FishWorks Share Discussion Threads

[hillbrown] 25/5/2002 00:14

Dex.

Sorry, did'nt mean to offend and wifey says I'm a bit abbrasive.

You cant do anything about this one. If you get anything regard
it as bunce.

But dont drive yourself mad.

[£note] 25/5/2002 00:00

Dex
Like you I would like some answers, however -

FSH is in administration not receivership - At the request of the Directors who I presume are looking after the shareholders interests.

This I reckon was agreed with the major shareholders as the best way forward in order to sell the business. Hence no dumping of shares.

Given 1ladybird's posting above there may be hope for some form of divi for the shareholders - not holding my breath under the circumstances - (lack of info)

£700M turnover is important with the appropriate profit margin and I believe that there is value in the business with the appropriate management.

Holders of 720M shares may not all be wrong.

[itsourpete] 24/5/2002 22:39

FT today advised that there had been many enquiries about the business and that a number of the sites are likely to be sold as going concerns. That pleases me, as after all the Company which we know is made up of individuals, had high praise for both the quality of its products and the customer care given by its employees. Good luck all employees.

The FT went on to say that the decision of the BANKS to call in the receivers came as a total surprise to the Directors, and that whilst the banks are likely to be paid off (probably along with the creditors), the shareholders are likely to be left with nothing.

Like Dex, I'd like the opportunity to see where things went wrong. The Company owes us this, at the very least.

Pete

[forfaiter] 24/5/2002 20:34

You sir are a player.....and my guess is that you have won more than you have lost...

[tyranosaurus] 24/5/2002 18:41

The big shareholders are not individuals like us. When we lose money we go without a holiday etc. When they lose money it`s their clients money.
I don`t think that large institutions with FSH shares worth several million are that bothered.
Look at National Grid`s reaction to Energis. We do not put more money in we just write off the investment. It`s not big money to them.
The receivers to FSH will not raise enough money to even pay off 100% of the banks debts. There will be ZERO for the shareholders. Do not even think that you will see 1p.
My 65000 shares are now totally worthless.

We have to learn from these experiences.
Think twice before investing in companies that have large bank debt or have bondholders.

[dexdringle] 24/5/2002 18:01

.....that would be the same Telegraph that forecast a sale of RR for £90M in 2000 ???

[jim21] 24/5/2002 16:08

Its bust after all that then, ah well it will pay back some of the CGT I owe

Jim

[dexdringle] 24/5/2002 15:51

£note

You said : "This I reckon was agreed with the major shareholders as the best way forward in order to sell the business. Hence no dumping of shares"

I'm not so sure whether the share sales or otherwise were a factor. It didn't really matter what the price was at suspension. I can't believe that the company have had any dealings with the major shareholders (30%) at all as they haven't contacted the rest of us (70%). I doubt that the institutions knew about the suspension and didn't try to sell shares in the hope that liquidators would end up with spare funds and a divi greater than 2p after flogging everything.

I think we have to assume the worst all round and that the institutions have been as stitched up as the rest of us. I'd still like to know what their views are though. They saw the warnings and the negotiations with bankers so why didn't they start selling. They wouldn't just hang on hoping things weren't so bad would they ? Or would they talk to the company about injecting capital (rights issue or whatever) as their 30% support would probably be needed ?

Is there anyone out there from Fidelity, Jupiter or wherever who can give their views ?

Dex

[dexdringle] 24/5/2002 14:40

I wonder whether Legal & General and the like still own 250M shares here ? They're not stupid (or maybe they are ?). If these intitutions have these shares still would they not be demanding some explanation as to whats going on ? Wouldn't they want to have some say in what happens next ? Does anyone out there have some idea of what the major shareholders are likely to be doing (if anything) ? Does anyone know if any majors are still on the register ?

I think the institutions (and indeed many others) have been in a long time probably at 10p +. Seems odd that they're silent ?

Dex

[1ladybird] 24/5/2002 14:13

This board seems to be coming down off the ceiling after the initial fury & the posts above seem to me an excellent and fair summary of the position. I think I concur with pretty well all the views expressed. The company failed to get it's act together consistently & quickly enough at operational level and had financially no room for manoeuvre when anything at all went wrong, which in the current market and with its too wide spread of interests was virtually inevitable. It needed considerably greater financial flexibilty to hope to trade its way out of trouble and that would have taken a long timeframe to come through. As was commented above, the banks would have been very leery about getting even further involved - & probably substantially if FSH were to make a real go of things - particularly with the likelihood - apparently already happening - of the trade losing confidence.

It was interesting that the banks reportedly looked long and hard at getting in deeper through taking an equity interest and it may well be as somebody suggested that their price was just too great for the Board & major shreholders to swallow. The RNS statement said that the Board requested the banks to put in KPMG, which in the circumstances would be the only way a break up could actually be done - the banks have a lien on all assets under last year's funding arrangements. It does not say that the banks initiated the action, though that may purely be semantics, of course.

Personally, I think a break up is by far the best solution and if there is genuine competition for the business or its component parts it may - & I only say may - produce some quite decent prices. We shall have to wait patiently & see.

[hillbrown] 24/5/2002 13:14

Chris G post 875. Terrific. Specially the last two paras.

"But the information is out there in the public domain. It is up to individuals to decide whether to read it and take notice of it"

I've been to pushy and maybe upset a few.

[iaincc] 24/5/2002 11:58

This is going to be great news for the rest of the sector.

FSH I am told has been the major thorn in the side of many of the chilled/fresh
market.

Provided its not a new player that takes it on, Geest look like a big winner.

I think Tesco and other supermarkets will try and stop the other players
getting through some price increases, but they will succeed. UK inflation up ???

Thoughts anyone......?

[dickdasterdly10000] 24/5/2002 11:42

Hillbrown - that post does you no credit

if dex wants some answers he has every right to post

if you don't like it don't read the tread

i assume you lost money when you sold out as well so it doesn't make you a great sage

and for every fsh there is an arcadia and invensys or a next

[1ladybird] 24/5/2002 11:29

Drex

Ref. your thoughts, the below from the Times today

"Mick McLoughlin of KPMG said that he had received a 'huge amount of interest' from potential buyers in the US and Europe for either all or parts of the business.
Sales packs are expected to be ready today and the company hopes that a disposal can be completed in about two months time"

Given that the group is relatively complex - guarantees, pension liabilities, joint holdings, etc.- that seems a remarkably bullish statement.

[hillbrown] 24/5/2002 11:26

No, they dont trade at a multiple of assets, they trade on a
multiple of profits.

Otherwise you would pay £200,000 for a mini.

ps.

Dont think you are really looking for sensible views.
You should form a speccialist whinging stock market
gamblers club for those who choose to ignore reality and
good advice in the hope of mega returns.

Have a look at OBS if you want to gamble. Similar situ
to FSH and the CEO, Ian Quinlan, formerly of FSH, got the
chop a few weeks ago. Another mega gamble.

[max power] 24/5/2002 11:10

hey sorry guys, bad show

[hillbrown] 24/5/2002 08:58

Albert Fisher.

There is a deafening silence from Jimmyloser.

I know we are going off the air shortly but thought
Jimmy would at least have a few words as last rites
over his beloved Albert.

Could it be that he is negotiating the purchase
of all or part of the Albert carcass?


Fyffes.

Another food company but with great management with major
shareholdings.

I am off to the agm in Dublin next Tuesday and hope
to confirm my view that the shares will rise 50% or more
over the next twelve months. I have 125,000 of them at prices
from 56p to 97p. I am looking for 150p.

When I went to the last agm of Fisher in similar circumstances
and expecting to buy more I came out of the meeting
and sold 1.7m of my 2m holding the same day.

With Fyffes I will buy another 50,000 if the omens are
good or sell 125,000 if they are not. Anyone interested
checkout the FFY board on Wednesday next.