Smith (ds) Share Discussion Threads

[emeraldzebra] 13/6/2019 08:31

Totally fail to see why this gets trampled all the time, and not being bought more aggressively. Great results, low rating etc etc - complete mystery.....

[97peter] 13/6/2019 08:16

Wow market drops by 10p on the great news, it must be shorters.

[dr_smith] 13/6/2019 07:29

Given green issues, some plastics are hard to replace, given strength and properties for food/liquid spill, but you would expect much middle ground where paper based can be used.
I am therefore surprised the outlook is OK but no bullish enthusiasm.
I would expect a massive shift to greener products/packaging to reveal itself as massive paper demand increases, the biggest increases in decades.

My gut tells me CSR for packaging users is more lip service, a few twigs planted on a rolling hillside for a glossy photo in the annual reports, nothing more.

Buyzantium.
I had the same thought getting out of bed seeing my MTB shorts from about 3 weeks ago.

[buyzantium] 13/6/2019 06:58

Unsuitable weather this morning to continue wearing shorts might I suggest.

[nickname27] 13/6/2019 06:52

Beat everything handsomely and raised guidance and dividend. Normally this causes it to drop like a stone. Because one day the universe will end and the analysts are nervous that they might be a bit too exposed to that.

[jurgenklopp] 13/6/2019 06:48

Read and then re-read the announcement.

Cannot see anything to be worried about.

Very good value at current levels IMO.

[mboy010] 13/6/2019 06:37

Pleasingly there is no ‘but’ statement. Still a medium/long term hold and whatever the mm’s do to the share price today it isn’t an indicator of the value here.

[ygor705] 13/6/2019 06:35

Agree that the numbers look ok with nice increase in the divi. I make the yield just over 4.7% which is well covered and backed up by a solid business outlook. The updated PE is just over 10 ...... hardly a demanding rating. The shares have performed poorly since the European acquisition and rights issue and I'm not entirely that this is deserved. Have bought more recently and am hoping for a little more stability going forward.

[togglebrush] 13/6/2019 06:23

Results on first reading look good
'
Synopsis
'
Profit before tax up 35%
Free cash flow up 84%
Robust balance sheet - pro-forma net debt/EBITDA <2.0X
Market outperformance - volume growth at 2.4%
Organic adjusted operating profit growth of 9%
'
Acquisition of Europac - upgrade to synergies from EUR50m to EUR70m
Sale of plastics division agreed
'
Dividend increased 11p (10p) xd 4 Oct Paid 1 Nov

[stevieweebie2] 12/6/2019 08:18

Sorry if already posted.

[lord gnome] 11/6/2019 14:01

Can't see a link with Woodford here, EJ. Have I missed something?
I am watching NRR at present. Woodford still has 15% to clear and the shorters are out for half that amount. It's a big game of chicken with the shorters. How low can it go before I just have to hit the buy button?

[lord gnome] 11/6/2019 10:30

Looking strong again today as we get nearer to results. Is this hope or expectation?

[lord gnome] 10/6/2019 11:54

Usually it is, Peter. Witness the effect of stocks held by Woodford. They know he is a forced seller, so they are shorting those stocks to drive down the price still further. Occasionally, the shorters get burned - hopefully this will be one of those occasions, but it depends on the upcoming results and the outlook statement.

[petersinthemarket] 10/6/2019 11:19

I only work the long side. I know nothing about the short side. For those who do, how should we think about the increasing short position. Is a strong or growing short position almost always a successful drag on the sp?

[gabsterx] 10/6/2019 08:57

Great news, meanwhile earnings and dividends keep rising and we get to buy it at a lower price. Thank you Mr Market!

[togglebrush] 10/6/2019 08:08

FWIW____Press

Extract
"Hedge funds have taken aim at cardboard box maker DS Smith ahead of the publication of its annual results next week, betting that a recent slump in its shares will drag on.

About 4pc of the FTSE 100 giant’s shares are now on loan to short sellers including Citadel Europe, Coltrane Asset Management and Marshall Wace, up from less than 0.5pc in December. The combined short position is worth roughly £180m, based on Friday’s share price."

[fhmktg] 08/6/2019 07:00

Let's see if there are any direction pointers in the results this next week.

[97peter] 04/6/2019 18:04

SMDS is on its way back, investors have realised the divi and the board/direction are all aligned and onwards and upwards. The corrugated and packaging will soon catch up and overtake plastic as public opinion and government intervention make plastic too expensive and publicly turned against. SMDS are in the right position to take advantage across EU and UK/US.

[essentialinvestor] 04/6/2019 13:57

If you are holding a packaging company through the cycle
there will be some very pronounced moves.
I hold SKG, and it would not surprise me in the slightest if
that fell to around 14/15 in the next recession - if anything that
view may be too optimistic.

Would expect more sector consolidation, but that's just guesswork.

[lord gnome] 04/6/2019 13:40

I don't use a rigid stop loss, alotto. Normally, if the story doesn't change then I will hold on to a share. I try to keep a daily eye on the markets and review my holdings as we go along. Sometimes this has proved costly, but on other occasions it has worked to my advantage. I do get blindsided sometimes when a share is going south. Failing to sell VOD when it first dipped below £2 has cost me plenty. Made the biggest mistake possible when I averaged down. Never average down!
Mostly high yielders on my watch list. AV., NRR (Woodford factor here), MARS / GNK, LLOY as a trade if it gets down anywhere near 50p. I also have a couple of smaller coys. FLO is one that I particularly like, also AIEA.

Apologies to others for the off-topic.