Intu Properties Share Discussion Threads

[onehanded] 30/1/2020 15:33

think this could be a near total wipe out for share holders with massive dilution.

[zoro9791] 30/1/2020 15:03

I am affraid I had to bail out with small loss.This is not going to end up nicely.Good luck for the holders.

[arbus5000] 30/1/2020 12:31

so your predicting a share price based on a movie?

[rumobejo] 30/1/2020 12:18

anyone watched the movie GET OUT?!!!

single digit coming before any rights issue that is likely to be at 5p or less

5p

[arbus5000] 30/1/2020 10:01

by my count they have around 600 mln cash sitting on their balance sheet.

The market cap is 300mln.

At this rate, i'd buy INTU, and have an extra 300 mln to negiotate with the bond creditors - and the interest is well covered.

Let me see if i can get a hold of my personal banker, haven't done an LBO like this since the 80s :D

[williamcooper104] 29/1/2020 19:51

Sorry - should have said over 10 years ago But wouldn't be surprised to see a few pre credit crunch cmbss still being worked out/alive in 10 years time They are that toxic (or amazing) depending on whether you are equity or a creditor

[williamcooper104] 29/1/2020 19:25

It is - but I would be super careful touching pre-credit crunch cmbs I think liberty (as was then) may have issued the most junior note to themselves - often the most junior creditor gets to call the shots and can appoint the special servicer Basically unless you have read the underlying loan doc (not public) and completly understand the structure, and who most likely owns what, you have no idea what's what But in short highly likely however controls intus equity can keep this alive for a long time I know of a few cmbs deals that defaulted over 19 years ago and are still goon g

[nickrl] 29/1/2020 19:20

Williamcooper the FT article infers that the trigger at this level will see cash held within this facility and Metrocentre bond reports shows they had c44m income in 2018 so presumably 20m has to go interest so if, big if, then they would keep back c20m thus at best 160m by the bonds expiry 2028. This is one of there cheaper bonds as well so wouldn't be great if there hand is forced.

[williamcooper104] 29/1/2020 18:54

Fast casual was seen a few years ago as the saviour of shopping centres - but of course there were far too many mid-market casual dinners opened

[williamcooper104] 29/1/2020 18:48

Ahh - so it's not a covenant breach at all but a trigger event The pace of property decline is of course worrying But it's not going to collapse intu This is a pre-credit crunch cmbs so it will be extremely difficult for lenders to do much if values fall further

[williamcooper104] 29/1/2020 18:38

It's, I think, a trigger event on a cmbs - not necessarily the same as a covenant default May just mean that all operating cash is held back in the structure and possibly an increase in interest rate Still not exactly good news of course

[nickrl] 29/1/2020 18:16

This debt was quoted at 58% LTV in there 31/12/18 update to bondholders so thats a fair deterioration but other REITs have seen worse so im surprised more of there bonds arent underwater.

Also presumably the valuer has sight of the lease events over the last 12 months to inform the assessment?

[arbus5000] 29/1/2020 16:51

thats 70% on one property. globally across the portfolio its around 50% i beleive.

now the covenant breach is an reason to pay the bond back

[eipgam] 29/1/2020 16:36

Just checked... two thousand posts ago!

[eipgam] 29/1/2020 16:33

I thought the decision to invest in casual dining in Newcastle was a bad one, as mentioned a thousand posts ago (it's odd how busy these boards get when the share price goes down)

[andyhooley] 29/1/2020 15:46

Confirmation I nailed it. Thank you Jak.

[monte1] 29/1/2020 14:27

I am guessing that the avatar ‘andyhooley217; was not around all those years ago at the time of all that unsavoury business jak.