Worthington Nicholls Share Discussion Threads

[venlib] 06/3/2008 21:09

I didn't realise you had spoken directly with Beart WJ - why didn't you say so earlier? And why haven't you answered the questions even more directly than I could?? (presuming of course he's told you more than he's told me)

[windjammer] 06/3/2008 20:50

venlib

i have been drip feeding you information about SB and his intentions for the last 2 months but i think richmond9 and coolmd have summed it up very well.

you are out of touch now, you keep refering to gossip you are hearing from employees, and thats all it is gossip. your mates on the shop floor will be lucky if they know the easter holiday dates, let alone what the CEO has planned.

p.s
another 10k today

[windjammer] 06/3/2008 20:34

well just got home, i see we are 4th on the constant gainers board for 3 days and up another penny. friday has been a good day for WNG over the last 2 weeks so looking forward.

[venlib] 06/3/2008 20:25

Things have a ways to go as yet Z. Investors should consider that all these screen names that have popped up since the share price crashed, purporting to have the inside track on wng - where were they when you were all being ripped off? They weren't on here telling you the place was a shambles falling about around everyone's ears were they - it was common knowledge as I've been telling you. Now they're even doubling up and more on their screen names doing anything to get the share price back up again. You've had 2 years of spin already

[z1gzag] 06/3/2008 20:16

venlib,
That's your problem, you live in the past, things are moving on.

[venlib] 06/3/2008 20:15

Yeah z1gzag - I must have been a bril guesser these past 18 months then, Lol!

[z1gzag] 06/3/2008 20:12

Looks like Venlib's finally been exposed as a fraud. His contribution to the debate on here is finished.

[venlib] 06/3/2008 20:10

Semantics Richmond - comparatively 'not long before' - WNF was dormant until they shoved the maintenance into it in Oct. 04 so it certainly wasn't part of their supposedly 34 years history. Yes I know all the rest of what you've said, none of which explains how they've turned 35 mil into around 4 since IPO, or what is happening now. The Premier Inn contract isn't even direct - only 2 were almost definite but looks like they've lost those. What it boils down to is wng will be a maintenance bit player so I agree it's about what cash is left and what he can do with it. However, I don't think the investors ever planned to invest in what some city guy might be able to do with a few mil. The city might not be in love with aircon (especially not now) but it's supposed to be a bit less speculative than 'give us your cash and we'll see what we can do with it - after they've put the mess to bed of course. And it still remains to be seen what cash will actually be left by the time they've finished all the payouts etc.

P.S. He confirmed current cash position - not final

[1001dc] 06/3/2008 19:48

Richmond9 and coolmd thankgoodness someone has at last got it right.

[richmond9] 06/3/2008 19:32

Venlib. Sorry but you need to read the statements and do a bit more research.

He had already put aside the redundancy costs for shutting down ASNicholls, Project Air and WN Facilities (WNF had published accounts for the last 4 years so not sure how you worked out it was dormant?).

There was also a further provision for future redundancy's.

He had also paid off the mortgage of 1.1m on the property in North Manchester, which is now free of debt, and has a buyer agreed for next Jan 09 so 1.5m will come back into the company.

After all of that he was able to confirm that the Plc had nett cash of 8m (in Plc terms that is after taking into account for the above items)

They have not closed down the maintenance division, which still has a number of major contracts and they are currently advertising for a Maintenance Manager to head up the department working out of Wilmslow (its on the WNG web site)

All of the installation work has been transferred into Woods including the Premier Inns contract.

You need to understand that the City has no sentiment for the air conditioning industry or WNG. It is preoccupied with money, making it and using it. That's what SB and the team are there to deliver and that's what they will do as their track record demonstrates

[venlib] 06/3/2008 18:42

Why are the staff saying Beart is finished with installs/supply and doing maintenance only (Which I admit sounds daft as he's got rid of all the maintenance arm but that's what they said). WN Facilities was dormant until not long before the float so it wasn't exactly mega in any case. And if you know the details in that depth then how come you don't know about the Premier Inn contract?

[coolmd] 06/3/2008 18:11

There is no getting rid of Woods, Woods Environmental IS WNG now there is nothing else left. What SB needs is profitable turnover and the rumour within is he is strengthening his fort and a couple of similar companies that can gel with Woods will give increased turnover but with low administrative costs is the way this company is going to go. SB could raise funds to acquire over night from the institutions when required and I am sure we will see the first very shortly..The only Woods that have gone so far are the low profit making branches that to be honest where nothing more than glorified franchises.Good luck to them but they where never in IW league.

[venlib] 06/3/2008 18:02

Who Coolmd? Why get rid of Woods then look for aquisitions? Who is around that they could buy? and there is no chance of them 'taking out the opposition' as you call it

[venlib] 06/3/2008 18:01

Atlantic - no I don't have a direct line to SB and neither do you - but knowing what's going on at the co tells its own story

[venlib] 06/3/2008 17:59

They can't transfer the debts and the litigation into a subsid and neither can they transfer all the overheads into a subsid causing that to make a loss as then it has to call on the plc to cover losses in any case so what would be the point. If they had a profitable section and they hived it into a subsid and sold it there would be a point but they don't have a profitable section. There's no point in hiving off something you are going to dump as you might as well just dump it - as you know the employees are covered by tupe so it doesn't even get rid of them or reduce the redundancy pay. If he wants to use the cash to diversify then I can see that but why create a company to get rid of the existing business? It can't be done

[coolmd] 06/3/2008 17:55

Say it again SB is raising money from the institutions for serious acquisitions
to rebuild this company from a solid start to its origional aims that the institutions invested in...

[atlanticbridge] 06/3/2008 17:30

Venlib - has it ever occurred to you that you do not have a clue what SB is up to?

[richmond9] 06/3/2008 17:21

Venlib. It makes everything easier surely. Following the transfer of the contracts/trading business and its staff into WN (Trading) Ltd it either has enough work to cover its overhead or it doesn't and it can have its cloth cut accordingly. This is the same for the other 5/6 limited company's owned by the Plc. WNG Plc doesn't need to trade/invoice customers, as it has the 8m in the bank and only 3 employees. The Board can raise money for the Plc by going back to the institutions that put them in and invest it based on what they are good at and have knowledge of. The city doesn't care what SB and the Board do as long as the Plc has a share price higher than it is now. If you look at XKO when SB took over in 1999 they had a Limited company that made clay pigeons, they sold this business to move into computer software and after 3 years sold all of the software company's and bought into the debt collection industry. The Plc remained the same throughout, it was only the Limited company's it owned that changed and the share price went from 25p to £1.96

[venlib] 06/3/2008 16:59

Seems strange Richmond. Company's generally do that if they feel insecure and may need the Revenue to take a fall for CIS & PAYE etc. but need to make sure it doesn't affect the main co. There will have to be a lot of cross charging for wages etc. so it's a lot of messing around for no real reason - it also makes job & departmental costing harder

[jackbal] 06/3/2008 16:24

Thanks Chesty - I hope so for everyone still in. I just bottled out ! It does seem that the market is mopping up any sell orders with nor real impact on the price.

[chesty1] 06/3/2008 16:23

Well done Jackbal with your profits but I feel theres a lot more to come here.

Be lucky to all

[richmond9] 06/3/2008 16:19

WNG Plc acquired the trading assets of Worthington Nicholls Limited prior to admission, not the Limited Company. That means all the staff were employed by the Plc which isn't ideal if your looking to do a fairly major reorganisation including redundancy's ect. All of the Worthington Nicholls staff were transferred into WN (trading) Limited, which is a wholly owned subsidiary of the group, under TUPE the day after it was incorporated leaving the Board as the only employees of WNG Plc

[jackbal] 06/3/2008 16:13

I'm out reckon even the short term has run out of steam now. Good luck to everyone braver than myself

[goodtiming] 06/3/2008 16:06

Venlib..serious question...What do you think the implications will be??

[venlib] 06/3/2008 15:08

Dec Gerry but was about same time region and wasn't that almost immediatly after Beart ousted the old Board? If it turns out the newco was set up for an exit plan in his favour then it will mean that was his plan from the start. He had already had a few months reviewing wng. I mean - why would you take over a plc then the day after set up a Ltd co outside of the group?

(Well spotted Smithy!)