Geong Share Discussion Threads

[simonv9] 17/8/2012 09:35

I don't know about you guys, but I'm quite excited about the downward slide... I'm looking forward to 4p and hopefully even 3p.

[greek islander] 16/8/2012 23:15

Made a big killing on WCC so relieved I took the profit. Yes, interesting race downwards Longsight. I am absolutely certain that both will crash completely in due course it's only a matter of time. Don't care at all about RCG but yes very sad for GNG which looked such a fantastic opportunity a few years ago.
And so we learn from bad experiences.

[longsight] 16/8/2012 12:38

tiltonboy - disagree on that. WCC's recent dismal share price performance simply mirrors that of all the HK listed Chinese cement cos. [nai - I don't hold WCC, fwiw]

[tiltonboy] 16/8/2012 12:00

That old favourite West China Cement is coming up on the rails!

[sir rational] 13/8/2012 16:58

That would be dying unless you think they want to paint it black or something

[rjd123] 10/8/2012 10:57

Slowly dying a death!

[kenmitch] 09/8/2012 16:38

Greek Islander.

I don't think anyone doubts Anthony Bolton's quality when it comes to UK investing. But he bit off more than he can chew by thinking he could do the same in China.

Aside from whether Anthony Bolton will eventually do well in China too is the key point that because of who he is, his Trust is trading at a premium to NAV. The better quality JMC J P Morgan China is trading at a large discount. When the Chinese market has a good run again there is a strong chance that the discount will narrow and so increase the gains when the share price goes on a decent run. With the shares already at a premium there is no such chance for Fidelity China. Most Investment Trusts that trade at a premium do so because of an excellent record and/or an excellent Manager.

i.e JMC is MUCH better value (with lower charges too from memory) and better quality and so likely to do better than Fidelity China imo.

I've fond memories of Fidelity Special Situations warrants.

Good luck whatever you decide to do.

[greek islander] 08/8/2012 19:30

kenmitch

You are probably mking a good point re Anthony Bolton. He does seem to be "learning on the job" (good description) and his investing seems to have settled down to a more informed level. When his Fidelity Special Situations started out it ran at a loss for a bit before recovering, so I am hoping that will happen here. I am willing to leave it and see what happens - at least for the forseeable future. It is my wife's ISA rather than mine which makes it a little more concerning. Mind you his successor at the Special Situations equivalent is not doing particularly well. Though we have taken a lot of profit from that fund already.
Thanks though for the tip re JPM, something to consider.

[kenmitch] 08/8/2012 13:16

Greek Islander.

Out of interest. Why have you gone for the Anthony Bolton (UK and little China experience and learning on the job at the expense of Fidelity China investors) instead of the experienced team at J P Morgan China?

Also Fidelity China are trading at a totally undeserved premium to NAV whereas J P Morgan China are at a 12% discount.

I don't hold either yet, but when deciding to invest in China again won't hesitate to go for J P Morgan China.

Wish I had thought of shorting GNG once convinced the only way was down.

This site is a must for Investment Trusts

[pro_s2009] 08/8/2012 08:45

painty boy 8 Aug'12 - 08:38 - 9063 of 9064

Dodgy financials claims prompt West China trading halt
(15 mins ago)

Shares of West China Cement (2233) were suspended from trading this morning after a US research house alleged the company of fictitious margins and overpayment in an acquisition.

Glaucus Research Group issued a report today, saying the mainland cement producer "is falsifying its publicly filed financial statements."

The research house said ratings firm Moody's "found the most flags at WCC, a cement manufacturer operating in China's Shaanxi province that purports to be one of the most profitable cement companies in China."

Glaucus claimed that WCC provided fictitious margins, and abnormally high auditor and management turnover have been observed.

Shares of WCC were stopped from trading before 11:00 a.m. The company said it will issue a clarification statement shortly.

[pro_s2009] 08/8/2012 08:06

From the 2233 thread, a Chinese company accused of dodgy things.......... have you heard that before ?? Trading was suspended in the company at 10:51am HK time pending clarification announcement.


.........painty boy 8 Aug'12 - 07:06 - 9046 of 9053

from AA stocks.

Glaucus Research, a US-based research institute, accused WESTCHINACEMENT (02233) of fraud in a report.

In the report, Glaucus Research said WESTCHINACEMENT fabricated its profit margin.

The institute also pointed out WESTCHINACEMENT bought cement plant suffering losses with too high a consideration, which may be used to cover up secret payments.

Furthermore, WESTCHINACEMENT secured facility that has a high interest rate though it claimed to have ample cash, said the report.

In addition, guidance of WESTCHINACEMENT triggers suspicions, said the report. For example, sales and distribution costs are expected to account for 1% of sales value as compared to the industry average of 5%.

The institute also noted the many changes in audit and management personnel, which added to the suspicions of Glaucus Research.

[greek islander] 07/8/2012 13:43

Thanks mudbath

Best of luck to you too.

Pleased about MTT?

[mudbath] 07/8/2012 08:49

Good to reminisce Greek Islander.
Geong was a classic "dutch auction"stock,in that your deepest gut feeling told you to avoid the company like the plague, whilst common sense was offset by siren voices suggesting that here was a "something for nothing" bargain. .
The share price may yet have its day in the sun,although I doubt that the company itself will ever shine.
As I mentioned earlier,PUR imo warrants "all in " status.Good luck with your strategies.
Mud.

[greek islander] 07/8/2012 00:57

Some of us who originally invested many tens of thousands of pounds in Chinese companies and seen most of them either go to the wall or see their share price drop through the floor because mainly of deplorable communication skills and often downright misinformation, have given up on China. I have made some profits (in a couple of instances sizeable) from a few that have been taken over but lost a lot more on shambles management as here and at RCG.
My investment strategy now excludes Chinese companies alltogether with the exception of a couple of long term ISAs in Fidelity China Fund which I still hope that Anthony Bolton will ultimately turn around.
The tens of thousands of pounds that I raised from the sell out of my remaining Chinese assets have gained by on average over 20% and rising as I moved the cash into a number of UK LSE stocks such as ABC WEIR ASC and ARM. Without being jingoistic I am a much more contented investor with UK based companies as I await recovering all my Chinese losses.
Those of you who are still sticking in here have very long odds against you ever making any profit and indeed of avoiding a complete devaluation of your assets.
My short spreadbets with IGIndex on RCG and GNG which I took out some months ago (I don't do shorts as such) are doing very well thank you and should soon realise me a small car! Just wish more of those here had realised a few months ago to do the clear obvious and the same.

[stewjames] 06/8/2012 15:58

Pro-S2009 That is an excellent post for a shorters final fling ! I should hire you, but elsewhere......................

I suspect it's true. The Sinosoft director who decides to start gambling on Forex, for example.

One thing for sure - evaluating Chinese companies assuming Western business practices and philosophies has repeatedly been shown to be a mistake.

[shroder] 05/8/2012 17:48

Using Chrome at the mo, just tried IE which is clear (cache)- home page slowly appears but 'products' tab still loading after a minute or two.

This link


edit; page just came up

[buetowa] 05/8/2012 17:42

Shroder, Your link worked the first clicking on it. No problem navigating around the site. The normal time delay moving from page to page that I have always experienced. Try clearing your cache...

[shroder] 05/8/2012 17:36

The home page sometimes appears, but try navigating around say the products area.

[shroder] 05/8/2012 16:40

It doesn't make a lot of sense given the management team.

Web site looks to be still down, it's been like this for around three weeks.

[rhuvaal2] 05/8/2012 16:34

Pro-S2009 That is an excellent post for a shorters final fling ! I should hire you, but elsewhere......................

[mudbath] 05/8/2012 13:14

The time to get worried though is long gone.Still time to invest in Pure Wafer.

[pro_s2009] 05/8/2012 11:45

You do know its quite common in China for employee's to "borrow" all the companies cash from the company account and then use this money to speculate on properties, or go off to Macau to play in the Casino's.

Happens all the time, only makes the news of course when they lose the money and cannot pay it back in time.

Always watch the "cash" situation of a Chinese company, if you see them doing strange things that should not be being done if they really had lots of cash in the bank, financial staff leaving, changing their accountants etc... - then its time to get worried.