Co-op.gp. 25 Discussion Threads

[dalesiders] 17/12/2022 13:29

107.75 to buy with ii over the phone for an ISA. I make this a YTM of 8% for essentially a 3 year bond. No accrued interest to fork out as pay day is 20/12 I believe, and even for bonds trading clean there has to be some sort of record date

[glavey] 08/11/2022 08:54

System issue.

[jaf111] 07/11/2022 11:29

In addition to HL can also trade these with i-Dealing. But II do not do online trading in these for some strange reason!!!

[tag57] 07/11/2022 10:22

Found my answer.

[tag57] 07/11/2022 10:14

Can someone provide the YTM calc, just wondering if the coupon will be paid in 2025 too?

[aishah] 07/11/2022 09:46

HL are quoting minimum of 100 units and adding 324 days interest on top.

100@106.5p. Add commission and 324 days interest on top of £9.76

[my retirement fund] 07/11/2022 09:35

What's the minimum clip size here and do you need to be a pro registered person or do brokers happily sell to anyone?

[aishah] 05/11/2022 14:52

Price has collapsed this year with the rest of the sector. Worth considering now with an 11% coupon due in the next few weeks? Inflation may have peaked and rates may keep steady going into next year. When there's blood on the streets...

[glavey] 06/5/2022 08:47

But inconsequential, it trades clean.

[jaf111] 05/5/2022 16:02

its annual....on or around 20 December

[rhino col] 05/5/2022 09:50

Thanks Glavey, is the coupon paid just once yearly on the 20/12 or do they pay twice yearly like most fixed income

[glavey] 05/5/2022 04:20

Nothing, it's a coupon.

[rhino col] 04/5/2022 10:51

What happened to the 11% ??

[glavey] 04/5/2022 09:39

There is no dividend.

[rhino col] 03/5/2022 10:10

Anyone know the ex dividend date on these ? Thanks

[glavey] 26/10/2021 06:55

Different Co-Op, different instrument.

[prettygreen] 25/10/2021 09:14

I see the Co-Op are interested in TSB at @ £1bn. Fortunes must have changed - it's not that long ago they were crying poverty and tried to wriggle out of paying the interest on these. After a legal challenge, the "Crystal Methodist" saga and their "restructure" they still managed to stiff holders but did pay the accrued interest. Wouldn't trust Co-Op Bank to run a whelk stall.

[holts] 27/4/2020 16:02

Results not too shoddy .

[pogue] 20/3/2020 19:59

Well you got a bounce today so well done!
I see many businesses though that should survive this no problem but I see your point here. I bought some ELLA the other week around £1.45 thinking that was a good safe buy, got that one wrong.
I think there will be more selling, this market is not getting better anytime soon we have 3 months to go according to Boris whilst others are quoting a year!
Off course right now any prediction is wrong as who knows.
I am keeping my money in my pocket, apart from one share, and will wait till I see the whites of their eyes :0)
Good luck

[holts] 20/3/2020 13:25

Pogue ,

First of all , dont listen to this idiot !

However for what its worth I am working on the basis that the rapid decline in fixed income is largely as a result of liquidity problems elsewhere so everything is out to raise the required funds .

Add in Co op business is food , funerals and insurance , the latter I suspect is not heavily exposed to businesses and even then only a minuscule percentage of businesses have cover that would be valid as a result of virus interruption its just not in standard cover .

What is happening in Italy concerns me hence only a small nibble at 104.9 , but really who knows ? History advises time to buy but one always thinks is it different this time .

[pogue] 20/3/2020 08:11

I am interested why do you think this is a good buying point? I personally am buying nothing right now as I dont see the bottom, especially since Boris tells us 3 months before we are out of this, I am looking for people with a more positive attitude.

[holts] 20/3/2020 08:06

Had a nibble .

[spittingbarrel] 16/3/2020 18:34

I would think these are starting to look attractive, People will always be going to their local supermarket for food, the insurance side might suffer a bit but I would have thought these were pretty safe. Yielding about 7.6% now.

[pimsim] 03/2/2020 12:49

The recent deal with Aviva, who will now take on the liabilities of the PACE pension scheme, effectively removes the last remaining exposure the co-op group has to the co-op bank.

The bonds have had a good run up recently which reflects the steady de-risking within the group.

[pimsim] 12/11/2019 10:42

Once they complete the roll over of the remaining short term debt then the business should be safe (if not necessarily very profitable) for at least the next three years, i.e. even if the business continues to look fragile there is little short-term risk of financial collapse.

The bond is paying 11% with 6 years to run through to maturity in Dec 2025 so assuming the business is stable and baring any dramatic change in interest rates then I would expect the price movement between now and maturity to follow the classic shape. Gut feel says something like:

Dec 20 120-122p
Dec 21 118-120p
Dec 22 115-118p
Dec 23 112-114p
Dec 24 106-108p
Dec 25 100p

There is quite a bit of debt due to roll in 2024 so I am looking at just the next 3 year horizon and I am hoping to pick up a cumulative 33p in interest by Dec 22 for a price decline of no more than 8p i.e. yield of 6.67% at current 125p.

Now the bond is down to 6 years the duration sensitivity is becoming less important. Focus for me is to keep an eye on 6 monthly financial reports + terms of remaining debt rollover.