Sunkar Share Discussion Threads

[bones30] 21/7/2014 19:32

Been enjoying reading some of these as one can learn from them.

Quick VGM question:

> All the major IIs must also have known - because they refused to invest (despite the apparently ridiculously low sp).

Didn't Sprott have a holding there?

[paulb10] 21/7/2014 18:56

at least the volumes are low today

[mike1962] 21/7/2014 14:36

A complete and utter scam
I am awaiting a response to my letter of complaint from the FCA although they say it will take at least 21 days for a reply ?

[hereford29] 21/7/2014 10:22

and if all this is so endemic, it must be possible to make spectacular amounts of money by shorting the many fraudulent companies and releasing reports that alert the market. Companies like Gotham must hardly be scratching the surface.

[hereford29] 21/7/2014 10:15

ACHL - supplied more orange juice to Chinese buyers than the total orange juice consumption of China.

Is this true? where did it state this? If this was demonstrably the case, then there is one example of a company against which fraud action must be possible.

[targatarga] 20/7/2014 20:55

august - I still think your wasting your time....
loads of pi's have been brainwashed by similar spin.
The old line - that more was made in the goldrush by the people selling pic's and shovels, than was ever dug out of the ground still holds true!

[augustusgloop] 19/7/2014 14:53

Are you really suggesting that this was more complicated than ENRON?
Or WorldCom or Robert Maxwell?
Or Sinoforest?
Or Bernie Madoff.

There are many, many others that are more complicated than swapping a few samples and slipping a few locals a couple of grand to make false statements.

$100+ million is a lot of money in Kazakhstan.

[paulb10] 19/7/2014 14:08

Elban what you are suggesting is the most elaborate and complicated crime of the century. I still do not believe anybody has the capability to plan something in that level of detail. Indeed, even the planning military might of the usa and its CIA would struggle to impliment and control such a complicated plot.

[augustusgloop] 19/7/2014 12:29

The stuff that is claimed for some of these foreign AIM companies was truly spectacularly misleading.

ACHL - supplied more orange juice to Chinese buyers than the total orange juice consumption of China.

WCC - produced more cement to local Chinese projects than was actually used throughout the whole of their region.

VGM - needed £5m to take production up to 100k oz in 6 months.
4 years and £20m later they still need another £50m.

---------------------

All the directors must have known.
The workers must have known.
The auditors clearly did not do a proper Audit.
All the major IIs must also have known - because they refused to invest (despite the apparently ridiculously low sp).
Their competitors must have known - because they didn't try to buy them on the cheap.

[augustusgloop] 19/7/2014 12:22

paulb,

name those studies.

Suppose I buy a field.
Then buy some product from a mineral rich resource.
I then send this product to be analysed by a respected company - claiming that it is from my field.
I then send the highly positive report from this company to another highly regarded company to do a definitive feasibility study.
[Along with projections and promises of sales (that do not actually exist).]
I also then get 'drill results' from a local company that I can influence.

How much do you think that I could claim that this field is now worth.

The whole system in Kazakhstan is corrupt.
[Look at how the courts shafted HMB with fines - forcing it into local ownership, then reducing the fines to the new owners.]

[tippa1] 19/7/2014 11:55

Well, since there appears to be no way to take action against the company or the controlling interests involved, the takeover panel say that the takeover was more than fair and did not breach any rules, and the regulators have no evidence of fraud, perhaps the best course of action would be to hire on of these guys as a NED, and ipo my own company, spend all the money, and buy it back for peanuts.

[paulb10] 19/7/2014 10:48

Over the time lots has been said about the christali project a lot of the info has come from the KAZ government in the form of press releases from the development of the actobe region. Their have been various studies carried out by respected companies. I would be amazed if all of these people have all been conned into believing that this is a valuable asset

[chway14] 19/7/2014 08:01

augustusgloop/Elban
When one looks back at events ,it looks like Elban was correct from the very beginning.
Pity,we did not take notice of him as many would not have lost so much.

[tamoshanter3] 18/7/2014 21:29

Blue chip or place your chips in the 2nd/3rd world. That's the choice

[faza3] 18/7/2014 21:28

for me kazahstan and russia is no GO territory as well as the majority of AIM

DO NOT WORRY THIS IS ONLY MONEY THEY ARE PRINTING A LOT RECENTLY
PETROPAVLOVSK 20£ AND now 30 p elaban mr detective you missed one scam hahahah

[faza3] 18/7/2014 18:31

I'm shocked I don't understand this discussion everything is finished here isn't it

[hereford29] 18/7/2014 18:10

I'm shocked, really. Maybe you think that I'm being disingenuous, or just stupid, or I'm am pretending to be someone else, but I'm not. I am an investor in all these and a few other companies. I have also had concerns and I think that based on what you say, I will take legal advice on whether anything could be done to force and investigation or disclosure. It may well be endemic across AIM and very difficult to prove, but there is always evidence left, and even if the business is a scam, there are real people employed in positions of responsibility who are vicariously liable for the company's position in the event fraud is proved.

[hereford29] 18/7/2014 17:44

That is a very bleak view of the markets. But if what you say is true about Sunkar, then it needs to be taken further, and I am quite sure it cannot be simply covered up. What other companies do you currently have on your list? Do you publish your views on your own website? I would like to find out more.

[augustusgloop] 18/7/2014 17:44

targatara,

I think that many of the miners on AIM were a scam - in one way or another.
Particularly the gold miners.

Nearly all the Chinese companies on AIM were a scam.

Over a 5 year period, I would say that at least $300m was scammed from the few companies that I followed.
[Mostly from SKR and RCG.]

[augustusgloop] 18/7/2014 17:40

NEDs get paid for not knowing.

Some scams involved factories and forests that didn't even exist.
The NEDs didn't know - have a nice meeting in an expensive hotel.
Discuss the strategy of this non-existent business.
Have a nice meal with expensive wine.
Perhaps even a tour of someone else's factory.

They turn up for a chat and a bit of socialising - pocket the expenses.

RCG bought a company for about £70m that the year before had no assets and no income and no staff and no expenses (not even a phone bill).
When bought its only asset was a massive order for RCG product to 3 Chinese companies.
The NEDs had no problem with this.
Needless to say - the orders never materialised.
This information was in the IPO for the HK listing - nobody noticed it.

How many frauds have been revealed?
Loads.
How many frauds have been covered up?
Loads.

None of the NEDs ever said a word.

[targatarga] 18/7/2014 17:36

AUGUST - I think your wasting your time!
but just one question... how many millions get raked off in your opinion from uk smaller shareholders in a year.... tia

[hereford29] 18/7/2014 17:14

Really? No, I didn't know, I didn't read anything about this two years ago. So you think Charles that NED chap was also responsible and aware? You are a kind of lone GOTHAM research? You must have made a lot of money be shorting the stock? How about FML and BZM, do you think these are scams as well?

[augustusgloop] 18/7/2014 16:58

Did ENRON or World COM or Mirror Group not have Auditors or NEDs?

Is this the same Donald Sinclair whose close relative sold loads of SKR shares just after the share price rose when DS notified a small purchase?

Which Auditors are we talking about?
The latest ones, or the ones that were removed after refusing to accept the validity of the sales figures in the interims?

Are you sure that the Director's owned that many?????
Who says?

The other major owners (look in the IPO) doc vanished without trace (look in the accounts).
This was all discussed extensively years ago.

----------------------

What is the alternative?

That every farmer in Kazakhstan, Russia and China refused to by the cheapest fertiliser on the market.
But the Directors decided to keep spending millions producing it anyway???
[For 4 years.]

That every promised sale, suddenly vanished?

How come I could forecast this outcome 2 years ago?
Just lucky?

------------------

I am well known for identifying these scams:

VGM - at 210p --- now gone for 2p
JLP - at 35p ---- now still scamming at 1.4p
HAWK - at 30p -- MD sacked
GNG - at 30p - still scamming at 3p
RCG - at 39p - management sacked (or locked up) - assets stolen, now 1.6p
And others

I have a 100% record on this sort of thing.
Every management team that I have called liars have either been removed, delisted from the UK or have had their shares drop by 80+%.

There are red flags for these scams - most PIs just ignore them.

ELBAN