Ironveld Share Discussion Threads

[aceuk] 07/2/2024 20:47

Exactly so don't bother - laws of average and reversion to mean are pretty universal 🙂

[newforestlad] 07/2/2024 19:58

Selling one dog for another is how it tends to work.

[ladeside] 07/2/2024 19:54

There is no definitive right or wrong in terms of strategy, it's all down to the individual and their personal circumstances and of course there's lots of luck involved also. People can research until the cows come home however the PI is always at a huge disadvantage, especially where AIM is concerned.

I'm not doing great in here but when you read some of the stories of people caught up in the COPL debacle, it makes you wonder what some people are thinking about in terms of their risk appetite and what the repercussions are for them and their families if / when things go wrong.

Thankfully I'm nowhere near that situation and hope others who are suffering in here are the same.

[aceuk] 07/2/2024 19:36

Since I started owning a few shares about 20 years ago I always thought if I sell anything at a loss all I will end up doing is buying another loss. Those 20 years have in very rough terms have proven that my attitude worked, yes I've taken some very big losses because there was no choice on 1 or 2 things but overall I am well up and have achieved a reasonable income to boot, considering most of the time bank interest has been nil.

[ladeside] 07/2/2024 18:36

I'd just have lost it elsewhere, it's only money and in any case the fat burd hasn't started her chanting just yet !!!

[purchaseatthetop] 07/2/2024 17:50

I think I certainly told you to get the heck out of this share at 1p. Feels a long time ago.

[ladeside] 07/2/2024 17:25

You would have thought the above might have been communicated via RNS !!

So March 15th is the "go live" date....

[ladeside] 07/2/2024 17:23

funding for DMS beneficiation plant

6th February 2024

By: Tasneem Bulbulia

Senior Contributing Editor Online


JSE-listed Sable Exploration and Mining subsidiary Sable Platinum Holdings (SPH) and IPace on February 2 entered into a term sheet for additional funding of R1-million payable by SPH for a dense medium separation (DMS) beneficiation plant.

This follows SPH’s announcement in September that it had entered into an agreement with IPace for the establishment of an unincorporated joint venture (UJV) to conduct the business of commissioning, operating and maintaining a DMS beneficiation plant and to sell the product.


This additional funding will be added to the R15-million paid by SPH in terms of the main agreement. For providing the additional funding, IPace has agreed to transfer 2.5% of the UJV to SPH.

SPH has granted IPace an option to buy back the 2.5% shares in the UJV at R1.3-million. The option will expire on October 31.


IPace has committed to fund the balance of the operational and capital costs to complete the DMS beneficiation plant and to begin production on March 15.

In September last year, Mining Weekly reported that ground works and civil works were said to be progressing well for the installation of a DMS magnetite plant in South Africa’s Bushveld Complex.

IPace is a JV that Ironveld Mining owns equally with Pace SA.

Ironveld, which holds mining rights over 28 km of outcropping Bushveld magnetite with a compliant ore resource of 56-million tons of ore, last year agreed to acquire and refurbish a Rustenburg smelter to process its magnetite ore into high-purity iron, titanium slag and vanadium slag.

Ironveld and Pace SA agreed funding and operational structure amendments to the DMS magnetite operation with a subsidiary of Sable Exploration and Mining.

[rec0very stock] 07/2/2024 17:22

I think you paint an overly rosy picture of the 18 Sept RNS:

"During July and August, activities at Ironveld Smelting's Rustenburg facilities focused on ensuring that the two refurbished furnaces as well as the Argon Oxygen Decarburization ("AOD") Convertor and the Granulator could operate successfully. Although the refurbished plant operated as planned without any material issues, it became clear that further electrical power supply would be required to run all equipment simultaneously to optimum levels. To resolve this problem, additional generators were ordered and then fully installed earlier this month. Whilst this resulted in a short delay in the anticipated level of activity from the first two furnaces, the additional power is now capable of operating all equipment as planned on a full-time basis, which is expected to continue going forward. Final works and commissioning of the third planned furnace at the smelter had been placed on hold pending the arrival of the additional generators and this is now expected to start in October."

It really is not clear whether full production from all 3 furnaces was ever achieved.

Also in 18 Sep RNS was:

"The use of generators at the site has always formed part of Ironveld's short-term solution to remain off-grid, allowing it to avoid the daily 'load shedding' imposed by the state electricity provider, ESKOM. As previously announced, Ironveld has contracted for installation of a full solar-LNG hybrid system at its Rustenburg site to provide all power requirements on a materially cheaper basis than both diesel generators and grid power which is expected to be installed during Q1 2024 [a delay from the previously announced Q3 23].

Then all of a sudden the generators provided as an interim measure by the same people (Enernet), who were supposed to be installing the green plant at there own capital cost and recovering their investment over 10 years by supplying electricity, are far too expensive and everything is shut down to conserve cash - if it is cheaper to do nothing than it is to continue producing then that is a clear indication that production is occurring at a gross loss - whilst different generators may be cheaper it seem highly unlikely that they will take the operation from making a gross loss to being cash generative at PLC level. I therefore suspect that production will not restart until a loan of maybe £5m is in place to cover capital cost of HPIP and working capital to get into HPIP production.

Were Enernet just stringing them along the whole time?

There was also this in 18 Sep RNS:

"In August, whilst waiting for the installation of the additional generators and seeking to utilise the power available at the time, the smelter was able to successfully process a test quantity of third-party metal product to generate revenue."

The only way it makes any sense to use the smelter for 3rd party ore rather than their own is if their own is being done at a gross loss.

Has something dramatic really gone wrong since Sep or has the realisation finally dawned (installing JW as Chairman rather than GC could well be the key event responsible for the realisation) that they did not have a clue what they were doing back then and actually the reality is they still don't have a clue because they never followed the industry standard feasibility study process, before wasting huge amounts of shareholders cash getting nowhere.

More importantly, is the realisation finally dawning on certain shareholders that maybe they were unwise to have continued averaging down in a company with an awful track record of diluting shareholders whilst deliberately misleading the market.

[ladeside] 07/2/2024 15:38

Interesting, I see RJ has just used his KZG money to increase his Iron holding.

118.9 million shares held increased to 157.4 Million and has also added in his SB also.

Looks like that's where the 25m and 20m went the other day.....

[rec0very stock] 05/2/2024 19:46

In my experience coming out of care and maintenance and getting up to full production (I don't recall confirmation they ever achieved full production before they had to pull the plug to conserve cash) will require significant time and cash.

Interims from Jun to Dec are due before the end of March. Under GC you could guarantee they would not tell you what you want to know, maybe under JW they will. They will however give the clearest indication yet of how much (little) was produced and sold and how bad the cash burn rate was / is.

As far as going bust is concerned it is not hard to envisage if a company is burning cash and cannot get anymore it goes bust. Whilst I am not suggesting they are currently looking at doing a death spiral (they do not take that long to set up) at some point JW is going to want to stop wasting money with keep the lights on loans, which are doing nothing more than buying time and will become desperate enough to take whatever he can get - how long have they been supposedly talking to these funders introduced by Grosvenor?

[aceuk] 05/2/2024 19:37

You should go back to a lot of your posts since 1½ pence!

[ladeside] 05/2/2024 17:21

I haven't said anything of the sort, I'm just trying to be balanced based upon what is in the public domain.

The bottom line is that nobody appears to have any facts or even "whispers" to add, certainly none that I've read or heard anywhere.

[aceuk] 05/2/2024 16:08

Ladeside I really do think you need to stop sugar-coating - everything you post that every thing bad is now priced in off we go again :-((

[ladeside] 05/2/2024 14:01

What's definitely apparent is that we need a comprehensive update without the sugar coating and one which gives us definitive timelines and the reality of what is or isn't required in order for us to continue trading / producing as per the plan.

At the moment there's far too much uncertainty for even a staunch believer such as myself to even contemplate pouring any more money in here and if I'm like that then I don't see many looking to put their hands in their pockets !!

[ladeside] 05/2/2024 13:57

There is of course another possibility, that this has all been engineered so as to let in the funding entity at a much reduced price and one that could be sold to shareholders as a "needs must" sort of situation where everyone wins apart from the long term holders.

Let's face it, it wouldn't be the first time this sort of thing happened on AIM....

[rec0very stock] 05/2/2024 13:44

It could be worse than that, as it could be a death spiral alternative financing.

Reputable conventional financiers require a BFS before loaning on such projects. IRON has clearly demonstrated that HPI mining and processing BURNS cash (the latest funding is just another indicator of how much cash is being burned, even with the operation shut down to preserve cash). There is absolutely no evidence that HPIP will generate cash (the point of a BFS would be to provide credible evidence to lenders that sufficient cash will be generated to service the debt). IRON is already carrying debt secured on the smelter - potentially its only saleable asset, as a licence that cannot be mined to generate cash is worthless.

As far as JW putting more of his own / his company's money in is concerned, what choice does he have? If IRON runs out of cash (it has commitments now it cannot get out of) then it goes bust and he loses everything he has put in. The good news then is that JW seems likely to continue to put small dollops of cash in to keep the lights on, the bad news is at some point he may feel he has no option but to take an alternative finance deal to get back what he can.

[ladeside] 05/2/2024 13:04

45 Million sold / changed hands this morning so lots of jiggery pokery no doubt taking place.

At this juncture my worry would be that the share price is driven down to 0.10 area (under £4 Million mcap) and then we get some sort of complex funding deal announced (to satisfy takeover rules) which in reality dilutes us all at the 0.10 to 0.15 range and ends up with about 10 Billion share in issue which would see a 0.25 - 0.30 share price hit as the upper end / potential outright sale price, which would of course shaft all existing PI's but be sold to the market as a "major premium".

I hope I'm wrong of course.....

[al101uk] 05/2/2024 11:18

11% seems quite reasonable, not sure how much risk he's taken on (he's front of the queue for any new money raised)... majority of the funding isn't even new money, just an extension.

... And everything Ladeside said in his last post, I'm not sure which parts of the plan are still parts of the plan anymore :-)

[aceuk] 02/2/2024 15:28

He's getting a good coupon but I suppose is taking a risk!

[ladeside] 02/2/2024 15:18

I think the market also needs to know exactly where we stand ?

Are we still planning on recommencing production imminently on receipt of the HP generators ?

OR

Are we to remain in a care and maintenance state until such time as a funding deal appears ?

Where does this leave the DMS Magnetite deal ?

What about the Burnstar plant, is it still proceeding as planned ??

Will this impact our offtake agreements ???

Is the Enernet power plant shelved completely and if so are we back relying on Eskom ????

Lots of questions but very little answers seem to be provided.....

[ladeside] 02/2/2024 14:24

Not the RNS that we were looking for (we, meaning holders of the share).

The good news is that JW obviously still has confidence and it's in his best interests to push for a deal and the best deal he can get, it does of course provide a cash buffer as we wait / hope for an acceptable funding deal to appear.

The bad news is that "early 2024" has now turned into "expected H1 2024" which is of course just kicking the can down the road (again).

I'm not going to lie or sugar coat it as being in any way positive, however that said I wouldn't expect it to fall much from here and ultimately it's got to be a major positive that the man charged with getting us a value deal is the same man who has poured lots of his own cash in here and also at much higher levels.

Not much else to say apart from it remains a waiting game.....

[aceuk] 31/1/2024 10:13

Expect the S to sink, getting into 3D printing now



[...]