Sainsbury (j) Share Discussion Threads

[unastubbs] 13/11/2020 07:34

NatWest Group eyes Sainsbury's Bank for potential takeover

www.theguardian.com/business/2020/nov/12/natwest-group-eyes-sainsburys-bank-for-potential-takeover

hopefully this should provide a boost to the share price today...

[grahamite2] 12/11/2020 18:36

Glaxo and Shell also went XD today and have ended the day roughly share price neutral i.e. down by the amount of the dividend, so Sainsbury's has done well.

[loganair] 12/11/2020 12:12

Even though Sainsbury's has the least number of freehold stores in percentage terms compared to all the other main supermarket groups they continue to sell their freeholds and lease back as they have just sold the freehold of their Hinkley supermarket to UBS Asset Management for £45m.

Usually a supermarket pays c6% to 8% of the value of the sale in yearly lease payments which means in around 10 years Sainsbury's would have completely paid back the £45mln they received from the sale and will still have to continue paying the ever increasing lease payments on the said supermarket. This doesn't make good business sense to me.

[loganair] 12/11/2020 11:54

The petrol stations giant led by two brothers who have agreed to buy Asda for £6.8bn is to generate hundreds of millions of pounds by selling a stake in its holding company to a group of blue-chip global investors.

Sky News has learnt that EG Group could confirm as early as Wednesday that an Abu Dhabi sovereign investor and two of Canada's largest pension funds are acquiring a minority stake.

The deal will value EG at more than $20bn (£15.1bn), including debt, according to an insider.

It will see the Alberta Investment Management Corporation (AIMCo) and PSP Investments become new shareholders in EG, while the Abu Dhabi Investment Authority (ADIA) will top up its existing stake in the EG holding company structure.

One source said the transaction would imply an equity value of more than $12bn (£9bn), paving the way for the company to stage a mammoth stock market flotation in the next couple of years.

[pierre oreilly] 12/11/2020 09:51

Diku, that's not my experience with big caps. Usually ime a large divi causes a drop by that divi on xd day, and then it recovers from the drop over the next day or two (all other things being equal of course). Just like we are seeing atm.

The reason it's like that is because big caps are largely valued on a p/e basis (p/e, ppe 1 year out and ppe 2 years out). A big divi causes all the p/es to fall, and hence they very often, usually, regain the fall to put them back on the same p/e as before.

[pierre oreilly] 12/11/2020 08:36

Been quiet recently buywell, why's that?

10p drop going XD 10p Divi,

Buywell, tell buywell she doesn't yet know even the extreme basics. Stick to the sock darning discussions where buywell can probably contribute and not look too stupid.

[buywell3] 12/11/2020 08:21

200ma rules ok

[paulo435] 11/11/2020 17:28

Yep cheers Pierre, makes sense re the register and that it’s only referred to and read on 13th - I was confused a bit by one of the comm’s. Ex divi date is what matters and being a holder before the cut off.

[pierre oreilly] 11/11/2020 13:56

Of course the share will be marked down by the divi amount first thing tomorrow - but i'm expecting it to soon regain that 10p, just to get back on the same p/e as now.

The xd date is when you qualify for the divi, on or after xd (i.e. xd = without dividend) you don't qualify. The record date is when the register is read and determines where the divis are sent. For those in before opening on xd day and not yet in the shareholders register on the record date, (and vv) the divis get sent to the wrong place, and the brokers sort it out, ensuring those who qualify get them, and those who don't don't.

I recently bought due to the far better trading than i was expecting, and nudged along by th lumped together interim plus last years final.

[paulo435] 11/11/2020 13:43

Yes dividend buying likely going on, but also there’s heavy lobbying for extended opening hours in the run up to Xmas. Anyone know why the ex dividend date is declared as being tomorrow the 12th, but yet in the recent results announcement the special dividend is being paid to those on the register of members as at close of play on the 13th. Wondering if holders need to stay until 13th for this, not the 12th, unless the register is based on data from the 12th. Either way, I’m curious to see if this price drops significantly or not after these dates and if the dividend milkers have upped and left. 5%+ dip to come do we think ? (All other things being equal)

[grahamite2] 11/11/2020 12:57

Buying for the dividend I suppose. Anyway nice to have moved on from that nasty setback the other day.

[loganair] 10/11/2020 09:33

I understand except for Ocado, on line home delivery is still loss making for the supermarkets. Even Ocado only make a 1% margin.

Sainsbury's only own c35% of the free holds of their stores, while Tesco own 55%, Morrisons 75% and Aldi/Lidl well over 95%.


Sainsbury's 65% sale and lease back stores are on long term leases 25 years, with many many of these leases when reviewed can only go one way and that is up in cost.


Sainbury's took over Argos for two main reasons, for their logistics capabilities and to fill space in their many too large supermarkets.

[tim 3] 10/11/2020 09:21

Hi EI.

I think the whole estate is an issue.

With 40% of trade now coming from on line, doubling in a year and apparently when we came out of lockdown last time that barely changed,the fact they have so many large dated stores will become a serious issue particularly where long leases are involved.

The whole process of servicing online orders needs looking at.As pointed out before on here having products delivered putting them on shelves then picking them for online is a time consuming and costly process.In the future I think they will have to invest in more "dark" style warehouses to cope.If you were setting up a business now where half of your trade comes from online you would set it up very differently to how it looks at present.

Sainsburys are not the only company with this issue the other supermarkets and chains like DC face similar issues but where long leases are involved it makes the costs higher.

Not all bad news and I think they are making the right moves but plenty of challenges to deal with including the discounters so for me I would only consider these as an income play and hope the price can remain steady.

[grahamite2] 10/11/2020 09:06

Same here. But yesterday it was the only stock in my portfolio that let me down.

I'm still pretty happy with it for a LTH.

[ny boy] 10/11/2020 08:13

I bought in sub 200p for the 10.5p divi, ex divi date in a few days

[essentialinvestor] 09/11/2020 18:09

Does anyone have a view on some of the long term lesses they are tied in to?.

Mentioned one example last week.

[grahamite2] 09/11/2020 17:06

The nearest to an explanation I've seen is rotation from stocks that have done well out of lockdowns, or at any event, haven't done badly, to those that have been badly mauled and where there is massive scope for recovery.

[mackie] 09/11/2020 16:12

Why indeed? time will tell.

[grahamite2] 09/11/2020 15:41

Yes indeed - but today is not the 13th! Why did we suddenly lose the value of both dividends in 2 hours?

[mackie] 09/11/2020 15:12

Ex div on the 13th, payday 18th Dec. 10.5p

[grahamite2] 09/11/2020 14:37

What's that all about?

[tim 3] 07/11/2020 11:54

Argos model works well, browse what you want online read the reviews ect in the morning then pick it up with your groceries in the afternoon/evening or if its large get it delivered the same day.Its also well positioned to benefit while the pandemic hits many other businesses much harder.The whole idea of buying was to integrate them in Sainsburys stores not invest in stand alones

The counters take way to many staff to operate and its a declining market especially with nearly half of all turnover online.So closing them is the right move too something Tesco have also been doing.

Plenty of opportunity to streamline costs instore too.Hopefully much better than one Coupe did which many stores are still recovering from.

I still worry about the amount of large stores they have and the cost of maintaining an often ageing estate.

Divi reinstated too so much as I don't see it flying looks reasonable value if looking for income at present imo.

[buywell3] 06/11/2020 20:52

buywell is of the opinion that as more and more daily cases of covid-19 occur Joe Public will finally get the message just how nasty this disease is and how easy it is to catch it not just once but twice etc

Why any people go to shops to buy food beats buywell as they are putting themselves at risk

Also buying any fresh produce in open displays ie not covered

buywell would think deliveries of cans and sealed pre-packed products would best minimise risk

As would growing fresh vegetables in your own garden ie dig up the lawn

[essentialinvestor] 06/11/2020 16:17

spob, thought were results were pretty decent when you stripped out the
exceptionals.

Longer term issue here(besides Amazon etc) may be these long term leases
SBRY are tied in to on some of the store portfolio.

Read about one yesterday on a superstore, it's a 21 year lease with 5 yearly upward
Only RPI linked rent reviews.

Now how the .... can you be anywhere near sure that large store will still be profitable in 5 years, lets alone 10 or 15.

It is akin to financial madness imv.

Notice TSCO spending a lot of surplus cash buying back their freeholds ion some stores.