Cleantech Share Discussion Threads

[papillon] 18/5/2009 19:44

At WTN's current share price WTN are paying around £73m for CBM. By my reckoning that corresponds to my figures in the previous post for the value of CBM's assets less debts (without giving any value to AGD and NEMI and a miserly value to CLN).

[papillon] 18/5/2009 19:40

Do you know there is a very good case for this merger not to go ahead. IMHO it would be in the best interests of the CBM shareholders longer term if it didn't (shorter term its better if merger does proceed). I'm sure they could re-finance their outstanding debt (US$32m to repay WTN loan and US$27m to repay convertible). Their assets are very good. The listed ones (WTN, WTN convertible, XTR, EBG) alone are worth around £88m. Discounting AGD I feel sure CLN must be worth at least £15m. That gives £103m. I'm sure they could borrow £30m on those assets to pay off their remaining debt (after allowing for their own cash of £8.5m).
EDIT I haven't allowed for any value for the NEMI shares CBM holds. Of course my asset value is very conservative because AGD must be worth something and CLN, in all probability, is worth much more than £15m

[kooba] 18/5/2009 19:35

everyone forgetting the £8m tax bill they had to pay since the last balance sheet,don't think they are sitting on very much cash at all.yeah volvo thx for that...but there is a difference between cash and illiquid holdings when you have t 4 to pay out $27m.there was a reason why they borrowed what they did from wtn at those high rates and it wasn't to sit on it earning sod all in a bank.

[papillon] 18/5/2009 19:29

CBM had £8.576m of cash at 31/12/08 kooba. See interim results released at the end of March. Thats around US$13m. I would expect them to have generated some cash in the 2nd half of the year. They generated about £6.5m (about US$10) in the 1st 6 months to 31/12/08. Even if they generated no cash in the 2nd half of the year (unlikely!!) they would still have that US$13m of cash.

[volvo] 18/5/2009 19:28

kooba they would get 5m by selling their NEMI shares, or 12m by selling their Energybuild shares, or 13m by selling their Xtract shares, or 53m by selling their WTN shares, or selling Coal International for the same price they paid 50m and their Australian gold and antimony stuff must be worth 7m.

There is plenty of money in the pot.

[volvo] 18/5/2009 19:13

TBONE you are right, and the incompetance shown by Burridge and co was a disgrace.

Any how we are where we are.WTN are moving in and will buy CBM for .75 of a WTN shre.

Just want to walk away with a decent profit and never hear of Cambrian again.These incestuous relationships like Audley and joint directorships are not healthy for normal shareholders.They only work in one direction THEIRS!

[kooba] 18/5/2009 19:12

wheres that $15m of cash come from pb ?

[pbracken] 18/5/2009 18:53

Fair point, kooba - but not one that WTN is unaware of, obviously. CBM has $15m in cash. So the balance amounts to around $12m. That's what it has to cough up. Anyone seriously suggesting this business can't find that? I don't have enough fingers to point-up the possibilities....

[kooba] 18/5/2009 18:15

Derivative liabilities
Cambrian issued convertible loan notes totalling US $27.0
million during the 2006 financial year, which are convertible
at any time until 7May 2009. If they are not converted, they
are redeemable on 23May 2009.


from report and accounts.this would indicate that cbm have to cough up $u27m in a few days time. might be a deciding factor in when we get an announcement,as cbm haven't got the money and i would have thought defaulting would not be a sensible move in their position.amazed they are taking this to the wire in the circumstances.
seems that most posters know whats going on so perhaps i can get the benefit of your knowledge on this situation?

[pbracken] 18/5/2009 13:49

The deal WILL proceed. I can't be the only one talking to the shareholder parties involved.

The only issue is what price will WTN be when it is concluded? Commodity stocks have probably raced a little ahead of current fundamentals, and there remains the possibility that the market will reign them in. That said, the discount to WTN's share price means that CBM carries a very comfortable margin for error.

I'm toying with adding very substantially to my CBM position. WTN has retreated from 170 cents and may have stabilised at present levels - though a doubt remains. The risk-reward equation remains compelling, though, for anyone with more than a couple of month's trading horizon.

The terms will not be revised, for the obvious reason that CBM represents outstanding value at the ratio offered. According to Audley, CBM is being given away - but the partnership offers an unrivalled investment opportunity.

There; said it.

(Edit - hope I don't move the market!)

[bushtuckaman] 18/5/2009 13:32

Papillon, thats why they didnt give XTR to us shareholders ;-)

[papillon] 18/5/2009 12:59

Dont forget the CBM debts VOLVO.

[volvo] 18/5/2009 12:27

pap if you add XTR Energybuild and WTN shares into cash, 75m pounds ish you can see how much of bargain WTN will be getting as this well above the market cap of CBM, 54m pounds.

Also no value for Coal International or NEMI.

Someone is getting a bargain.

[papillon] 18/5/2009 11:02

XTR up again. Investors seems to think they have some exciting projects. CBM's stake becoming a valuable part of its assets.

[papillon] 16/5/2009 13:50

TGH100. Very funny. LOL.

[rs2ooo] 15/5/2009 22:48

They're right VOLVO. Unfortunately, the time you come on here with solid information it will be a cry wolf situation.

[jonnyboy1] 15/5/2009 21:51

agreed unglove and kooba anywhere vulva is dangerous. He is either deluded, a sucker or a champion looser. Probably all three

[unglove] 14/5/2009 22:45

Looking at past record Volvo is champion thrush on this thread. Repetitive ramping with big porkies about messages from CBM. A dangerous poster - so novices to this thread beware.

[kooba] 14/5/2009 22:03

Viva la Repartee

[volvo] 14/5/2009 22:00

tweet tweet stop singing thrush.

[kooba] 14/5/2009 21:57

too many sugary drinks and up beyond your bedtime and look what happens! very sad.go away volvo you add nothing.you have returned to buy a small amount of stock and are once again trying to puff them up to spin out your pa..you got it wrong big time now don't come back with your made up "facts" and try to scam again.

[volvo] 14/5/2009 21:50

Pap why should the terms be different if anything coal has improved.They are getting a bargain.

Also Energybuild has improved

Also NEMI share has improved. Hogg thinks 2 weeks and so do I and by the strength here at 40p so do others.