Plus500 Share Discussion Threads

[sunnybeachboy] 16/4/2019 13:56

Looks like you have been around for many years bashing plus.

[fenners66] 16/4/2019 13:55

Try running your share valuation at 6.5x IF you use the first Qtr revenue x 4

I think you will come to a materially lower number.

[fenners66] 16/4/2019 13:53

Please read what I wrote , not what you want to see.

"we do not know how much of the 2018 figure has trading profit in it"

We do NOT know how much trading profit was in the final qtr of 2018 - it is not disclosed.

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 13:53

103 is not in the open they have provided more details of the Net Numbers... the same way they reported in Q1 2019

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 13:51

Fenners what do you mean we don’t know how much profit they had on it... They had a loss and we know how much 28.1

[elcapital2018] 16/4/2019 13:06

Everyone is assuming the accounts are correct. Already a 103m hole in them that is in the open

[fenners66] 16/4/2019 13:00

Final qtr of 2018 revenue was $155m
First qtr 2019 $ 82m

we do not know how much of the 2018 figure has trading profit in it - but we do know that it did have some.

We also now know that 2017 had a $103m loss.

There is a correlation between a rising market in shares and Bitcoin and losses for Plus.

Market has risen first qtr and Plus lose $28m

so thats $155m vs $54m

a massive drop of $101m in 1 qtr

Take off the marketing spend and admin costs and tax and what have you got left.


Bitcoin is rising again and so may the trading losses as the noobs may actually be making money.
Likely that the gravitation towards experienced traders will not help as they are more likely to make money too.

Its like drilling for oil or mining gold unhedged when the price moves in your favour you make more than competitors - when it moves against you lose.

Problem is they always said they had a propriety software advantage - not that they were unhedged.

[fenners66] 16/4/2019 12:47

Pennywise- beat me to it - I was just about to look at his multiples to see same.

MP - will go through your numbers - but first glance if you think revenue is profit - you are sadly mistaken.

[pennywise] 16/4/2019 12:44

Moneypenny - I am confused
Are you saying that Revenue is profit and cash?
If you look at last year's results
Revenue = 720m
Profit before tax was 720m less 217m (selling, marketinng, admin. etc)= 503m
Tax was 124m
Giving profit after tax of 379m

Plus have said they are not cutting back on marketing expenses so assuming the expenses stay at 217m

Using your revenue estimate of 328m
That gives profit before tax of 109m
Tax say 26m
giving profit after tax of 83m

Dividend policy is 60% of profit = 50m v 230m (2018) and 200m (2017)

Of course you may want to use your own estimates but us readers need to be aware that revenue is not the full story. Also PLUS might decide it is imprudent to raid the cash pile too much in order to support the share price, as cash is the only safety cushion they have,

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 12:37

They need to try harder

[sunnybeachboy] 16/4/2019 12:29

Look at all those 230 trades to pull us down.

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 11:41

But you are more then welcome to short if you think it will go bust? Oh wait that’s right this is not a good level to short...

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 11:37

You are basing your argument on this going bust. I put 0 chance to that. I have shared my thoughts with you via PM on that. Bust with a very big % of market cap covered by cash and cash coming in because this is a cash cow paying you cash today not a Tesla. It has the disruptor potential also because they have the Systems and IT. You are in your 40-60s you think next generation will be investing through HL, HSBC, Fidelity or Barclays stockbrokers? ... One of those guys will buy IG, Plus eventually. It will not go bust

[elcapital2018] 16/4/2019 11:28

moneypenny....when this goes bust, which i think it will, how can you then say this is a good way to play the vix?

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 11:28

I am not a trader and I don’t use leverage so stops don’t matter for me I can stomach big swings and always diversify. Have liquidity to top up if needed. I only go long and enter when I see value or miss pricing and then I wait for sanity to return. Sometimes it takes longer but who cares I have plenty of other positions especially in US market. (long Lyft)

[sunnybeachboy] 16/4/2019 11:26

Like to see bigger swings :)

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 11:20

You can’t trade Plus via plus. I Disagree this is the best and cheapest way to trade VIX and after the fall it’s gotten even cheaper.

[elcapital2018] 16/4/2019 10:55

You are trading via PLUS? Probably one of only a couple of the bulls if so

I would be very careful, dont use stop losses and dont leave to much cash there

Worse case of trading VIX possible imo.

Financialthoughts was massively out on his numbers, hence why he has done a runner.

[sandcrab2] 16/4/2019 10:54

JUP continuing to power ahead.
And nice bounce here too!

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 10:53

VIX type exposure with 10% cash yield (after WHT) and upside of 40% without VIX going higher form current levels. You keep all the upside and have no downside.

[moneypenny2018] 16/4/2019 10:41

Regarding Financial thoughts... he probably has never used or traded in any of these platforms in his life... I am not that case...

[elcapital2018] 16/4/2019 10:26

we have seen this guy financialthoughts spend days trying to guess numbers here whilst the bulls patted him on the back and slagged me off....only for me to be right and him to disappear....just saying