Doric Nimrod 3 Discussion Threads

[grahamg8] 18/7/2022 17:10

carcosa how do Emirates upgrade the lease companies planes? Or alternatively if pre re-leased how do the lease companies find the money to pay for the upgrade? The only plausible alternative for me is that Emirates have to buy the planes and then upgrade them from their own resources.

I agree they would fly more planes if they had more air crew. But logic says you fly your best planes and rework the older ones.

I'm not clear on the concept of owning assets to boost financial performance. A key metric is return on capital which argues against owning and for leasing.

[carcosa] 18/7/2022 13:51

The aircraft are alresdy owned by leasing companies so there is no need to get any new loans. In fact all the loans will be paid off at end of lease anyway.

The reason why the other aircraft are not flying is due to lack of flight and cabin crew according to Emirates.

As an aside, depending upon which accounting rules are applied to Emirates it can strengthen their balance sheet by actually owning the aircraft, which was not seen to be the case a few years ago.

[grahamg8] 16/7/2022 15:58

Some good points all round. I believe Emirates have indicated they want to refurbish 80 planes 'life extensions', presumably the old ones. This would explain why the DNA3 ones are flying and DNA1 and 2 are still parked, other than one from DNA2. Purchase versus lease will be down to the bean counters but it could also make sense to refurbish a plane you actually own. How would a lease company get a valuation and loan on a plane that was about to be ripped apart and then put back together? Think it compares to a worn out house that will look fantastic after a full refurb, but no bank is going to be keen to put their money on the line until finished.

[br1an] 16/7/2022 10:44

Thank you carcosa for sharing, very helpful and well thought out oversight.

[carcosa] 16/7/2022 06:43

sf5. You missed the real news as per C3479z stated.
You can read my latest at if you so wish.

[c3479z] 15/7/2022 23:13

see emirates to buy the dna a380 at the end of its lease.

[sf5] 15/7/2022 16:49

Yes, positive reaction to a positive update
A skim read suggests 3 of the 4 aircraft are back in service and Emirates say they'll stop chopping up A380s and would like to return nearly all to service had they sufficient crew trained up. also talks of extending some leases by 6+ years. Much of this seems to be driven by delays/disillusionment with their 777/787 orders, with some threat of cancellations.

The 31 March 2022 independent valuation appraisal of $42m per aircraft still sounds a tad optimistic to me. We could try to model the extra income from a lease extension beyond 2025 though I don't know if this would be on similar or worse terms. I thought there was some limited flexibility in the current leases but may be mistaken. They were structured to have repaid all the loan principal by contractual end date, I recall.

Will also be interesting to see how Emirates' spat with Heathrow resolves.

PS what is it about Doric that they feel it appropriate often to issue material RNSs near the end of the trading day?

[iamnotanumber6] 15/7/2022 16:41

Think it's because of the announcement on DNA1.......

[yieldsearch] 15/7/2022 16:01

Going up nicely

[sf5] 23/6/2022 08:50

Article suggests a slow return to service by some A380s, partly in response to delays in delivery of more modern options Not sure it has much relevance to the end of lease value of the DNA3 aircraft though it's interesting the share price is some way of its lows.

[ditchsid] 05/5/2022 18:16

DNA Divi not received yet either. x-o.com

[nbudd] 05/5/2022 11:17

Not arrived from A J Bell yet.

[irishmatt] 03/5/2022 11:32

Just arrived in ii

[br1an] 03/5/2022 10:57

My divi showing this morning.
i.dealing.com brokers.

[nat7] 03/5/2022 10:56

I am with a j bell
Will check with them if not in today

[riff1954] 03/5/2022 10:53

Nope not yet - presume it is delayed due to Bank Holiday?

[nat7] 03/5/2022 10:38

Anyone got there dividend yet ?

[yieldsearch] 30/3/2022 09:38

any idea why this is going up? related to DNA2 news?

[sf5] 08/3/2022 18:02

Roll out of Emirates A380 routes stalling, not surprising I'd say given all the uncertainties

[carcosa] 14/1/2022 13:56

She did it again:



(loosely relevant to DNA)

[sf5] 21/12/2021 18:45

Half-year to 30.9.21 report Confirms the 4 planes are still in storage with lease rentals continuing though ''Given the prolonged impact of the Pandemic, increased lessee counterparty credit risk remains in existence and there could be requests for lease rental deferrals.''

Also comments ''The Company’s first Lease with Emirates expires in August 2025, approximately three years and eight months from now. The redelivery procedure for a widebody Aircraft is complex and highly technical and as we move closer to the first lease expiry your Board will provide more details on the high-level considerations and also the implications of the various potential outcomes for Shareholders.''

[nicholasblake] 18/10/2021 05:53

Not looking the likely that Emirates will re-lease its older A380s. Check out Doric One.

[sf5] 17/10/2021 20:08

Extremely optimistic article title

[grahamg8] 22/8/2021 10:05

Peak demand for new engines 2025/26 so presumably before then. My understanding is that turbine blades need replacing on a regular basis as part of the maintenance regime. Would Emirates cannibalise their spare planes?

Interesting article from BBC "Just how hard is it to recycle a jumbo jet?" The number of planes entering disassembly/part out largely unchanged - 508 in 2019 and 449 in 2020. So for now at least the airlines seem to be keeping their options open and spare planes are mainly in flight ready condition or long term storage/engines removed.

Small rays of comfort to prop up our asset value.

[sf5] 17/8/2021 09:09

Rather vague article - doesn't say by when Citi expect half the A380 fleet to be flying