Fluormin Share Discussion Threads

[dreggspicker] 26/4/2012 13:51

Yes, low production but with alot of digging over of the site this is probably understandable, the ore sorter looks promising ......

[enigma2002] 26/4/2012 13:44

q3 update



bit mixed, headgrade improved to 8.6% but costs also up.

[dropside] 23/4/2012 19:52

This is no ordinary small company for sure - the major shareholder and the directors are serious heavy-weights.

[cyprussteve] 23/4/2012 16:29

Thanks dreggs,
The following was part of my rationale in investing here :



"James Passinjoined Firebird in 1999. He co-founded and manages Firebird Global Fund, Firebird Global Fund II, and Firebird Mongolia Fund, and Firebird New Mongolia Fund. James is a graduate of St. John's College, where he majored in philosophy and classical literature. James serves on the board of directors of several Mongolian and Canadian companies, including Sharyn Gol JSC (MSE: SHG), Baganuur JSC (MSE: BAN), BDSec JSC (MSE: BDS), National Investment Bank of Mongolia, Undur Tolgoi Minerals Inc. (CNSX: UTM), as well as Fluormin PLC (AIM: FLOR), a UK fluorspar mining company. James is also the Chairman and CEO of Vanoil Energy, Ltd. (TSXVX: VEL), a Canadian oil exploration company focused on Kenya and Rwanda. James was named "Fund Manager of the Year" at the 2012 Mines and Money Conference in Hong Kong."

[dreggspicker] 23/4/2012 16:11

nice to have you on board Stevie,.....

[cyprussteve] 23/4/2012 16:09

I bought in this afternoon.
As always - this is risk vs reward profile, but, the quality of Management and strong cash position persuade me that this is seriously undervalued at present.
As always, time will tell.
Ciao
Steve

[dropside] 20/4/2012 21:29

dreggs, agreed. A week ago the cif Rotterdam price was 500-530( I believe the FOB price (China or Durban) is about 50 less so 450-480. I'd say the price has strengthened a little in the last week.

[dreggspicker] 20/4/2012 19:25

I think prices are edging back up a little should be 450 - 500 on spot acid prices, see link below

[dreggspicker] 18/4/2012 22:38

Well maybe been around a while but in theory still plenty of reserves;



"Witkop Fluorspar Mine ("Witkop") commenced operations in 1972. With the exception of periods of suspension Witkop has been producing and selling acid grade fluorspar since that time. Witkop is located 18km south of the town of Zeerust in the North Western Province of South Africa, approximately 250km northwest of Johannesburg.
Following extensive refurbishment and upgrading, the mine recommenced production in March 2011. Witkop plans to mine at a production rate of approximately 1.5Mtpa ROM, producing an average of 140,000tpa of acidspar over a 10 year LOM plan.
Product is sold via the deep water port at Durban and is dispatched to Durban by train from the Company's rail-siding.
Resources
The mineral resource estimate for Witkop is set out below and is classified in accordance with the SAMREC Code. It was prepared in February 2011 by Mr Jansen, an independent geological consultant, and subsequently reviewed by Coffey Mining in the preparation of the CPR contained in the AIM Admission documents (September 2011). Based on the data and the methods used, Coffey considers the mineral resource estimates to represent a fair estimate of the mineralisation. The SAMREC compliant mineral resource is tabulated below.
Witkop Fluorite Mine
Summary of the Mineral Resources (March 2011)
9% CaF2 Cut off grade applied
Resource Category Tonnage (Mt) Grade CaF2 % Ore Type
Measured 20.60 13.1 Algal Ore
Indicated 39.00 13.5 Algal Ore
TOTAL Measured and Indicated Resources 59.60 13.4 Algal Ore
Inferred - - Algal Ore
Inferred 0.77 29.4 Wad Ore
TOTAL Inferred Resources 0.77 29.4 Algal and Wad Ore
Notes Mineral resources are estimates for which uncertainties are conveyed through rounding of figures presented in the table.
Mineral Resources are reported inclusive of mineral reserves

Reserves
The Mineral Reserve declaration in accordance with the SAMREC Code is presented in the table below:
Witkop Fluorite Mine
Summary of the Mineral Reserve Estimate for Witkop (January 2011)
Tonnage (Mt) Grade CaF2 (%) Contained CaF2 (t)
Proved Reserves 14.8 11.8 1,754,000
Probable Reserves
Notes The tonnage and grade reported for the Mineral Reserves are based on 16per cent dilution of between 3.2per cent and 5.6per cent CaF2 with geological and mining losses of 5per cent as estimated by Witkop.."

[bam bam rubble] 18/4/2012 18:17

Shareholders were better off if the cash received last year from Glencore for the Maghreb assets would have been returned via a one-off dividend before quietly de-listing.

The proceeds were equivalent to 3.52p old price (88p per share new price) based on 180m shares as of July 2010 - the cutoff date before they started placing shares to buy into Sallies etc. Instead the share price now sits at 27p (1.08p old price) having wasted funds on a tired late-life mine with poor grade and low recovery which may need tens of millions thrown at it to come good. As a result this now has to rise 225% just to give shareholders the same return they would have got from the Maghreb asset disposal.

[pisces4] 18/4/2012 15:42

not happy at all dreggs , this is by far my worst performing share of 2012,just hope it doesnt take another 2 years to get my money back!oh why didnt i sell in the 60`s,never learn!wouldnt even buy anymore at present,virtually no volumes whatsoever,not good for shareprice movement.Who said patience is a virtue?

[dime] 18/4/2012 12:33

Otherwise known as BORING!! Rather disappointing as I had thought they had been looking at an acquisition in the uk with some interest. Anyone else any thoughts on this one?

[dreggspicker] 18/4/2012 10:05

Everyone seems " happy" with their holdings, virtually no selling or buying ..........

[dreggspicker] 13/4/2012 19:53

Think it might have been me on thursday -10k @ 14.25
recon I over paid by 0.3p ....
See you at the AGM then !!

[dropside] 13/4/2012 19:45

dreggs, I think someone bought just after me on Thursday, otherwise it was just you and me buying, dunno if we can push the price back up to 50p lol!
Seriously though, I am not a trader and have no idea where the price might go in the short term. I have followed this company since the earlier Maghreb days and just know this is a huge potential company for the current price, a real value investment. I don't want to sell much else to raise cash for FLOR but if the FLOR price were to fall back I would..
Don't live in Derbyshire but still Midlands, in Worcestershire. Would be good to have a pint, could be, if we both make it there, after the next AGM to celebrate our great success!
Your last sentence is interesting, and I agree,there would be no benefit in continuing in a loss making venture and I wouldn't see Passin wearing it.

[dreggspicker] 13/4/2012 19:16

Must be just you and me buying at the mo dropside :+] - but I really don't have much ammo left without selling things I would rather not;
If you live anywhere Derbyshire I will buy you a pint, then we can then both cry into our beer at the current share price .....
I had't thought about the stock pile at Witkop, if we presume it is of good quality - acid grade lets say we have alittle less then at Xmas 8k tns at say a base case of $350 the stock would be around $2.8m a good amount for a orderly wind-down, but like you I don't expect this to happen unless the fluor prices really take a dive...
I did ask at that meeting if we would suffer digging the stuff out at a loss for a long period, and was told we would shut it .........

[dropside] 13/4/2012 17:29

dreggs, I take the picture as painted in the RNS's as accurate, you have met them, I think this management plays it very straight and they have given a fair reflection.

The cash element here is important, this gives many options and they are not one of those companies that needs to worry about the next placing.

There are problems at Witkop, however we have a very experienced and competent set of directors, that much is clear from the CVs alone, and they have already delivered real value (huge or at least something) on the Glencore off-take agreement and profit on the KFC deal. Not a lot was paid for Witkop and it now sits on the books, after the write-down, for very little. If they can get it sorted out in the short or mid term (e.g. with the ore sorter) then it will be very valuable. IF (unlikely, but the option at least is implied in the RNS) they have to put it on care and maintenance again then, I think, it should not be at a cost as the tied up working capital would all unwind out of it as the stock was sold. I trust them to make the right decisions about Witkop.

The fluorspar pricing is hard to forecast, currently as dreggs says it is still over $400. The Fluormin RNS's point to lower prices over the mid-term. I guess even they would say this is only opinion though, and less clear once things get over several months out; I am happy if they plan on a low price scenario. Longer term I don't think there can be any doubt about the value of a strategic position in fluorspar and maybe a lower price will support an acquisition strategy?

I am sure none of us wanted to be here with issues at Witkop, but here we are, and it is fully reflected in the share price. More than fully IMHO (cash plus a bit for Tunisia), which is why I have been buying again today and yesterday.

Have a good weekend all,
dropside

[dropside] 13/4/2012 16:03

The 7191 buy was mine also the one earlier today. This is priced at virtually cash plus a bit for Tunisia for goodness sake!

[dreggspicker] 13/4/2012 13:41

I think in our minds we can think of conspirency theories, but I feel we have not had enough buyers, lower fluorspar prices, teething issues, Al selling some (to another Director)have all had a effect;

I also think we will get through it, hopefully prices will not go down any more,lots of dosh in the bank, plant improvements, management still holds the same holdings, it just will not be a block buster year like I had thought ......
I do think the results have been painted blacker than it is (I hope) for tax reasons etc .....
regards, dreggs

[pisces4] 13/4/2012 12:53

dreggs i cant help but get the feeling that this has been manipulated down for a reason,the last four buys have not moved the price at all really, but nominal sells sent the shareprice plummeting,mind you anything that happens on the aim market wouldnt surprise me! whats your thoughts on the dramatic fall seen here over past few months?

[dreggspicker] 12/4/2012 20:31

interesting report on fluorspar in "coating World"

[dreggspicker] 12/4/2012 16:21

haha you are not wrong there ..... :+}