Legal & General Share Discussion Threads

[gbh2] 04/4/2024 10:11

Start of run up to ex divi date, hopefully.

[tuftymatt] 04/4/2024 10:07

I think it's just part of the risk on risk off flow we have seen this week.

Follow the momentum / buy the dips is what I am doing with quality holdings such as LGEN.

Good luck all 👍🏻

[cwa1] 04/4/2024 09:43

Strangely pleasant start to the day. That makes me suspicious :-) What have we done to deserve a 2% filip this morning?

[pierre oreilly] 04/4/2024 09:36

Hidden charges are things like trading commissions. We pay a fixed fiver for our deals, some fund managers still pay the old traditional 1.65% (obviously to the brokerage arm of their company). Then add churn to maximise the number of 1.65%s. I mean, wouldn't you get together with an old Oxford mate in the Lamb and arrange to swap 25m worth of glaxo and bt, and agree to swap them back in a couple of months time to get back to the status quo? That's 1,650,000 ackers out of the funds into the management company and probably a couple of 10 grand bonuses to the guys who executed it. All invisible.

Those Porsches don't appear from nowhere.

The only product I've had was an endowment mortgage forced upon me as a condition of the size of the mortgage I wanted. Reading the explicit charges in the small print they even took something like 25p per month as a 'trust fee' (or something similarly vaguely named). Indicated maturity value something like 250k in 25 years, actual payout 80k (I expected something like that to happen, so no surprise. Mortgage paid off donkeys years before).

[gbh2] 04/4/2024 08:29

I've yet to hear of an investment company that's made a profit for a investor, over forty year period.

[zac0_4] 03/4/2024 22:23

PO ". . . Do you sell pensions by any chance? . . ."

Absolutely not! That did make me smile, though!!

The 2.9% figure I quoted earlier is based on the following: an initial contribution of £5k pa which is increased each year by 2.5%; an annual investment growth rate of 7.25%; an annual management fee of 0.25%.

Over a 40 year working life the above would produce a pension pot of £1.5m and you would have paid costs of £45k. That is 2.9%

With regards to fund charges, I recognise that I'm unlikely to produce a return in excess of the market over the longterm. On that basis I'm happy to pay a small fee of around 0.15% for a tracker fund and more than happy to pay a fund manager up to 1.00% for a consistent market beating performance.

[lippy4] 03/4/2024 20:59

the pension adviser also takes his ongoing cut and if you put more money in they get a cut once again..

[bareknee] 03/4/2024 20:40

Pierre, 50/50 is probably true for old pensions with high charges but it's not as bad as that for most people taking out low-cost modern pensions.

The principle of what you're saying is correct though. Even if a pension provider is charging 0.5% as an annual charge to run your pension and also commission on any buys and sells you're making it's easy to rack up total annual charges of between 1 and 1.5%. You'll still have some costs if you DIY though.

gives some simple examples of how charges can severly reduce your pot.

[rongetsrich] 03/4/2024 19:34

With no reference your 'facts' are pretty worthless. Try and find them for us.

[pierre oreilly] 03/4/2024 19:31

There was a study a couple of years ago which concluded the roughly 50/50 - something I had suspected for many years. No reference I'm afraid. It was the total charges, not just the charges they volunteer. They probably worked on a typical pension plan.I thought this 50/50 was well known these days. If you think they only take 2.5% or whatever over 25 or 40 years then you and I must have totally different perspectives. Do you sell pensions by any chance?

[zac0_4] 03/4/2024 18:01

PO - " . . . the spoils are divided 50/50 . . ."

Perhaps you could clarify which provider you've used for your example.

Over a working lifetime, ie 40 years, building up a pension pot of £1.5m, using Legal & General Workplace pension charges, you will have paid management costs of 2.9% of the final value of your pot not 50% as you seem to allude to.

Where do your figures come from?

[anhar] 03/4/2024 11:50

All public broker advice is worthless, not just UBS.

[marktime1231] 03/4/2024 11:36

So much for UBS, re-rating to roughly where we are today versus where we were last year. An apology that they got things wrong last time would be amusing.

It is hardly genius to say Simoes will draw attention to retail and asset management opportunities even though it is the bulk transfer business which has been booming, because the latter will eventually decline. Quite how this translates to lower capital allocation in order to release cash flow for dividend growth, and how does 7% growth mean "neutral". What about business simplification, winding down or disposing non-core activity like housebuilding, cost cutting, the prospect of a buyback.

UBS know nothing. Looking forward to some insightful analysis and actually hearing what Simoes has to say.

[pierre oreilly] 03/4/2024 11:35

Unfortunately, if you get someone else to manage your money, they'll keep a lot of it for themselves (and their shareholders, hence why I own lgen, on the right side of the fence). If yo have a pension for 25 years, then the charges over that time equal about the size of your pension pot, i.e. the spoils are divided 50/50. I should imagine most other managed products, including trusts, are the same pro rata. They've got to get the money for their Lambos and million quid bonuses and divis for us from somewhere. Having said that, most seem happy with their 800k pension pot when they retire, not realising there was actually 1.6m generated.

My motto is diy and keep the lot for yourself, but I'm in a tiny minority for some reason.

[p0pper] 03/4/2024 11:26

I don't know if we have an enormous seller or a couple of big sellers recently but the volumes lately are huge compared to normal, could this be holding the share price back?

[cwa1] 03/4/2024 08:26

A little more meat on the bones of skinny's post on UBS above:-



Proactive article entitled:- Legal & General's retail arm central to future plans and dividend growth, UBS suggests

[jubberjim] 03/4/2024 07:29

For my sins took (got given) a small amount at 251 both surprised and disappointed.

Looks increasingly likely that this could test 230 again in light of being so unloved despite Aviva and Phoenix making sustained albeit slow progress .

Will give it a few more days as long way for ex dividend here so no rush

Still believe this will catch up

Happy hunting everyone

[skinny] 02/4/2024 09:57

FWIW :- UBS raises Legal & General price target to 258 (235) pence - 'neutral'

[che7win] 02/4/2024 08:09

It's running, just slow

[netcurtains] 02/4/2024 08:08

AJ Bell website down this morning...
Anyone know why?

[luderitz] 01/4/2024 08:13

Many thanks zac very well explained.

[zac0_4] 31/3/2024 22:28

LUDERITZ - No, not directly as you're buying units from the fund provider.

The fund provider levies an ongoing charge figure (ocf). This is the cost for running the fund and will include any trading costs incurred.

The ocf is deducted from the fund and the daily fund price reflects this deduction.

[luderitz] 31/3/2024 18:47

Zac0_4 when you trade “ Legal & General International Index Trust.” Is there no stamp duty to pay?

[rongetsrich] 31/3/2024 10:45

Interested! I'm about to change direction with all my dividends, so I'm reading in now. TFIF and CTY are contenders too. SMT maybe as well.

[zac0_4] 30/3/2024 22:37

The core holding in my portfolio is Legal & General International Index Trust. This is completed by Legal & General Global Tecnology Trust and 3 ETFs - RSGL, IUQF and WLDS. All are simply index tracker funds.