[ADVERT]
Share Name Share Symbol Market Type Share ISIN Share Description
Fletcher King Plc LSE:FLK London Ordinary Share GB0003425310 ORD 10P
  Price Change % Change Share Price Bid Price Offer Price High Price Low Price Open Price Shares Traded Last Trade
  0.00 0.0% 45.00 40.00 50.00 45.00 45.00 45.00 690 08:00:01
Industry Sector Turnover (m) Profit (m) EPS - Basic PE Ratio Market Cap (m)
Real Estate Investment & Services 2.6 0.1 0.4 115.4 4

Fletcher King Share Discussion Threads

Showing 601 to 624 of 725 messages
Chat Pages: 29  28  27  26  25  24  23  22  21  20  19  18  Older
DateSubjectAuthorDiscuss
19/9/2015
22:06
Hi Glen. Good meeting you again and thanks for the notes. Over the last year this has become one of my larger shareholdings and I can always sleep well at night. I am however quite heavily exposed to the property and buildings/infrastructure sector and acknowledge that there is a need to keep a close eye on the cycle but also that FLK are well managed, have a very good balance sheet and offer a decent income stream. Further points from AGM noted below: • They noted that they have property in SHIPS4 that is regional (outside London) and that the capital appreciation has not been anywhere need as strong as London. • A point was raised about potentially using some of their spare cash for buy backs or for short term lending such as bridging loans (they could get 9-12%). DF noted that they were cautious of buy back due to District + Urban already owning +20% of the company. They are otherwise just very cautious with their cash and don’t seem concerned about it earning low levels of interest. As previously discussed in the AGM last year they also like to have a 9 month buffer of cash. • They run a very tight ship with respect to receivables – almost nothing owed over 90 days. • They do not see the value in getting broker forecasts as they can be costly for potentially very little upside. • Their lease on 61 Conduit St expires in 18 months and they currently have 1000 sq/ft of surplus space (some of which is sub-let) – they will either move to smaller premises or try to secure a good deal and stay where they are. The 4th floor of the building is currently vacant and has been for a while. • They were asked if they have considered taking on another NED as they only have one (Dave Stewart) and he has been with them for a number of years. They said they have considered it but are conscious of cost – no current plans. • M&A – they may potentially be interested in buying a small fund or asset management company if the right deal came along. I look forward to another year of progress. All the best.
norbert colon
18/9/2015
10:05
Hi Davidosh, I used to write on my personal website for free. Then ADVFN wanted me to write one of their Newsletters, which I agreed to do. Now they charge £6 per month. They don't like it if I put everything out on the BBs - sorry. Glen
profdoc
17/9/2015
14:29
If you want to put the whole report in the ShareSoc Agm library that would be very useful www.sharesoc.org
davidosh
17/9/2015
14:21
Hi, Yesterday's AGM was very interesting. I've written a report on the meeting, but it is 1557 words so ADVFN are not keen on me publishing it here (they prefer it at http://newsletters.advfn.com/deepvalueshares/). Anyway here is some of it: David Fletcher and the other directors warmly welcomed the four shareholders who turned up to the AGM yesterday. They were very willing to discuss the important and intellectually challenging issues facing the business. So for about an hour we probed many of the dilemmas that come with managing an organisation such as Fletcher King. (By the way, it turns out that the board have been reading what I’ve been writing on the company – so they have probably also seen the bulletin board comments made by others.) Is the London commercial property market near to the top of a bubble? This is always an extraordinarily difficult question to answer – except, of course, with hindsight. But there are straws in the wind. There is a post-election lull in the lettings market. Also yields are approaching record lows. Or was that 2007 yield levels? (which might be the same thing, I’m not sure). Whatever it is, prices are high. On the other hand, rental growth for smaller office suites has been going great guns over the last 2-3 years. This fits with the evidence of good demand from both tenants and office buyers in the performance of the Leadenhall Street property in SHIPS14. A key point of hope is that the supply of new offices is not as great as in the lead up to past peaks. The people around the table had seen a few London property cycles and, I could be wrong, but I sensed a consensus that we are getting close to midnight here for speculators betting on rising prices, where all turns to pumpkins and mice for those who do not get out before the clock strikes. However, not everyone in the property game, or those supplying services to those investing in property, needs a rising market to make a living (for example, we’ve done fine in Leicestershire with a flat market). There are many working at FK who collect fees for looking after clients (collecting rents, doing rating appeals, valuations) whether the market is in an up-phase or is down. I pointedly asked what profits were like in 2009 and 2010. In both cases revenues were in the ballpark of £3m and underlying profits were made. This is a very conservatively run company, strong enough to cope with recession. However, the icing on the cake for a business like this is say when a number of banks ask for FK property valuations so they can lend to investors keen to buy, or when fund managers (e.g. pension funds) are enthusiastic about investing in London property and need various services, or when investors are keen on piling money into SHIPS for FK to charge a management fee. Other issues discussed: The dilemma of paying enough to retain rainmakers. How much to invest in SHIPS? Dividend policy? Growth through acquisition? What about other routes to growth? Quality of management? Glen
profdoc
08/9/2015
16:19
Very strong since that statement and will be going XD for 8p tomorrow night. I've held these for many years and think there's plenty of value still.
deadly
01/9/2015
07:57
A rare bit of good news. It was in the pipeline though given huge moves in London market and leasing being ahead of forecasts. It look like they may have returned the profits made on the scheme. There will be additional performance fees but no doubt the directors will get a fat wedge of that. And tax. Not sure whether shareholder pressure for a return is behind the return of these profits but hopefully it is something that will carry on in future.
horndean eagle
14/8/2015
10:14
Recent posts all very interesting and tell it like it is!I too have followed FK over the past 15 years,twice building up stakes approaching 1.5%,and during that time nothing much has changed other than an increase in the level of cash held.Interesting that during this period DF has not added to his shareholding despite long periods when the share price has languished at 25p.Obviously given his grip on the company he does not need to take that risk.District & Urban seem to be a passive rather than activist shareholder so far as I can tell otherwise they could easily have been a catalyst for change.FK always seem to go by convention when it comes to dividend cover(2x) and have been known to pass the dividend even with their cash pile.I suppose a return of capital to shareholders remains a possibility although only when DF is ready to go!Exposure to the commercial property market in London allied to fickle Chinese investors,poor liquidity and the boards scant regard for shareholders leads me to the conclusion that the shares are fully valued for now.
longinthetooth
14/8/2015
09:29
Norbert and Westcountryboy, Thank you for your well-informed and considered comments. I think that a vote against remuneration policy this year is as far as I'm going to go - a shot across the bows to not keep pushing their luck with shareholders. Removal of directors is a big step and needs careful consideration, but we'll see what their attitude toward shareholders is at the AGM. More London based SHIPS makes sense if the London property cycle was younger - their latest bulletin says the market is 'fully valued'. So I worry about being stuck in an illiquid downturn. Perhaps there is more scope for SHIPS outside of London? Thanks again Glen
profdoc
14/8/2015
08:31
hi profdoc I just wanted to thank you for this excellent write-up. I have dabbled in and out of FLK over the last 15 years and even went to an AGM once (the only shareholder there, and they were very surprised to see one). Nice offices. On the issue of salary, I agree that the director bonuses are too generous, but the other 15 employees seem to be on an average of just over £50k which since they are mostly professionals above middle age working in central London does not seem so much of a problem as to make a successful movement at the AGM possible. Especially since they will be quite a large proportion of the attendees... I don't know much about District & Urban Group the main shareholder but they have held for a very long time and must be content with the way things are run. The main thing that strikes me about FLK is that it is an extremely conservative business. As you say, the dividends are not bad and frankly that is how the stock should be seen, as a sort of bond. If you look at the chart over 20 years there have been three periods of excitement corresponding with unusual gains, and the rest is routine. The cash pile has always been there: there was a TMF post on it in 2004, saying how undervalued it was and the cash pile was a potential outer! The interesting issue to me is whether shareholder activism can do anything, not about the cash pile or the bonuses, which I doubt, but about the lack of entrepreneurialism. In this respect the key thing may be that there have been two SHIPS funds in successive years - as you say. That is the promising development for the future I think, so let's hope the commercial property market stays buoyant and they get the taste for more. One final question: I can't find any figures from previous years' annual reports that would allow a comparison with the figures quoted on the property page of the website: 8 million sq ft occupied by ... 607 tenants generating a ... £68 million rent roll etc It would be interesting to know if these have increased much over the last couple of years. cheers WCB
westcountryboy
13/8/2015
22:30
Hi Glen. An interesting write up - many thanks. I like your analysis and cant really add much more. I have to confess I did not see Directors salaries as an issue at FLK but having reviewed the total boardroom pay of 3 other micro-caps of less than £6m mcap that I hold (DSN - £527k, BVM - £441k and C21 - £423k) it is clear that the FLK board are paid pretty handsomely although I will counter that slightly by adding that they do not have loads of nil cost or other options which is one positive. I am not sure I agree with reducing boardroom headcount (pay - yes) and in fact wonder why they only have one NED who has been with them for a number of years - I would like to see another NED to bring some independence to the board. Also of interest with respect to staff costs is that on average each FLK staff member accounts for £112,000 of costs. This is very high compared to the above mentioned companies where the average staff cost per employee (inc. Directors) is only £48,000. Again to counter this the other 3 companies have 3-4 times more staff and hence this is not a totally fair comparison as the Board costs at FLK represent a high % of the total cost. Clearly they need to carefully consider returning some cash to shareholders as you have argued - an AGM discussion point. Concerning the London commercial property market have you read their latest bulletin... hxxp://www.fletcherking.co.uk/bulletin/July_2015.pdf I sold some shares (bought exactly 3 years ago at 24.9p) in Jan 2015 at just over 60p and have recently bought back during the most recent dip at just over 43p. I still like the company but you raise a number of good points and lets hope DF and the board are willing to listen and take some action to address them.
norbert colon
29/7/2015
02:49
Thanks to all. Looking forward to a lively AGM. It will be interesting to see if FK Board intend to liquidate SHIPS within the next 18-24 months - after that we really would be playing with fire in London. Also at the AGM we need to raise (1) Succession planning for Board directors - younger and cheaper leaders would suit me. (2) Just how is the bonus policy for Directors worked out? Is it meant to be stretching? (3)Why hold so much cash? (4) Is dividend policy to pay out around 50% of profits? or is there a more rational logic than that? The 20% shareholder could rally us smaller shareholders into using our powers. For a start I will be voting against the remuneration report. If the directors continue to treat shareholders with contempt (e.g. ignore request for later AGM start time) I will consider voting against their re-election next year. If others join me we could send a message. (If major shareholders would like to meet sometime, I could arrange it - it will not be a concert party as we would not be obliged to act as one, but it would be a discussion group of concerned investors, and we could make our voice heard).
profdoc
28/7/2015
18:24
You can see what assets they have in the SHIPS funds if your google online. The first one has let above forecasts so should turn a decent profit. The second one is much earlier stage. Rental growth in London is very strong and vacancy very low. Pre-lets are in on more buildings under construction so dynamic unlikely to change imminently.
horndean eagle
28/7/2015
12:02
Much less concerned about asset values in the provinces although not altogether sure that is where the SHIPS money is going.Worthwhile asking the question at the AGM.On all known evidence there has got to be significant downside risk(and limited upside) in the Capital.
longinthetooth
28/7/2015
10:59
Hi Glen / longinthetooth. Interesting debate thanks. With respect to their SHIPS, I have to confess I have never really studied them in detail and hence you know more than me but your logic seems sound. With respect to London property Glen I concur with your thinking and don't see residential and commercial in the same light although they are not completely different. I attended a meeting with the CEO of a well known and respected property consulting firm a few weeks back and his view of the commercial market was that London was nearing the top of the cycle (they are consciously moving more into the retail sector which is only just starting an upswing) and that outside London was still half way up the curve, so going back to the point raised I think caution is needed but it will be interesting to hear at the AGM how FLK see things, as by default they are very close to this market (too close..?) and hence should have a good feel for the cycle (and risks).
norbert colon
28/7/2015
02:51
Longinthetooth: Are you pessimistic about commercial property in London? I'm very pessimistic about top end residential - much of the buying interest is overseas gamblers (I'm currently in Malaysia, where some wiseheads were telling me that they worry about the London market from a Malaysia equity investor perspective because of the exposure of their corporates and speculative families - you might have guessed I'm not in the market for a £1m 2-bed flat in the Battersea area - nor are the smart Malaysians. Some others are trying to dump their right to buy bought with a 10% deposit). But residential property in the rest of the country (I live in Leicestershire), and (of more relevance to FK),commercial property in London and more especially outside of London is somewhat different. Won't this continue to be driven by economic fundamentals? London is THE global city. Won't economic recovery, not just in the UK, but in Europe and America as well, will continue the commercial trend for a while yet. The growth in Asia is phenomenal - I was blown away at what is happening in Thailand, Singapore and Malaysia. Commercial property is cyclical, but are we really at the top of the cycle/ What do other people think? Glen
profdoc
27/7/2015
09:51
SHIPS are a good generator of management fees no doubt and the potential for capital gains exists.Major concern must be investing at near the top of the market where gains could be replaced by losses!FK have made write offs in the past.You have to ask yourself does a bubble exist in the London property market(commercial as well as residential).The property market in China experienced a major correction with many investors now turning their attention to London which has served to increase prices further still.The party will not go on forever!Unless trading improves the interim dividend looks like being .75p so prospective yield much less than mooted.
longinthetooth
27/7/2015
06:31
It seems to me that a crucial factor in the assessing the prospects for this firm lie in its SHIPS - it now has two in operation SHIPS 14 and SHIPS15. This should result in a two fold benefit (1) additional fees of the order of £200,000 - £300,000 per SHIP (2) capital gain on the sale of the SHIP property (e.g. SHIPS 06 and SHIPS11 combined made a realised capital gain of £174,000 boosting 2014's results. This was on a £500,000 total investment by FK). The latest batch of SHIPS have taken £875,000 of FK's cash to coinvest with outsiders (they oversubscribed because they saw returns of 11% pa and 20% pa in the past on SHIPS06 and SHIPS11) to purchase one property at £9 and another at £8m. That will mean a nice income boost. And, maybe, a capital gain on the amount invested. That is about all I know about the SHIPS. Can anyone help? Does anyone have any information beyond that which is presented by Mr Fletcher?
profdoc
24/7/2015
09:07
A couple of modest sales yesterday at below the bid price sufficient to drag the shares lower still highlights the liquidity risk which should not be ignored.Acquiring commercial property in London at current levels and with increased funding costs likely seems to me an accident waiting to happen!I do not consider that the yield in any way compensates for the risk involved here.In the absence of a trading update prior to the interims(unlikely)the share price seems likely to tread water at best until then.
longinthetooth
23/7/2015
15:19
Just to confirm AGM is on 16th Sep at 9am. This fall is starting to look rather overdone and similar to the spike down in October last year. The yield at the current share price is in excess of 5% and whilst there are some concerns as with any micro-cap, the risk / reward is now looking favourable for patient money. Any drop to 40p or below is a buying opportunity in my opinion.
norbert colon
17/7/2015
12:28
AGM has been 9am for as long as I can remember and shows scant regard for shareholders wishing to attend especially those outside the south east.Anyone with a meaningful shareholding and a particular axe to grind are best advised to arrange to meet with DF in order to air their views as from my experience you never get too far at an AGM!A few loose sellers on very low volumes has driven the price even lower illustrating the point I have previously made with regard to the poor liquidity in this stock.Price could test the 40p level in the short/medium term in the absence of any upturn in trading.
longinthetooth
17/7/2015
10:54
It is certainly in my diary. I have advised the company that 9am is not shareholder friendly and I suggest others complain too.
davidosh
17/7/2015
08:24
David - useful thanks. I will be attending the AGM (even at early hour...) hope to see you there.
norbert colon
16/7/2015
21:34
Fletcher King are mentioned in this radio show... hTTps://audioboom.com/boos/3379592-time-for-a-look-at-small-caps-with-carmensfella
davidosh
16/7/2015
19:31
Don't hold, or intend to but, it was interesting to read the posts from 339. Since late 2007 the market bumped along the bottom for at least 5 years (looking at a long term chart) - until some light at the end of the tunnel could be seen in 2014.
commander t
Chat Pages: 29  28  27  26  25  24  23  22  21  20  19  18  Older
ADVFN Advertorial
Your Recent History
LSE
FLK
Fletcher K..
Register now to watch these stocks streaming on the ADVFN Monitor.

Monitor lets you view up to 110 of your favourite stocks at once and is completely free to use.

By accessing the services available at ADVFN you are agreeing to be bound by ADVFN's Terms & Conditions

P: V: D:20210918 08:54:39