening
Sensing/Smart components
Applications for developments
Polyester
Polyurethane
Elastomers
Coatings

And under market pressure IE demand

Automotive
Aerospace
Marine
High Performance Sports goods
Defence
Luxury Consumer goods

Under examples of work they state

PEEK 150 graphene reinforced
➢ Carbon Fibre Composite
➢ Others to follow Silicone, Nylon, ABS, Rubbers, glass and Metallics.

Taking collaborations off the top of my head only tow in the list are obviously mentioned in news. Airbus and Bromley for sports.

Then this list of observations

Graphene incorporated into powders by
standard mixing methods
Mechanical properties of films enhanced
by low graphene loadings
Efficiency of melting of nanocomposites
increased by graphene

Then this bit for carbon fibre

Improved performance
Better resin/fibre adhesion
Blunt crack propagation
Enhance thermal dissipation
Induced electrical conductivity

[superg1] 06/12/2016 18:26

Before I mention the potential and current customers I noted a newish arrival producing graphene. They said their graphene is probably the best in the world. They state their claim after independent testing in Asia against numerous other had them coming out top in all categories and wait for it the HIGHEST purity too at 55%.

55% purity???

Oh well they must obviously left all the players over 55% missed the 98% plus guys like VRS.

[anley] 06/12/2016 18:13

A good Government article and I notice that there is quite a wage bill to pay each month so hence my question as to customers and demand = production requirements.

It is all starting to fit together and next year I will visit the factory to see for myself just what it can be done to say get to a T/O which makes it about £2m per annum profit (no tax as VRS has sufficient tax losses to cover my figure).

[luckyorange] 06/12/2016 17:54

www.gov.uk/government/case-studies/versarien-pre-revenue-to-5-million-in-3-years

[superg1] 06/12/2016 16:18

As you asked I'll pop back with the known list later.

But as they said recently they will announce the launch of products with partners in the coming months, so yes it is leading to orders as in recent news. We don't know what some are but we do know the OEM asked for £100k+ of GNPs with possibly quite a bit more to come on just that customer.

That's why I'm in Anley, I can see it and it's been said enough times.

Before I list it are you a Monty python fan re "What have the Romans ever done for us"

[luckyorange] 06/12/2016 16:14

Patience is the name of the game anley, 100k is a nice (big for graphene) start, they have lots of customers with aac, vrs and I suspect Total Carbide, they are on their way.

[anley] 06/12/2016 14:36

So SUPERG1 does or is this leading to VRS getting orders or is it demonstrating how big the market is and its potential?

Customers is what is needed @ VRS.............

[theklf] 06/12/2016 14:08

Seems to be definite trend here lots of minds being concentrated

hxxp://www.electronicsweekly.com/news/business/surrey-university-develops-super-supercapacitor-2016-12/

[superg1] 06/12/2016 13:54

Aha

An event back in September that led to the article

storage.aicod.it/portale/eurocoating/file/ESAM-HPP_-_agenda_-_200716-2-1.pdf

Conference on European Strategy for Additive Manufacture with High
Performance Polymers
7-8 September 2016
Innovation Centre, University of Exeter

7th

Only 4 presenting. The univiversity, Airbus, Victrex and Versarien talking about graphene PEEK composites

[superg1] 06/12/2016 13:47

Serratia been shopping but now back and it didn't take long to find something re PEEK and VRS.

:-)

Victrex + Airbus + Versarien

Airbus Group Innovations highlighted its advances in addressing recyclability and process reliability through its new ThermoMELT process, Versarien Advanced Composites presented its work with CALM on innovative new Graphene-PAEK nanocomposites, Indmatec, pioneers of extrusion deposition printers for PEEK, discussed its equipment manufacturing developments and CALM gave an update on recent research projects funded by EPSRC, Innovate UK and DSTL, demonstrating the rapidly growing knowledge now available about both materials and processes.



Things going on that we are unaware of.

[luckyorange] 06/12/2016 13:02

Nothing happening here, move along.

[superg1] 06/12/2016 10:18

Just as a reminder re VRS and PEEK. BTW GNP XT is the few layer version of GNPs

[serratia] 06/12/2016 10:03

VRS are working on enhancing the PEEK polymer of Victrex. From todays Victrex results -

During the year we secured pre-qualification for our PEEK/composites Loaded Bracket programme, which blends different grades of PEEK with carbon fibre into a unique and IP protectable application. This complements and builds on existing applications in Aerospace, such as Unloaded Brackets and our PEEK film in Thermal Acoustic Blankets. Other developments include material for brackets programmes with COMAC in China, supporting their ARJ21 regional jet.

In Automotive, we continue to see further penetration of our core applications in ABS braking systems, transmission applications and other areas. Our Gears programme reflects the demand for lower noise, vibration and harshness (NVH), where PEEK can offer a 50% performance benefit compared to metal gears, as well as the trend for fuel efficiency and light-weighting. We now have multiple prototyping orders and are also engaged in discussions around other applications, including those "under the hood", whilst we continue to explore the opportunity in 'e-motors'.

[superg1] 06/12/2016 09:23

BTW

Doing the maths. The 100g per day across the products was an 8 hour 5 day week system.

They now have double the capacity on kit.

So if an order needed filling quickly the max they could go 24/7 would be 8 fold of the original rate.

Upscale via another means adds in a further multiplier. On paper that would be 4 fold of individual aspects and that alone 24/7 (again on paper) would be 12 fold increase on the original levels. So an upscale on that max rate would take it to 20 fold combined. So it all depends on what orders you get and the method of delivery to meet the order.

As I say for upscale it's a game of maths. You either asked the questions on investor day or not and as stated some things are not for a public web page.

[superg1] 06/12/2016 08:59

Apparently someone has been told very recently there is no placing in play at this time but as said at the investor open day but if an opportunity or need like expansion due to orders etc then they may do.

No change there which has been said many times but seems to be a repeat question on here and other BBs.

We could ask everyday of course and get the same answer.

[superg1] 05/12/2016 19:53

Never heard of it although it seems it's everywhere

Just did a quick search with graphene to see what popped up.

from a patent

Fluoropolymers are employed in a wide variety of applications. Examples include hydrophobic coatings for anti-contamination, anti-sticking and self-cleaning surfaces; chemically resistant and/or thermally stabile plastic or elastic components in consumer and industrial applications; lubricating and/or protective coatings; xerographic components, such as outer release coatings for fusers, as well as a variety of other applications. Fluoropolymer materials, including fluoroplastics such as polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) and perfluoroalkoxy polymer resin (PFA) are often applied in the form of dispersed particles.

Another nano-particle material that has recently garnered significant attention is graphene. Graphene is often described as a two dimensional sheet of sp2 bonded carbon atoms arranged in a hexagonal lattice. Due to unique structural features, graphene possesses superior thermal and electrical conductivity, as well as high mechanical strength. Incorporation of graphene into fluoroplastics can improve thermal and/or electrical conductivity and mechanical robustness of the resulting composite material. Both individual graphene sheets and graphene platelets, which include a plurality of graphene layers, show enormous potential as fillers for composite applications.

However, it is challenging to make uniform, well-dispersed graphene/fluoroplastic dispersions. Moreover, the ability to coat the dispersions is dependent on the coating process used. Phase separations and graphene agglomerations are often associated with graphene particle/fluoropolymer particle dispersions.