Cleantech Lithium Share Discussion Threads

[rangers99] 05/5/2002 10:53

From what we know of both CTL and TripleArc then the respective valuations look absurd. CTL has a far stronger looking balance sheet (the majority of TripleArc's comprises intangibles). Also CTL must have revenues of 15M+ (including ColourFlow). Both companies loss-making although CTL should now be profitable if management are to be believed. So how can TripleArc be valued at 7 times CTL when the businesses are basically doing exactly the same thing?

It begs the question: What do you do if you're holding TripleArc shares and are still a strong believer in the online print game? I know what Id do. First thing on Tuesday morning Id sell the lot and buy CTL. Arguably you are buying back your shares at 15% of the sell price (and into a stronger looking company into the bargain).

dyor etc.

Im a ramper.

[minuteman] 04/5/2002 15:17

I know of the company and their product, and agree with all posted!

So Calleva, what do you reckon? The reason, I went with Controlp was the fact that they are hedging their profits by buying Documedia, which has saved them the cash burn, that Triple Arc will now be suffering from.

But then I don't want to say too much before you say I am ramping! ;-)

[rangers99] 04/5/2002 03:41

Heres the citywire article

TripleArc's maiden results show a year of development costs but Joanne Wallen thinks the online print buying company needs to start justifying its valuation, which dwarfs the competition.

Shares today were down 2.75p at 29.5p, valuing the start-up, loss-making business at £19.2 million. Conversely, AIM-listed Controlp (CTL), which claims to do the same thing as TripleArc (TPA) and has turnover of £12 million with 100 employees, is today valued at just £2.7 million.

TripleArc, which floated on AIM in December raising £3.1 million, was set up two and a half years ago by chief executive Conor O'Brien to fill the gap he'd found when he was working for London-listed medical technology company Medisys and attempting to buy printed materials of a consistent quality.

TripleArc's chairman and major shareholder Dr David Wong is chief executive of Medisys. Wong holds 34.3% of TripleArc, and between them directors hold 54.51% of the company, which could be one reason the share price has stayed as high as it is.

TripleArc's first product, the TripleArc Print Catalogue, enables companies to fill out a template online for a range of products from business cards to corporate brochures. They can then produce a ready-to-print file in PDF format and deliver it online to their preferred printer.

Last year TripleArc got together with print management company gl2 to develop a complete print management collaborative workflow system that would enable print buyers to specify their requirements, send them automatically to a group of designated printers, receive a quotation online and order the print run.

In October, TripleArc acquired gl2. The new Workflow system was launched only three weeks ago at the IPEX European print show, and O'Brien told Citywire that the company came away with 18 printers signed up.

Turnover for last year to December therefore was made up mainly of gl2's turnover. Revenues were £1.44 million, with gross profit of £250,000. Operating losses after goodwill amortisation of £700,000 and a £250,000 non-cash share option compensation charge were £1.6 million.

TripleArc aims to get most of its money from the printers, since it charges 3% of the value of their contract for the catalogue product and 1.5% on the collaborative workflow product.

The system is aimed at either corporate print buying departments that spend more than £8 million a year on print buying, or at print management companies that buy on behalf of corporate customers. Print management companies will also be charged a fee based on their turnover.

O'Brien reckons the system saves around 50% to 60% of the time taken using the traditionally manual methods for print specification, quotation and ordering.

O'Brien also claims that TripleArc is the first company to use the newly defined Job Definition Format (JDF), which has been agreed by a print industry consortium of more than 120 companies. This format enables printers to easily import information from TripleArc into their own systems.

Warren Tayler, chairman of Controlp, told Citywire that Controlp does all the things TripleArc's systems claims to do. It has large corporate customers as well as small business customers, and recently bought some businesses off the receiver that Taylor said 'we are very pleased with'. Controlp is in its closed period prior to announcing year end results next month, but Tayler said he was 'pleased with progress to date'.

Citywire Verdict:

If TripleArc's idea were totally original, this would make up for the fact that it does not currently have any business to speak of in the technology, as opposed to the print management, business.

However, private companies such as elateral and Paspartoo, both featured on Citywire in the past, not to mention Controlp, have created similar systems.

The idea of automating and simplifying the purchasing of large or even small corporate print runs seems to make a huge amount of sense and there is no reason why there should not be space for several players. But if TripleArc is fairly valued, Controlp must be a screaming buy. Somewhere in the middle is more likely the case.

[dmhzx] 03/5/2002 23:35

Interesting article on Citywire today (www.citywire.co.uk):
It ends with:
"The idea of automating and simplifying the purchasing of large or even small corporate print runs seems to make a huge amount of sense and there is no reason why there should not be space for several players. But if TripleArc is fairly valued, Controlp must be a screaming buy. "

[minuteman] 03/5/2002 18:07

Calleva: Apathy yes!, what can I say, I cannot make hundreds of trades happen.

I have bought doing MY research, am happy with my investment. IT is for the long term, I have never said anything different.

As for knowing nothing about the company, yes I do dent that, i have spent around 100 hours research looking at them.

As you clearly have the hump, it would be wise for you to sell, as you are not comfy (probably by not doing any research) I hold a nice amount £10k worth and am very happy.

I haven't posted here for a few days because there has been no news and no trades! Pointless talking for the sake of it isn't it.

As for ramping: I have posted the vitues of the company , been asked question etc.. and tried to answer as best as possible.

You know I wrote a reply back to you not a couple of weeks ago stated my long term position here, yet you keep going on about these like you are in it for the short term:

Deny?

[calleva] 03/5/2002 16:37

kermat, I'm not wrong then? ;-)

[kermat] 03/5/2002 16:33

Calleva,

Apathy is right, but this is no different than many other small cap tech shares at the moment. The MM's can afford to move the price around a bit in an attempt to stimulate a market in the shares. The fall in the price is not a cause for concern long term as in is accompanied by low volumes.

In minutemans defence he has always claimed that it is the long term prospects that are attractive and that he's not in it for the short term. I don't think he can be accused of ramping really, anymore than most other people that post on these boards, myself included. If you own a share, you obviously regard it as a good investment so people communicating the virtues of shares they own should be no surprise.

I'm going back to sleep now...

[calleva] 03/5/2002 14:15

More likely the ramping you have been doing for the last few weeks has proved to be nothing more tha that. You know nothing and the company is going nowhere. The price has dropped out of apathy. Deny?

[minuteman] 30/4/2002 23:40

Can't tell you fella, there would be 2 theories imho.

1/ Bad news expected and people selling. This I don't go with as volumes have been very small.(even the 150k yesterday was only 10k's worth)
2/ There is good news expecting and MM's are accumilating a bit of stock on the cheap.

After last two press releases and the companies insitance that everything is on track and no nasties expected, I'd plum for option 2. I mean, down today on less than £3 k. Tiny volume! I am not to worried,

But dyor etc, etc...

[beckaroo] 30/4/2002 23:23

Is there any news on why this share is falling fast? Its on little volume but does anyone know a underlying reason?

[minuteman] 25/4/2002 16:48

Agreed.

But that said, I am only looking for break even results, the press releases now will all be pertinant for next years reulsts which is what we are looking at.

Target set, just need these results to confirm progress as already stated by the company!

[calleva] 25/4/2002 16:28

Unfortunately two months too late to be reflected in the full year results. Hope we do not have to wait until August this year for them?

[minuteman] 25/4/2002 14:40

Having read the press release about the Bezier deal, I was rushin out and missed this, another press release but dated a couple of days before:

Here's the text from CTL press releases

ControlP is set to close three or four orders for its Edit2Print system, which was launched at Ipex.
“I didn’t expect to sign anything at the show”, said general manager Daniel Emerson.
“I’m delighted to have early movers in the market make decisions on the spot. The show has surpassed all expectations,” he added.
The firm has also revealed the identities of three companies that are already using the system: The Color Co (which shares a common chairman with ControlP), Bezier, and print management firm HH Associates.
The firms are using the web-based print design and ordering system to service major clients, including government agencies, financial institutions and utilities and marketing firm.
One user uploaded 40GB of images and processed 1,500 orders in 10 days on the system.
“People have seen what e-commerce can do,” said Emerson. “They are saying, “I know what I need, and I need to find someone to supply it.”

ends;;;;


I RATHER LIKE THE BULLISH COMMENTS HIGHLIGHTED IN PERENTHASIS, DON'T YOU??

[minuteman] 25/4/2002 14:37

Calleva:

Yes it's is very interesting! Indicates they have done their homework on CTL, and like what they see.

Lets hope CTL deliver those standards, for all our good.

regards

[minuteman] 25/4/2002 14:31

Kermat:

I would have thought so too, and it was a mjor reason for going into these especially as we all know that the industry is not doing very well on the whole!

[calleva] 25/4/2002 13:17

Bezier have an interesting statement on the qualities expected of their suppliers

[kermat] 25/4/2002 09:36

CB,

If print co's are trying to cut costs, surely that is good for CTL.

[minuteman] 25/4/2002 07:45

I'd just like to point out, I know neither of the above, posters.

[gicikbe6e] 24/4/2002 20:42

What a stupid old pratt who thinks he knows everything.

ehueheu.

[stewjames] 24/4/2002 18:57

How much of a leap of faith are you making here, minuteman? Obviously you think the figures he's quoted are viable, but how likely would you have thought those sort of results if he'd never said a thing? (Difficult question to answer I realise, 'cos he HAS made the comments) Curious, not critical.

[minuteman] 24/4/2002 18:55

Oh look another new deal

link:-



Keep em rolling boys. Don't know the value does anyone else!!?

[minuteman] 24/4/2002 18:53

LOL, No he is not !!

I am quite happy with the noises from the company and will add further on good results