-3x Short China Discussion Threads

[zangdook] 06/4/2011 14:23

crawford

"The Company and Seymour Pierce have received irrevocable undertakings from the Directors and certain other Shareholders who currently hold, in aggregate, 15,384,615 Ordinary Shares at the date of this document, representing 65.9 per cent. of the current issued ordinary share capital of the Company, that they will not accept the Tender Offer"

and

"Accordingly, the maximum number of Ordinary Shares which may be purchased in the Tender Offer is 7,959,155 Ordinary Shares, representing 34.1 per cent. of the issued share capital of the Company."

so I think you're safe. No-one wil be scaled back.

[0rb1t] 06/4/2011 14:12

They want as many shares as possible so that they can refloat later on HK :-/

[crawford] 06/4/2011 12:45

I assume all shares will be tendered? I.e no scaling back?

I want to transfer shares from my wife to me, but only if that won't result in a scaling back, you know how brokers can mess these things up!

[evaluate] 06/4/2011 10:25

I think they will.

They have done every time I've been in this situation before.

[evaluate] 06/4/2011 10:25

I think they will.

They have done every time I've been in this situation before.

[pomp circumstance] 06/4/2011 10:21

IG should pay the tender price

[0rb1t] 06/4/2011 10:20

xd today. 5p dividend but share price only 2.5p down.

[royaloak] 04/4/2011 23:20

michaelmouse

interesting, first time I have seen it, will visit again. Thanks.

CWO (China Wonder) interesting situation now arisen, I hold, can be a wide spread.

[michaelmouse] 02/4/2011 19:23

Dear all

I am currently writing a personal blog, so ignore the link if you're not interested:-



I do refer to CHNS.

Thanks.
Michael.

[rajauk] 31/3/2011 11:52

I hold cfd's with IG markets so anyone know what they are going to do. Don't want to sell now as will only get 365p/share.

[rajauk] 31/3/2011 11:40

Could someone tell me what happens if you hold CFD's or spread bets when this is delisted. Will they just pay us 380p/share.

Raja

[yump] 31/3/2011 11:10

Given the extra problems of really knowing what is happening in these companies with governance, being able to read press coverage in the language etc., I think the risk is actually that you can't use stock picking experience as effectively as you can with a UK stock. So you can think you've got a good one when you haven't - which also goes with UK stocks, but for me in a much smaller way.

So to minimise risk, you have to pick a largish selection, which in the end might be better in a low charging fund, if there is one ?

True the potential growth looks good, but in that case a lower risk share of that could equate to a very good overall return on hand-picked UK stocks.

[zangdook] 31/3/2011 03:09

The 'Chinese love affair with AIM is ending' notion might be overstated IMV. There are still over 20 Chinese stocks on AIM, including two fairly recent newcomers (GLOK and ACHP) and China Meihua over on PLUS, fwiw.

I see the ft article cites RCG as evidence - I don't consider RCG a (mainland) Chinese company - it's a Hong Kong-Macau-Malaysian company.

[rivaldo] 30/3/2011 23:13

Thx again chaps. Qvg, my memory of it is that a number of posters simply couldn't understand why I'd sold, even though I clearly outlined my reasons given that my opinions on the outlook had changed from bullish to cautious given the decline in the telecoms roll-out. Nothing since has changed that view. Certain others posted as you outlined, but then there's some idiots on almost every thread. Hey ho!

Steg, I'm expecting GNG to give me 100%-200% returns from here at the bloody least after all my hard work :o))

I agree with edmundshaw - if I were a CHNS shareholder I wouldn't fancy being part of a privately owned Chinese company taking my chances on what might or might not happen. I admire JTCod's stance, but it's not something I'd want to have a decent amount tied up in.

[edmundshaw] 30/3/2011 22:50

I first bought China Shoto in Feb 2006. Along with 10 other chinese stocks over the years, most from early on. I felt like "Dr. China", at one stage well over 60% of my portfolio was in chinese stocks. The only two that have disappointed were Haike and RCG (of which I only really regret RCG as being a bit slow to realise the problems there). Somehow, I have avoided the worst rip-offs. Just lucky I guess ;-)

It has been a great ride, but, yes, company by company it is coming to an end. Only 4 left now on AIM, sadly, and one of those a bit of a punt if I am honest. All undervalued, naturally. Though not as egregiously as CHNS (and, previously, WCC and ACHL). The profits have been life altering, I have no complaints.

OK, reminiscences over (for now) :)

If I haven't said much over the last couple of years on this BB, it is because it is all said rather well by the likes of Matt & rivaldo, to name the obvious posters. Thanks to them for saving my typing finger!

On reflection, I shall not follow CHNS when it leaves AIM, though I shall be interested if it appears later in HK. The liquidity and lack of transparency between continents becomes too much of a risk for me, unlike with the "relisters". But I expect I shall continuee to follow the company via their web site.

[backwoodsman] 30/3/2011 21:52

Mattjos, Riv - yes, thanks to both. CHNS very much part of my learning curve (on which I am still on the lower slopes)

[dreggspicker] 30/3/2011 21:27

Mattjos, you forgot to mention HMV & Yell, both solid companies ...........

[spangle93] 30/3/2011 21:11

Riv - ref 1267 - can't you encourage GNG to delist as well, as that might be the only way to get more than 40p/sh back? :-(

[mattjos] 30/3/2011 20:19

".... Aim's love affair with China was coming to an end."

The savvy investor must surely recognise that Chinese companies can offer so much more potential for growth than most other Western focused companies.

Typically they are not weighed down with huge pension liabilities, have small decisive boards, founders hold a large proportion of stock & therefore much more aligned in their motivations with investors ... etc etc

I admit that a 'bumpy' ride along the way is part of that growth story though.

Unless the remaining Asian 2007 AIM entrants get greater recognition & more appropriate valuations amongst the uk investment community, i fear we will all be greatly regretting the missed opportunity when they have all left in a year's time.

Investors will then no doubt feel happier investing in such great solid companies eg. Lloyds, RBS, Dixons, Woolworths etc.

What is up with folk?

Rant over. Best of luck Shoto! .. shame on you Seymour Pierce, I feel i managed to help push this stock value up to someting like half it's true value on the basis on my one visit to see Shoto & report back on this thread. What have SEYP done for their fees? One poorly written broker note, pretty much ignored by the market.

[cordwainer] 30/3/2011 19:56

My lucky tiddly winks:

16Jul08: Bought 254 @ 118.45p
10Dec08: Bought 283 @ 99.7p
11May09: Sold ALL @ 178p (automatic stop loss trigger
..profit = 57.9% / £347.44 after dealing costs)
29Sep09: Bought 168 @ 172.4p (still held)

[qvg] 30/3/2011 19:13

rivaldo, as I remember it, it was not the fact of you selling that was criticised. It was that your conversion from an enthusiastic advocate of CHNS to a seller was so sudden that some suspected that you had been saying one thing and doing another.

[rivaldo] 30/3/2011 18:59

Calahan, many thanks. Initially I was almost always on my own here when I kept on about how CHNS was undervalued (until Mattjos arrived), and then I was on my own (and was roundly criticised) for selling out at 425p or whatever it was. I wish you'd posted a bit more often :o))

Interesting article which will be in tomorrow's FT - I would also be "miffed" about a P/E of only 4. I expect the CEO's of GNG and PMHL are similarly "miffed" at their ridiculous undervaluations as Chinese companies on AIM, on a P/E of 5 and valued at less than third of tangible NAV respectively:



"Battery charger

China Shoto, the lead-acid battery maker that joined Aim at the end of 2005, is to leave the market. Its decision underlines this column's prediction in February, when biometrics specialist RCG Holdings announced plans to depart, that Aim's love affair with China was coming to an end.

Investors who backed China Shoto from the start, when the shares were priced at 130p, have done well. There is a tender offer for 380p a share, plus the full-year dividend of 5p. The offer is at a 54 per cent premium to Tuesday's closing price, and is not far from the peak of 418½p.

The company has had its ups and downs, but has made progress. So Yang Shanji, founder and executive chairman who has a 65 per cent stake, must be miffed to see that the price/earnings multiple before the offer was just 4."

[qvg] 30/3/2011 16:07

philw, mine are in my SIPP too. But even if they were not, I do not think I would hold.
Yes, thanks to Mattjos for your valuable contribution. I have looked at PMHL, but it is not my cup of tea. If AIM ever runs out of Chinese stock, there are still a good supply quoted in US. I like CHOP and CNTF (disclosure of interest, I hold both)