Tp Icap Share Discussion Threads

[value hound] 29/12/2024 17:03

TCAP recommended by by Gervais Williams, Fund Manager, The Diverse Income Trust plc, FWIW:

“In our view, TP ICAP, is a leading provider of liquidity to the global credit markets, at a time when global markets are highly volatile. Furthermore, as it networks its Liquidnet platform with the global banks in 2025, we believe its market position should further improve. Alongside, they are looking to bring in a new investor into their Parameter data subsidiary. In short, we believe all this should help drive up their cash generation. Not at all bad for a company standing on a current dividend yield of 5.6%. As with AO, in our view, the strong companies should get stronger, and TP ICAP appears very well placed for 2025."

hxxps://ukinvestormagazine.co.uk/top-stock-picks-for-2025-by-investment-trust-fund-managers/?mc_cid=6d17d3b2b4&mc_eid=fe56ffb715

[jeffian] 30/11/2024 23:11

Sorry, tbow, but I don't think I can help you. I'm a bit OCD and normally I keep absolutely detailed records of historic sharedealing for just this reason but in this case all my shares were either in ISA or SIPP so CGT never came into it and I'm struggling to rebuild the history.

Of course, "original costs" depends which shares you bought, when and what your acquisition cost was at that time. In my case, I first bought ICAP shares in 2012 (in 2 tranches that year). In 2015, ICAP sold part of its broking business in exchange for shares in Tullet (I assume what is now TCAP?) and the residual business changed its name to NEX. NEX was bought by CME in 2018 for 500p/share in cash and .0444 CME share for each NEX share.

Frankly, it's a nightmare trying to sort out the CGT in these cases and I would be amazed if anyone ever got it right or HMRC was any the wiser!

[tbow112] 30/11/2024 17:27

Jeffian, do you happen to have any information about the original costs of TCAP and CME for CG tax purposes ?

[jeffian] 27/11/2024 18:43

I note that TCAP have clawed their way back to where the shares were at the time of the split. As my corresponding CME shares are up 130%, I'm happy with that.

[leedsu36] 05/11/2024 15:11

What Does The Institutional Ownership Tell Us About TP ICAP Group?
Institutional investors commonly compare their own returns to the returns of a commonly followed index. So they generally do consider buying larger companies that are included in the relevant benchmark index.

We can see that TP ICAP Group does have institutional investors; and they hold a good portion of the company's stock. This can indicate that the company has a certain degree of credibility in the investment community. However, it is best to be wary of relying on the supposed validation that comes with institutional investors. They too, get it wrong sometimes. When multiple institutions own a stock, there's always a risk that they are in a 'crowded trade'. When such a trade goes wrong, multiple parties may compete to sell stock fast. This risk is higher in a company without a history of growth. You can see TP ICAP Group's historic earnings and revenue below, but keep in mind there's always more to the story.
Since institutional investors own more than half the issued stock, the board will likely have to pay attention to their preferences. We note that hedge funds don't have a meaningful investment in TP ICAP Group. Looking at our data, we can see that the largest shareholder is Liontrust Asset Management PLC with 10% of shares outstanding. The Vanguard Group, Inc. is the second largest shareholder owning 5.5% of common stock, and Columbia Management Investment Advisers, LLC holds about 5.4% of the company stock.

On further inspection, we found that more than half the company's shares are owned by the top 10 shareholders, suggesting that the interests of the larger shareholders are balanced out to an extent by the smaller ones.

Researching institutional ownership is a good way to gauge and filter a stock's expected performance. The same can be achieved by studying analyst sentiments. Quite a few analysts cover the stock, so you could look into forecast growth quite easily.

Insider Ownership Of TP ICAP Group
The definition of an insider can differ slightly between different countries, but members of the board of directors always count. Management ultimately answers to the board. However, it is not uncommon for managers to be executive board members, especially if they are a founder or the CEO.

I generally consider insider ownership to be a good thing. However, on some occasions it makes it more difficult for other shareholders to hold the board accountable for decisions.

Our information suggests that TP ICAP Group PLC insiders own under 1% of the company. Keep in mind that it's a big company, and the insiders own UK£3.6m worth of shares. The absolute value might be more important than the proportional share. Arguably, recent buying and selling is just as important to consider.

General Public Ownership
The general public-- including retail investors -- own 36% stake in the company, and hence can't easily be ignored. While this group can't necessarily call the shots, it can certainly have a real influence on how the company is run.

[leedsu36] 05/11/2024 14:53

FTSE 250 finance firm TP Icap is facing pressure from some of its biggest shareholders to break itself up by selling off its high margin data division.

Several of the firm’s most important institutional investors have begun talks about pressing TP Icap into exploring a formal sale of its Parameta analytics business, Sky News reported.

The investors believe an auction could bring in as much £1.5bn, a sum more than the market capitalization of the entire TP Icap group.

Earlier this year, US activist fund Phase 2 Partners called on TP Icap to consider a plan to sell itself after raising concerns about the world’s biggest interdealer’s “disastrous share price decline”.

It is unclear whether company chairman Richard Berliand and chief executive Nicolas Breteau are prepared to bow to investors’ demands.

TP Icap raised around £315m last year for the $700m (£653m) acquisition of New York fintech firm Liquidnet.

The firm traces its roots back to the formation of foreign exchange broker Tullett & Riley in 1971, which later merged with a raft of London’s largest brokers in the early 2000s.

[leedsu36] 05/11/2024 14:52

Inter-dealer broker TP ICAP has reported a ten per cent bump in revenue for the three months ended 30 September 2024.

Overall group revenue for the period was £557m. Rates, its largest and most profitable trading division, reported a 14 per cent jump in reported currency terms.

Liquidnet, the firm’s institutional investment network, reported a 28 per cent jump in revenue for the quarter. Its global broking revenue grew nine per cent.

Over the first nine months of the year, overall group revenue grew five per cent to £1.7bn.

TP ICAP considers breakup
Earlier this year, TP ICAP said it was considering a US listing for a minority stake in its data and analytics arm, Parameta Solutions, as it continued to consider spinning out part of the business.

The group has faced shareholder pressure to offload Parameta as part of calls to improve its share price. Parameta has outpaced TP ICAP’s flagship broking business in revenue growth.

Today, the group said it was “progressing strategic options” regarding Parameta, which might include the minority listing, but it said there was “no certainty” about either a listing or its location.

The firm added that Parameta’s revenue grew by nine per cent over the last quarter.
Peel Hunt analysts Stuart Duncan and Robert Sage noted the FTSE 250 firm reported “good growth across all divisions” for the nine months ended 30 September 2024.

“We remain of the view that the strategic options being considered for Parameta are a positive step to unlocking the undoubted value of this division,” said the Peel Hunt analysts.

“Our SOTP [sum-of-the-parts] valuation model continues to suggest that a target price of 280p could prove conservative.”

Although TP ICAP’s management warned that currency movement remains volatile and could impact its full-year profit, it said it was “comfortable” with market expectations and did not change guidance.

Shares in TP ICAP have returned 24.1 per cent, including dividends, so far this year.

[kenmitch] 05/11/2024 13:53

I’ve just looked at my post 794 here to see how confident I was then buying at 108p in July 2022 at what turned out to be by luck THE multi year low. It wasn’t a confident buy then, but the big plus case was simply a quality share (I.e not blue sky hope rubbish) at multi year lows is so often a very good buy opportunity. The dividend is likely to be held and that’s a 14% yield for anyone else who bought near the all time low. TCAP remains a very good lockaway and a bid can’t be ruled out.

[martinmc123] 05/11/2024 11:32

4*
TP Icap issued a strong Q3 and 9m ytd trading update this morning. The Group reported record Group revenue in the third quarter of £557m, up 10% (+9% in reported currency). Global Broking revenue increased 9% (+8%), maintaining the good second quarter momentum with rates +14% leading the way. Liquidnet delivered a very strong third quarter, with revenue up 28%. Finally Parameta Solutions, our market-leading over-the-counter (OTC) data business, grew 9%. So strength was broad based and solid. 9-month ytd performance was also solid, although not quite as strong with Group revenue of £1,701m, up 5%...from WealthOracle

wealthoracle.co.uk/detailed-result-full/TCAP/945

[xamf] 05/11/2024 07:21

Excellent 3Q update.

[japatrick] 25/9/2024 11:10

said prefer other names [looking forward] you melt and, yes, the past has some value as a proxy..astonishing as that may sound

[sick of it] 20/9/2024 17:28

Keep looking backwards when the previous poster told you to to look forwards. Astonishing

[japatrick] 19/9/2024 10:59

agree with ken mitch - dont stay invested and moan but also dont buy a dip in the expectation this co. management team can sustain a long(er) term share price improvement. prefer the UK spread betters, BGC.GFI or Marex for way they are run and macro sector exposure - look at their performance over 5 yr v TulletPrebonIcap

[brucie5] 12/8/2024 11:43

Agree with the above. There are surely several ways to a successful investor - and several more by which to fail.
Value/recovery should come into the first category; though care needs to be taken not to fall into a classic value trap. Recent markets have offered countless opportunities for both.
I think this recovery has further to go: the chart suggest return to £4 level and of course we are paid to wait.

[kenmitch] 12/8/2024 09:48

JaPatrick

Criticism of PAST TCAP Management decisions, including over paying for Liquidnet is valid. And they are among the reasons the share price fell 75% from £4 to £1.

But surely a key to successful investing is to realise this key fact; stock markets look ahead and not back? So at just £1 investors had well and truly priced in the bad news. That was the time to buy and that’s when I bought and posted that I had at the time. And the share is now up 120%. And the dividend yield at £1 is over 14% and likely to rise further.

The mistake was when investors continued to hold TCAP despite thinking things like “they’ve way overpaid for Liquidnet.” If investors thought that they should have sold then and either moved on for good or looked to buy again when the relentless share price fall showed signs of reversing and on the first hints of better trading.

So many small investors stay invested and then moan like mad on bulletin boards about hopeless Management etc etc. why? Just move on to a share where that’s not the case and where you have a far higher chance of doing well. Why hold shares you hate?

But THE key points are to take on board that stock markets look forward and not back and that the time to buy is when bad news is priced in but recovery after bad news and bad decisions isn’t. And an ideal time to buy across the board is after big market falls when as with an individual share, most of the bad news has been priced in, but recovery hasn’t.

[sick of it] 11/8/2024 21:55

The company is doing well
The negative poster knows this
Perhaps you should have bought at £1.
Perhaps you regret not buying at £2?
Parameta alone is worth about £2 so maybe just accept that you got it wrong here?!!!

[japatrick] 11/8/2024 18:35

true re the buy opportunity and timing. this CEO took the shares to £1 however by wasting shareholders money on acquiring Liquidnet and letting all the talent leave the business who didn't back that abomination of a deal

[kenmitch] 09/8/2024 19:19

JaPatrick

The share price has doubled in 2 years. That reflects the turnaround. And that incredible dip to just over £1 was a great buy opportunity. Dividend yield at that buy price is over 14%.

[japatrick] 09/8/2024 19:16

Liquidnet looks like progress when tullet business sneaked in there - look at the people who left who improved their tech for traders - what's left good for going to lunch and not much else

[japatrick] 09/8/2024 19:15

prefer bgc/gfi and marex - tullet management used to be good - current mgt weak

[japatrick] 09/8/2024 19:14

shares down 10% IN 5 YEARS - turnaround ?

[sick of it] 07/8/2024 17:56

Grantsu - I tend to agree
Since Breteau took over they've done excellent work to turn the company around, cut costs and electrify. Potential is huge and is clearly being realized and executed by correct management decisions. Even the Jersey relocation was important piece in achieving that. There is absolutely too much focus on parameta when lot of the business is now performing well. Even liquidnet contributing now. Whilst we wait for higher share price - there is the dividend and the buybacks so nicely ticking along. And like another excellent poster pointed out earlier - H2 seems somewhat in the bag already. And the current CEO does have skin in the game. If I'm correct his stake might be worth 3.5M

[ggrantsu] 07/8/2024 15:36

personally feel that far too many people focus on Parameta when it comes to ICAP...they miss the bigger picture in terms of what a good business broking is. It has its pressures...but its an incredibly high barrier to entry business which should structurally benefit massively over the next decade as the world enters a new era of monetary policy. you have to say hats off to mgmt and the work they have done over the last two years...simply astounding effort in terms of cash generation, cost cutting and getting parameta into shape.

brokers are targetting roughly 3 quid on icap - this is a share where i genuinely believe 4-5 quid is possible. the broking business merits a decent multiple in and of itself if it can electrify successfully. liquidnet has huge potential...and actually so far, mgmt are turning it around (albeit slowly).

cash generation and yield second to none.