Powerhouse Energy Share Discussion Threads

[smokey 1o3] 04/6/2021 00:34

vatabreak
Your comments made at 15132 about the business are spot on and those made in the final paragraph concerning misleading statements etc most apposite. Thank you for that.

[vatnabrekk] 04/6/2021 00:07

Ken, the is absolutely not the case, and you know it. Your are just twisting it.

First, if they don't have stakes in the SPVs then of course they can't share in the profits of the SPVs. But they will still get £500k per annum licence fee for each DMG system, plus revenue from testing feedstocks and providing data, design work, and engineering consultancy. With no operating costs and low admin costs. So under these circumstances they will generate cash flow, and will not need to go for the further dilutive share issues suggested by you. To suggest that they would is deliberately misleading, which is your usual game.

Now as I have said before, I would prefer that they would actually take stakes in at least some of the SPVs in the future, but not all because they wouldn't have the funds to do that.

But remember that if they want to benefit from a share of the SPVs profits, then they would have to find the funding to put their share of capital into the SPVs. The profits don't come for free, they have to put in the investment in the first place. And in that situation they would have to find the funds to put into the SPVs either from loans, or from ongoing cash flow, or from placings. Which incidentally don't necessarily have to be diluting in terms of share price But the directors have already stated that it is not their intention to take a shareholding in future SPVs, just the first one.

And finally, why do you say that PHE would have to lend money to the SPVs at a rate lower than the market rate? PHE would be under no obligation to lend to the SPVs, they would have to find their own funding; and under no obligation to lend at a low rate. So where did you get that idea from? You just made it up, didn't you?

I have no problem with anyone posting concerns about the company, even negative views, providing these are base on some form of reality because that helps to give balance to this board. But posting deliberately misleading statements and unfounded negative speculation without any justification, is worse than just being mischievous, it is reprehensible.

[ken chung] 03/6/2021 23:37

If they don't have stakes in SPV's that means less revenue and more dilutive share issues. Presumably they will also be lending money to SPV's and at a rate lower than the market rate. Shareholders losing out again. It's all academic anyway because they have never built, tested or certified a full size system, so it could all still fail or require more time and expense.It would need dozens of units built and running to justify even the current hyped valuation.

[vatnabrekk] 03/6/2021 21:07

PHE will be taking a share in the first SPV but I don't know what %, I assume somewhere near 50% but really don't know.

David Ryan has said that it is not their intention to take a share in other SPVs but I wouldn't be surprised if they do as and when they build up a cash surplus.

They will earn an annual fee of £500k for each DMG unit (E500k in Europe).

They will also earn revenue from running tests and providing data on various feedstocks, design work, and consultancy.

[marktime1231] 03/6/2021 20:37

That is terrific news and you heard it here first, PHE will not need to raise further funds to pay for future sites. Thank you for clarifying the situation, and thank you to whoever is going to stump up the next £20-25M at their own risk and expense. So presumably PHE will just be getting a license fee for its technology, are they £0.5M or £5M each, am I allowed to ask how many of those does it need to sell every year to hit a £250M mkt cap?

The distinction between PHE and its SPV is relevant to how the project is going, or whether they will ever make any money?

[juju44] 03/6/2021 20:18

Not yet but look at what happened at Protus -= Peel did a runner when it came to coughing up the money

[vatnabrekk] 03/6/2021 20:15

Mark, it may have gone un-noticed by you, and several others, but PHE didn't place the order, it was placed by the SPV "Protos Plastics to Hydrogen No.1 Ltd." that will be responsible for the funding, the capital expenditure, the construction and installation, the commissioning, and the operation of the FOAK DMG system at Protos.

PHE will not have to find funding for the second DMG system in Glasgow, because they will not be responsible for the cost of building and operating it.

[r0hini] 03/6/2021 19:48

And when will that be

[juju44] 03/6/2021 19:35

Just watch the share price when Peel lay a block

[r0hini] 03/6/2021 19:28

I agree Marktime, this RNS was pointless can't believe they release something saying we have ordered some metal ffs.The reactor not going to be ready 12m from now not a cat in hell chance. Years from being profitable yet have 200m+ market cap. Do. Me. A. Favour!! LolLoads these stocks hiped beyond belief.

[marktime1231] 03/6/2021 19:00

The rns system is not there to announce micro-events in a project like ordering some specialty stainless steel alloy, is it? After 4 years this is the first big commercial order PHE has had to place so they are all excited. It would have been more revealing to say whether this project milestone was met on time, or how late it was, how much was the order, when it is deliverable and when payment is due ... still, as has been said, I suppose some news is better than silence but why make an rns fuss about not telling us very much?

What else is Yeo not telling us?

Are PHE on track to first commissioning of Protos Park in Q1 2022 (delayed from the previously stated ambition of sometime late 2021), 10 months to go and counting. Is it going to blow the budget, whatever it is, something around £20-25M all together, when are first revenues expected? When might Protos Park break even, if ever? How far have potential customers got with their schemes, the local authority with an idea for a fleet of hydrogen fuel cell buses, and ...? How will the hydrogen be stored, delivered for refuelling, do those aspects require safety certification ... or in the meantime will it just go up the chimney to make a little bit of electricity?

How much investment might the next plant need and how soon do they expect to commit funds, where is it going to come from, when are they going to tap the market for more cash?

[smokey 1o3] 03/6/2021 15:37

Ken,
Now, now, lets not get personal. Get help please.

[smokey 1o3] 03/6/2021 10:38

KEN
Thanks as I am neither a mushroom or a lemming these comments are clearly not meant for me. Who are the mushrooms and lemmings you are addressing. Please seek help. LOL

[vatnabrekk] 03/6/2021 10:34

There seems to be a lot of incontinence on this BB.

[juju44] 03/6/2021 09:03

Ryan said a book when he congratulated the team in taking just 4 years to make this procurement . For such a hyped tech . the inability to put it in place is pathetic

[volsung] 03/6/2021 08:58

I thought it was Trump who was incontinent. Hadn’t heard Biden was too lol. Gives me great confidence in the leadership of the ‘Free World’!

[deccer1] 03/6/2021 08:58

Also ask yourself why they are about to lose their second CEO and why they need a consultancy relationship with Howard White instead of doing that work themselves.

[deccer1] 03/6/2021 08:54

Volsung I've usually found it's better to have Directors in their 40's, experienced but still young and eager and willing to put skin in the game. Once they get over 65 it's usually a sign someone is creaming it and at 75+ they probably spend most of the day asleep, having incontinence pants changed and confused due to onset of cognitive decline. Look at Biden. He's an embarrassment.

[vatnabrekk] 03/6/2021 08:53

R0hini, could you please tell us what PHE might want the placing to be used for? They are not short of cash at the moment, so why would they want to go for a placing?

[solarno lopez] 03/6/2021 08:49

And Dave Ryan leaves very soon

[juju44] 03/6/2021 08:48

Yep , never never land. Peel and PHE have 2 speeds - dead slow and stop

[r0hini] 03/6/2021 08:41

It is just some metal, the last 2 rns have been fluffy nothing more. Nothing has changed here. Fluffy rns usually preceed a placing in my experience

[volsung] 03/6/2021 08:33

I’d say some 76 year olds are better chairmen than some 50 year olds Ken.
Stop being ageist