Wasps 22 Discussion Threads

[1bondinvestor] 02/11/2022 12:08

Reported in the Daily Telegraph today "Frasers is at the heart of a scrum for ownership of the Wasps stadium in Coventry as part of Mike Ashley's plan to make the city his new stronghold". At last a glimmer of hope for bondholders.

[barondene] 01/11/2022 22:41

Both Arena companies in Admin

[barondene] 01/11/2022 22:41

hxxps://caseboard.io/cases/e0526e83-0653-47dd-82f1-8a64036d08f3

[ozzie_dog] 01/11/2022 18:30

Obviously I meant the P shares and have edited my post accordingly.

Breaking news: It looks like Mike Ashley is to be named as the preferred bidder for the CBS arena!

hxxps://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/football/football-news/cbs-arena-preferred-bidder-revealed-25409638

It looks like CCFC fans will be disappointed because apparently he is not interested in buying CCFC. Or he could be playing the long game to also get control of CCFC, the fans are very disgruntled with SISU, and they are in the relegation zone (early days I know). But if he owned CBS Arena it puts him in a powerful position.

[pusb] 01/11/2022 14:56

Ozzie - when you talked about sale of the bonds, did you mean the P shares? They aren’t held by ACL, they are held by Wasps Holdings who operate(d) the rugby sports business. They are already in administration. I totally agree, the P shares should be sold, but PRL need to buy them and they can’t be legally forced to do so. Morally, the P shares should be sold back to PRL without challenge, unfortunately there are some oddities around all sports financial regulations which can be boiled down to looking after their own. Hence why I don’t share your confidence but absolutely more than happy to be proved wrong by events. This is where a Trustee appointed administrator would have been beneficial.

[fastcat99] 01/11/2022 14:56

@OzzieDog - ummm in the context of your last sentence... the sale of the ??BONDS??
- to whom, for how much, why and how?
(not on the open market, obviously - you must be thinking of a flatrate haircut which would have to be agreed by the appropriate majority, at EGM)

[ozzie_dog] 01/11/2022 13:49

@PUSB If the stadium doesn't sell for enough to clear the bond (which is a distinct possibility), ACL will end up going into administration, and they will then find themselves in a position where they cannot challenge the sale of the P shares.

EDIT: Obviously I meant the sale of the shares (read in context to PUSB's previous post directed at me)

[stretto boy] 01/11/2022 13:37

I am not a bond holder but - as a Coventrian, a supporter of CCFC and a rugby fan - I have been following this thread with interest and with an enormous degree of sympathy for the bond holders.

Does anyone know what the trustee is doing to protect your interests because it seems to me, from what has been said on here, that it is doing very little? Subject of course to the terms of the appointment of the trustee, with which I am not familiar but which may contain extensive limitation of liability clauses, trustees are obliged to act in the best interests of the beneficiaries i.e.yourselves.

[pusb] 01/11/2022 13:37

Ozzie - there is no guarantee around the P shares. There is a guarantee around the sale proceeds of the P shares IF they are sold. PRL have been making noises about buying them back (and they are the only permitted buyer), but that hasn’t happened yet. If PRL do buy the P shares, that could be subject to legal challenge from Wasps - although as an effectively new legal entity with just the Wasps brand that would seem incredibly unreasonable. If such a challenge was made, presumably the proceeds would have to be kept in an escrow account or similar until the issue was resolved.

Ashley offered to finance the bond, but then withdrew the offer. Due diligence issues, lost interest (no pun intended) or a realisation he could get the stadium for a lot less than £35 million? I don’t know.

I am neither glass half full or empty, just trying to take a realistic view. It doesn’t matter if my view proves to be wrong as we will all benefit.

[ozzie_dog] 01/11/2022 13:19

@PUSB the guarantee for the P shares is in the bond prospectus, and if I am an optimist Mike Ashley must be much more of an optimist than I am, because he previously offered to refinance the bond.

I think that we are going to get out of this, I think that I certainly am because it only has to sell at 50p in the pound for me to get out flat (no profit). Even so, I would rather be an optimist than a pessimist, and you definitely seem like a 'glass half empty' sort of guy to me.

[pusb] 01/11/2022 12:20

Ozzie dog. Ever the optimist. No guarantee around the P shares and I seriously doubt the stadium lease will fetch anything like Wasps valuation minus repair costs. Incidentally, the charge required Wasps to keep the stadium in good repair, another disregard of their responsibilities. As an aside, I really must set up a Trustee business - money for nothing.

[bondholder] 31/10/2022 18:54

Two bids are understood to have been made to buy the Coventry Building Society Arena – a situation that has enabled the stadium to continue to operate and host Coventry City matches for the foreseeable future, beyond Tuesday night's home match with Blackburn Rovers.CoventryLive understands that the NEC Group are one interested party who have expressed a firm interest in the stadium, which is run by operating company ACL, while a rival bid is also understood to have been lodged – both of which effectively keeps the business going for the time being.

[mistt] 31/10/2022 15:41

I think it was always the case that if acl goes into admin, which looks likely, ccfc would be playing home on Tuesday if this could be agreed with the administrators. So not much more than this really. Supposedly 4 interested suitors for pre-pack.

[barondene] 31/10/2022 15:07

There has been some sort of happening as CCFC told they can use stadium tomorrow and tenants back at the Arena

[ozzie_dog] 31/10/2022 14:52

@mistt, thanks for posting that, it is better than I thought it might be. The stadium was valued at £52.4m plus say £9.6 for the P shares = £62m less £13m for repairs = £49m. Which gives us £14m for admin fees, possible over estimate of stadium value and/or under estimate of repairs, so we are not sitting too badly.

But what I cannot reconcile is the difference between the valuation of £52.4m when Wasps paid much less than that? Also the stadium cost £113m to build, so how do we make sense of it all? Additionally Wasps got a grant of £5.3m and improved the stadium a year or 2 ago.

[mistt] 31/10/2022 12:28

So, not only have wasps used the bond money to fund their onside team but they have also devalued the asset by leaving £13m of repairs behind, as well as significant amounts upstanding to creditors.

[fastcat99] 30/10/2022 22:24

PS I haven’t yet checked every dot and tittle..
BUT NB:- the Interest Service Reserve Account no longer EXISTS !! (since the November 2020 Consent Solicitation)

[fastcat99] 30/10/2022 19:27

@nicktheglobe Interesting!!
- not quite convinced (not least due to vibes I got during my last phone conversation with Griffiths!)
- but I’ll reconsider carefully in the morning

[nicktheglobe] 30/10/2022 19:05

I don't read that we can only use the P-shares as security if they're sold. In the section 2.4 Fixed charges - Interest Service Reserve Account; Approved Investments in the Prospectus, it is clear the P-shares are "a first fixed charge with full title guarantee and as continuing security for the payment of all Secured Liabilities, all of its present and future rights, title, interest and benefit" [of the bondholders]

So in default on the bonds, which is the current situation, the P-shares can be used to repay some of the outstanding debt at our instigation.

There is a section 9.3 to stop Wasps selling the P-shares on the quiet, which may be causing confusion.

[fastcat99] 30/10/2022 19:02

Never too late for a solicitor’s letter :)

[pusb] 30/10/2022 18:45

Fastcat - I have a horrible feeling that that ship has sailed.

[fastcat99] 30/10/2022 18:01

@Ozziedog NO! As you put it, absolutely NOT: the documents explicitly state that Bondholders do not have title to the P shares; only IF they are SOLD (and we may yet bemoan the black/letter precision of that term) do the proceeds become available to our good friend the (vigilant, hyperactive…) Trustee…
Sorry for the sarcasm - yet again I feel Bondholders are in sore need of a reliable representative ‘at the top table’; or failing that, we need to make some explicit legal statement to all Administrators (actual AND “potentialR21;) and Trustee that we demand every possible opportunity for consultation and representation, NOW before it is too late !!

[ozzie_dog] 30/10/2022 15:21

@Stevros, Aren't the P shares also a charge on the stadium for the bond holders.

[stevros] 30/10/2022 14:57

So if the rumours are true that the Wasps rescue deal on the table does NOT include the ACL company (not yet in full administration just NOI) then is the P Share (& sale of) going with the rugby club or with the CBS? If it goes with tge rugby club then it's one less asset that could help bondholders get their money back