Wasps 22 Discussion Threads

[ozzie_dog] 25/4/2022 12:57

Wow! The bond price just shot up, does anyone know if there was some news realised?

[grahamg8] 17/4/2022 16:13

Dandigirl I think we are saying the same thing in different ways. The consequences of not repaying the bonds would be a disaster for Richardson and his cronies. Damaged reputations would be the least of their problems. Business is a rough game and missing a payment needs to be avoided at all costs. Which would you rather, give up your hard earned cash and stay friends with Richardson or get repaid? Not much thought needed to decide on that one.

[dandigirl] 14/4/2022 19:03

What are you on about? Don't be daft.

Richardson and his fellow directors care about Richardson and his fellow directors.

Richardson has kept this going by funding our interest when revenues were zip.

Having ploughed a lot of money into this over the last few years, he is hardly likely to let it go bust now for want of paying one lot of interest. If he couldn't find the principal he would have asked to extend. He hasn't.

All the signs are that we can expect full repayment as due.

[grahamg8] 14/4/2022 18:42

Who gives a monkeys about Richardson or the Directors? We have a mortgage on the ground. If they don't pay up on 13 May then we can sell it to the highest bidder, which could well be Coventry City. They will be out of a job and I suspect out of pocket. Reputations don't mean a great deal when you are in the dole queue.

[dandigirl] 14/4/2022 10:05

I don't think so.

It's not as easy as that.

The reputational damage and consequences to Richardson and the other directors would be enormous.

[bondholder] 14/4/2022 08:04

That's my feeling. Replacement cost must be north of 150 million given the inflation of construction costs recently.

[grahamg8] 14/4/2022 07:33

If Wasps Holdings finances blew up and the Directors of Coventry City had their heads screwed on then they would buy up the stadium on the cheap. Wasps Rugby just move to another ground. We get paid back and everyone is happy?????

[bondholder] 13/4/2022 20:59

Everton have "locked in" construction costs for their new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock, which should prevent the price of the £500 million project from spiralling upwards.Work on the 52,888-capacity waterfront stadium started in the summer of 2021 and is scheduled to be completed after the start of the 2024-25 campaign. That will leave Everton officials with a decision on whether to leave their present home of Goodison Park mid-season.Makes the CBS arena look like a steal at 50 million.

[bondholder] 11/4/2022 08:18

Fingers crossed touch wood......

[dandigirl] 10/4/2022 12:18

Too late to make an extension offering now IMV.

Refund due 13/05.

[dandigirl] 04/4/2022 18:48

Increasingly it looks like WAS1 will be repaid as due.

[dandigirl] 04/4/2022 18:47

1.24 seems a good price. We have enough COOP having bought these a few years ago now.

IMV Coop Group is a better risk than ENQ. Moreover, you can rest easy that barring something really unfortunate happening, they will be redeemed in 2025.

[jimpy6365] 04/4/2022 17:32

Will take a look. My £5000 co-op 11% is giving almost 9% on purchase4 price of £6200.

[dandigirl] 31/3/2022 12:20

jimpy - if it is income you are after you may wish to look at ENQUEST ENQ1 and the proposed new financing @ 9%.

[jimpy6365] 31/3/2022 10:49

Yes, since I want income and not concerned over capital depreciation, Co-op Group Final Repayment Notes 11% 2025

[dandigirl] 28/3/2022 19:37

Can't what the problem is if the refinancing is to be used to repay the bonds in full at maturity. Super, duper, I say.

Of course, the directors should not deal.

[grahamg8] 28/3/2022 17:20

Wasps Holdings are on record as seeking to refinance the debt and thereby repay the bonds. As Holdings are not listed this can go on behind closed doors. But if the refinancing is agreed, eg simply as a mortgage on the ground, would knowledge of the fact be market sensitive information and require an RNS from Finance which is listed. I would have thought so, they have common Directors so can hardly claim ignorance of what is going on.

[dandigirl] 28/3/2022 15:57

Doubt it.

It’s just that repayment is now 5 weeks Friday. Almost too short to make an offering and also have a Plan B.

[bondholder] 28/3/2022 12:19

Have I missed something ? Lol

[dandigirl] 28/3/2022 08:02

Looks like we are heading for repayment on due date. A buying opportunity indeed.

[a0002577] 27/3/2022 13:09

With just over 6 weeks to go until maturity one must ask the question

What would persuade you to rollover into a successor loan?

Would such a loan have to pay a bigger coupon to cover the increased inflationary risk for example or would the covenants need to be strengthened?

[grahamg8] 23/3/2022 07:21

fastcat we are on the same page here. I also covered equity in the general comment that I would buy when I saw a suitable opportunity, even though my inclination is to keep more cash than is usual for me. At the end of the day it is all about maximising profit, whether that comes from capital or income is irrelevant, while controlling risk within our own personal criteria.

Anyone selling WAS1 now is either 1) expecting a payout less than 90%, or 2) desperate for cash, or 3) clueless.

[fastcat99] 22/3/2022 20:29

Graham (I presume) - Apologies, you were indeed very clear.
Indeed, by mentioning that you had set a limit to your exposure last year and that you still won't revise that now (despite the current market-price offering a good impression of "shooting fish in a barrel"!!), you are teaching ME a valuable lesson, both in making a close judgement and how to communicate it.
Altogether far more useful than aringading's slightly disingenuous account that he had sold his entire holding last week because he prefers equity (in general) to bonds (to my reading #393 and his following posts did not get much clearer than just that; unless in reality he strongly rejects the premiss of #394's comment "assuming the bonds pay back at 100%, which seems likely", but doesn't wish to say as much)

[grahamg8] 22/3/2022 17:26

Sorry fastcat is para 2 of #404 too vague for you, ''I think there is a buying opportunity for the bonds''?

[fastcat99] 22/3/2022 13:41

Rather than drifting away into ‘FOMO elsewhere’ territory, do let’s stick to the theme of this thread, as originally named: - is the consensus here that this bond no longer represents a “buying opportunity”?