Norseman Gold Share Discussion Threads

[orado] 08/10/2012 09:27

ohisay

Agree, surely nobody takes any notice of him or his opinions.

[ohisay] 07/10/2012 22:29

Well it was a TW tip multiple times on the way down so fear the worst.
Can there be a less respected man in the UK - if I was him I'd be ashamed to show my face in public.
And yet he's as arrogant as ever.

[elban] 07/10/2012 22:12

They will wipe shareholders out.

Why - because they can.

Tulla have two choices now that they have taken on all of the risk:
(1) share the potential profits with other shareholders
OR
(2) keep all the potential profits for themselves.

With all the money they have ploughed in and the new extra risk - I would myself want to take option 2.

Ultimately, this is reasonable behaviour from them. They were shafted by the previous management - no way did this turn out as they expected. So we can be reasonably confident that they were deceived. [As were the rest of us.]

[porsche911sse] 07/10/2012 18:52

Maloney is a clever man who would never have gotten blindly involved or be as rich as he is by being stupid!This company is still worth 20 pence a share solely for its assets!I think NGL had problems with staff and weather but i think the chinese and maloney will make a success of norseman and we shall see a return to the 60 pence that really was not that long ago!!

[atlantic57] 07/10/2012 16:00

Noira you give good balanced posts.I want ngl to succeed i will loose a lot of money if they go under,

I agree with you completely that Tulla could have walked away.
However i am not convinced that they understand the task facing them.
Tw has been tipping these heavily from 37p down.

i very much hope that i am wrong.

[noirua] 07/10/2012 14:06

jbilt2004, Tom W has commented on his tip of NGL, see 'flashing' link above.

atlantic57, Tulla could have walked away from the NGL loan and not paid the $25m so they have to reckon there is something in NGL, or coming NGL's way, otherwise they lose the lot.
Fair enough, as you infer, Tulla had to pay or NGL was also in liquidation with Norseman Limited and the Chinese buying 9.6% of NGL forced their hands -- unless that was agreed in August. It is said the Chinese have not got approval for the purchase though that is not clear.
Tulla are paying the running costs of the Norseman mines to the receivers and appear to have a full understanding and Knowledge both of the mines value and how much a bidder is likely to pay; this cant be less than $25m plus a bit on top, say $28m total.

[atlantic57] 05/10/2012 16:39

I think ordinary shareholders should realistically expect nil!

Tulla have been unable to grasp the Engineering issues and resolve them.
This is they key issue.

If you have a creditor demanding repayment the steps they have taken are sensible.
I guess will the pain be shared round equally.

[noirua] 05/10/2012 10:18

Yes ad1967mc, I think you're right about hedging their bets. They, Tulla, may be hoping that NGL can hold on to about 20% of Norseman Limited more as an investment.
[note that Themac bought their copper mine from ECR AIM:ECR but left them with cash and 19% of Themac shares with an option to increase to 21%. I retain confidence in Tulla Group as they made AU$650m on the sale of the Aussie Mac Group against the odds many years before].

Thinking more about this and Tulla's $25m loan book with NGL, they must still see NGL getting a lot of cash and a stake in the new Norseman Limited.

[ad1967mc] 05/10/2012 10:05

Supposedly everything still rides on North Royal. Tulla think that they've identified the reasons for its massive under performance. It's possible that it could still deliver some decent cashflow, but clearly they're hedging their bets with the administration process. However it will be another couple of months before shareholders find out. Personally I'm skeptical.

[noirua] 05/10/2012 09:52

Tulla have a 67% interest in Themac Resources of Canada TSX:MAC and it looks a fair bet that Norseman are going to go the same way as Themac. Whether NGL end up with a stake in the new Norseman Limited is known only by Tulla Group.

Themac Resources:

[noirua] 05/10/2012 00:09

What is not known is whether the iron ore interests at Norseman are included in the sale of Norseman Limited. I suspect they have to be and should add to the interest of the patient Chinese.
NGL's website says that a lot of drilling has been undertaken making the drilling and assessments very low cost.

It is possible that sealed bids above a certain figure will be accepted by the administrators for Norseman Limited. Contrary to others I think the offers will surprise on the high-side.
The market valuation including loan was A$58m at 4.1c a share. I'm looking for a bid closer to A$75m (6.1c - 3.85p) and maybe a lot higher with the iron ore interest.

[kibes] 04/10/2012 08:53

5.2p a share? That is a dream. This company needs a lot more cash injected to get anywhere, although Tulla and the Chinese may be willing to do that they are certainly not going to start handing out money to other shareholders. A massive and totally dilutive rights issue at say 0.5p is all that is needed to wipe small shareholders out of existence in due course.

[noirua] 04/10/2012 08:38

The basics on all this is how much is obtained from the sale of Norseman Gold Limited that has no debts.
At the close in London NGL was worth a market cap of £27.8m and now has a loan book of AU$25m (£16.3).

What will happen to past losses of Norseman Gold PLC that are booked to the company in the UK? I haven't worked out how much this clocks up at: But could be used against future profits of the company.

It seems this will not be lost on Tulla and they may have ideas going forward.

[noirua] 03/10/2012 21:22

The administration system works differently in Australia, especially for mining companies. Each State has its own laws and in South Australia, Victoria, Tasmania and NSW, all gold remains the property of the crown under administration.

One of the more famous fairly recent cases of a company going into administration was Sons of Gwalia: Sons of Gwalia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[bam bam rubble] 03/10/2012 18:35

Barry Cahill's priority was to make sure his nest was well feathered through sky-high remuneration packages. He acquired tremendous wealth by promoting a worthless asset (a liability in fact). A fantastic entrepreneur and woeful businessman.

[noirua] 03/10/2012 16:56

I suppose the fact that Tulla are paying the administrators must point strongly to a plan 'B' which must have been there from the earliest days of their involvement.

The Chinese, Zhaojin Limited, must also have recognised or have been told of the plan 'B' outcome.

$25m seems a satisfactory outcome for Red Kite, and Tulla would not have paid anything for the debt if Norseman Gold Limited and Norseman Gold PLC were worthless.

So, Zhaojin and Tulla must be in this for one thing 'GOLD'. That a Chinese consortium and Tulla or Zhaojin and Tulla, buy the Norseman Ltd mine from the administrators at a very good price indeed. Thus paying back the loan to Tulla $25m and a sum large enough to satisfy all the shareholders of Norseman PLC.

The sum paid would have to be in the region of $115 million though Tulla and Zhaojin would be paying themselves to some extent. An offer of about 8c (5.2p) a share should satisfy shell shocked holders of Norseman Gold PLC.

All the above is guesswork of course,

[howesp] 03/10/2012 16:31

How does the management and Board of this disastrous company survive? It seems to be one bad thing after another. Surely there is someone around in Australia who can get some gold mined without all these problems!

[richgit] 03/10/2012 15:47

I didn`t invest much in NLG and was prepared to sit with it for
the long haul for the percentage chances it could come right.

I was expecting a debt consolidation,yet not in this format,though
in some ways it clears the road for another format(hopefully)

Considering how much money was spent by the previous Management
I guess Maloney didn`t expect to be hit immediately by such safety issues
with Harlequin, and the worst scenario at this point, that the mill has been
closed due to mechanical and maintenance problems, resulting in no
gold being produced. Talk about a kick in the nuts !!

At least the issues at Northern Royal are now known and can
presumably be dealt with, yet they must have to consider getting
Harlequin back into operation, and how they can eventually surmount
the costs of doing so.

Maloney now has even more reasons to get this right,and We can but hope-
Zhaojin were aware of all the issues when they were at least prepared to take
a stake- and now remain looking on and being updated.

With so much Gold at stake it`s not unreasonable to think they are,yet We and Maloney
will be hoping things can improve sufficiently for them to become an
investor as opposed to looking to take out an- up for sale- bargain.

With the future for Gold prices looking fairly reliable and unrelenting demand
from the Chinese etc ,at least the percentages for Norseman remain in favour,that all they have to do is get Gold out at profit.

It has been done before,though quite obviously not since,yet there is always
someone with the Financial Clout and expertise that will believe they can,and moreso "if" Gold reaches certain levels.


It was going to be a long haul-yet now somewhat boring until we get
any updates.

[atlantic57] 03/10/2012 10:15

Kibes agree your comments !

noirua agree your comments !

The fundamental question is whether they have the ability to get the production up to say 70 000 ounces per annum and at a cost of say 1000 dollars.

Thus far the answer seems to be that successive management teams are not able to do this.i am frankly astonished that they have been able to raise huge amounts of money and then just a few weeks later realize that they have completely misunderstood the technical issues.

[skidaddle] 03/10/2012 09:41

The list of "contributing factors" apart from the weather, look like a saboteurs to do list.