Legal & General Share Discussion Threads

[fenners66] 06/3/2024 13:04

Another set of BB evangelists who take no notice of the evidence of how they often have the reverse effect to their theoretical.

Remember the theory of higher EPS / Dividends and share value - only works if the profitabilty remains at least the same or more likely improves.

"Everything else remains the same"

But NOTHING in business remains the same for long. Do I really need to give examples?
Tesla losing market share in China
Apple losing market share in China...

But these companies are the best in the world , how can they be going wrong?
Let alone some of the also rans that have run out of ideas and can only serve their institutional masters in
providing liquidity - a buyer of last resort - so that if there ever are large redemptions from investment funds they
do not start a run on stocks which damages the institutions ability to make profit...

[spirito] 06/3/2024 13:01

British isa good for ftse

[marktime1231] 06/3/2024 13:00

precisely, well said

[spirito] 06/3/2024 12:58

Blue finish

[mcunliffe1] 06/3/2024 12:58

unastubbs:4926 post. If a company is valued at, say, £1bn and included in that value is a pot of cash valued at, say, £100m and there are 100m shares in existance then each share is valued at £1,000,000,000 / 100,000,000 - hence, £10

Then, a share buy-back uses that £100m cash to buy, for ease of reckoning, 10m shares assuming no change in the share price during the BB.

At the end there are now 900m shares of a company that has £100m less cash in its coffers and so is worth.....£900m. This is assuming straight math applies - a bit like the basic economics espoused by jonnybig.

The share price is still worth £10 (£900m / 900m shares) but there's no cash pot left for the additional divi. It was spent buying the shares.

This is a simplistic example and in reality it probably all boils down to market sentiment, confidence in the company and in the managment and it is impossible to state that a BB is/was/would be successful.


What I find remarkable with LGEN, PHNX and ABDN to name but three is the belief that so many of you want a company who's business model is that of wisely investing peoples pension and savings, to instead, spend money buying their own shares when we've all seen recently the stellar returns provided by L&G's funds (LGGG is one example) compared to the returns on the L&G share itself.....even WITH dividends reinvested.

One seriously unimaginative choice of a mediocre management - as at ABDN and one I hope LGEN and PHNX don't replicate.

[alex1621] 06/3/2024 12:57

It will give the new CEO an opportunity to set out his new strategy. So this CMD will be more important than a regular one.

[makinbuks] 06/3/2024 12:56

I don't like these capital market days. They are widely misunderstood. I worked last year for a public company. The results announcement was poor and the shares suffered, but more was promised at the forthcoming capital markets day. In the event nothing new was said at that, so the shares suffered again. You cannot say anything at a capital market day that is not already in the public domain so its a publicity stunt to try and gain favour with analysts and buy side brokers

[shayadfn] 06/3/2024 12:53

Anyone got the date of Xd and payment date?

[marktime1231] 06/3/2024 12:19

Well it hasn't taken long to bounce back from the over-reaction first thing this morning, the business is still just as sound and the dividends will continue to flow. We were warned about the hit from asset values but it has also clobbered IM operating profit more than expected, wiping out PRT gains. This will bounce back as asset values recover. Also a strange hit to longevity contribution due to accounting changes which I did not understand.

Of note -

LGEN will not hesitate to consider buybacks while hesitating to run a buyback

Probably why the Outlook section was thin, Simoes is working on a new / his own strategy plan for a Capital Markets day 12 June, it must be well advanced already, to replace Nigel's 5-year plan which completes this year and explains why the dividend forecast of +5% is only for 2024.

If the ambition is to be more international the short step to achieving this would be an international M&A.

It would be good to hear what LGEN plan to do to close the 10-20% gap between the share price and what LGENies think it should be. If that means switching from reinivesting surplus capital into business growth ventures to buybacks so be it. Not much of a case for sitting on a solvency surplus of £10B when interest rates start to tumble.

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 12:10

Positive finish now all about Chancellor of the Exchequer...I'm wondering if (as Skinny mentioned earlier in relation to the FTSE futures) we might have a rare day when UK markets outperform. But wtfdik😹

[jonnybig] 06/3/2024 12:04

ABDN would have been less than a quid without the buybacks so certainly worked to support the share price

It's basic economics. Supply and demand and all that stuff. Even a blind man can see it!

Anyway. Positive finish?

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 12:02

abdn will come good. In the meantime they have bought a shed load of shares, the dividend bill has reduced and adds greater confidence in its sustainability. OK they didn't buy them at the absolute bottom...so it goes. I'm happy to hold abdn but only 3% of portfolio. LGEN is a much bigger proportion

[tornado12] 06/3/2024 11:57

ABRDN has spend billions in buybacks and it never solved their core issues in losing business YoY with weak/opaque strategy. LGEN is a growing business with well loved strategy, and multi-billion opportunities to grow in PRT / expected rebound in AUM as interest rates fall... Lets grow, grow, grow ...

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 11:56

So you get to own more of the company and a fatter dividend too.

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 11:55

Exactly Jonny, as if the dividend here wasn't big enough already. You can still get increased dividends with buybacks. The pot can remain the same and with a reduced share count the payout per share can increase.

[jonnybig] 06/3/2024 11:52

Well said unastubbs, buybacks are a must. My BARC and LLOY are motoring due to the buybacks. Great stuff 👍

[anhar] 06/3/2024 11:33

I'm happy with the figures, as a long term hold income investor, because they followed through as intended on the 5% divi increase. Also, reconfirmed intention of a further 5% rise for 24.

Share price? I have little interest in that. Gave up worrying about it decades ago.

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 11:27

agree with lignum, the new chap was good...from a presentational point of view. but in the end the numbers are what count. everything now focussed on the capital markets day in June.

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 11:26

i love buybacks. unsure what the problem is with them. owning a greater proportion of a great company as the share count diminishes and receiving a great dividend simultaneously. this is not rocket salad guys!

[lignum] 06/3/2024 11:23

I thought the new CEO was very good on the call and had a good mastery of detail. Also I got the impression there is a degree of kitchen sinking in these results which should allow for a bounce back in 2024.

[anhar] 06/3/2024 11:20

Small private investors are generally opposed to BBs and would prefer higher divis or maybe debt reduction.

However PIs are irrelevant to big caps who are influenced only by their institutional shareholders in making BB decisions. These investors overwhelmingly prefer BBs and that's why the BB pandemic has spread so widely.

It's so entrenched now that companies seem to fear not following the BB fashion, like a teenager desperate to wear the right gear so as not to be different. Credit to LGEN for not joining in.

[spud] 06/3/2024 11:19

tornado - Agreed. Refreshing to hear a voice of sensibility and reason this morning.

spud

[unastubbs] 06/3/2024 11:17

now bouncing, so one of the better orchestrated analyst calls. i was most impressed by the lovely legs on one of the management team...Laura something. Perhaps that's what caused the upward trajectory ;-i