Blue Plan.uts Discussion Threads

[madoff with cash] 24/9/2009 16:47

agreed with watwungyi. bought loads sub 80 with divdidend already pocketed.

[watwungyi] 11/11/2008 19:54

this is an amazing stock. nav is 104p and share is trading at 66p. only 55% of the trust is in equity. the rest is in bond and cash. so this is a seriously undervalued stock with huge discount. 45p of cash and bond plus 55p of stocks for 66p. this is a serious bargain. i kept sending check to buy regularly.

[stun12] 03/4/2008 16:15

Cheers pscambler. Times article was interesting, though it remains a mystery to me how BP has performed so poorly when the manager seems to have made the right call. Good news for the future as there should be some bargains to be had at some stage.

[pscambler] 03/4/2008 14:38

BP Hedge Fund NAVs published here



BP has stopped sending me the email reporst of the company, and the web site is blank!


Of interest

[hindsight] 21/3/2008 17:04

Hi Stun12, have mailed sorry for delay in seeing your post

[stun12] 11/3/2008 12:17

Doesn't look like it worked...if you email me at my disposable email address [e-mail] I'll send them on to you, for what they're worth!

[stun12] 11/3/2008 11:59

Hi. I have screenshots from Bloomberg but am trying to work out how to post them. Hopefully won't take too long. I notice that the fund price has not been updated since the end of September...wonder where it is now?

[hindsight] 10/3/2008 18:36

stun12, do you please have a link for the piece you found on bloom re the Hedge fund performance
Thanks in advance

[stun12] 06/2/2008 12:53

Thanks very much for the info. The hedge fund holding I presume is BP's own Global Financial long/short fund? I found a little bit on Bloomie - down 30% or so YoY. Pretty unimpressive - as you say, if their view was right about financials you wonder what they were short of. Long Russia/EM and short just about anything else would have proved better than that.

Ah well, back to obscurity.

[pscambler] 05/2/2008 17:16

discount - also related to low free float (i.e. liquidity). Overall expose still something like 80% (but Jan factsheet due). The loans are still in place, but held as cash, as I understand it

Bloomie and trustnet d/c are fully diluted.

Warrants - nothing will happen, as discounted by diluted price. Share price benefits if warrant holders convert while warrants at premium (like now). Who would do this I don't know, but some do.

No wind up option. The discounts on the three trusts have been fairly similar of late. Some form of merger could be possible while this holds, and this would increase liquidity. The management are major (20-30%) shareholders so I doubt there will be activist activity here. Your plan to hold long term in a SIPP is probably the best one!

Going back to discount, I would point out the poor performance of the hedge fund held within the trust(what were the shorts if not western banks, bond insurers and US mortgage companies?) and less than perfect timing of the cash up -pile back in- cash up again which hit the NAV last year. They called the market but lagged with timing. Still, who calls these things 100%?

[stun12] 16/1/2008 13:29

I'm a little mystified by the discount to NAV - I thought that logically this should only apply to investments where liquidity or valuation issues arose. BPFU is 46% cash or near-cash and the manager, who has been bearish for a good while, says his (or our!) long equity positions are hedged. He looks well positioned to take advantage of lower prices - once we get there - so I don't really understand why the discount (showing on Bloomberg at 24% - don't know whether that is diluted or not) is so large. Must say that the structure of the funds leaves a lot to be desired on the opacity front. Had to read the description on the BP website about 5 times before I had the faintest idea of what was going on.

I bought these because Trustnet showed an even greater discount to NAV - think I paid about 170p for them, with a gross 30%-ish discount, so I'm not complaining, just a bit confused! They're in a SIPP so probably there for the long term.

Any other longs out there? Any views on what is likely to happen come warrant expiry year (2010?) - is there a wind-up option to realise the discount?

[tuckswood8] 02/1/2008 11:19

The warrant units (BPFV) have an exercise date of July 2010, and each warrant unit gives the right to purchase ten equity units (BPFU) of the investment trust. Warrant units are exercisable at 1000p, and there is an annual opportunity to exercise.

The structure of the BLUE PLANET GROWTH&INCOME INVESTMENT TRUST is so complicated, especially following the 10 for 1 split, that it is virtually impossible to understand. I believe that this has seriously affected the warrant perfomance since the split and that BLUE PLANET MANAGEMENT have an obligation to explain and simplify matters.



Having said that, I did go back into warrants at 1025p in December and expect to see a strong rise over the next few months as the financial sector recovers from the sub-prime debacle.



....................1-month chart against FTSE All Share Index....................

[grim] 01/11/2007 21:29

Could anyone please explain how the warrants work?

[nobel2005] 10/8/2007 15:19

Hi anybody holding BPFA? as a single unit IT?Any views after today's shock?

[jhan66] 07/6/2007 11:32

....oops- that's undiluted. discount only 26% so I'll wait for now

[jhan66] 07/6/2007 08:16

34% discount. Maybe It's time.

[tuckswood8] 13/5/2007 10:58

For the first time in several years I find myself without a Blue Planet holding in my portfolio, having sold in late March. I believe that Ken Murray's actions were precipitate although in the longer term the stategy may prove correct.

I have done very well from the BP trusts (particularly the warrants) in recent years, but consider that the launch of the hedge fund caused a change of management focus and was not a good move for holders in the ITs.

[goldlocks] 13/5/2007 08:13

Ken Murray has sold 50% of his funds' equity holdings and expects a US recession to wipe 20% off the world's markets. He believes that the crisis will not remain confined to the subprime loan market or to the USA, but will have a materially damaging effect on share prices globally.

He saw this was a great opportunity to position himself ahead of the market fall. So far he has achieved a 30% drop in the share price (though NAV didn't change that much).

Will we witness, over the coming weeks and months, either scrambling to get out of or scrambling to get back into markets. In the latter case there might be another drop share price of Blue Planet's ITs. Any views???

[pscambler] 05/4/2007 08:36

If you saw the FT article, Ken Murray thiks there will be a c20% market fall in med term. Funds in 25% cash, plus some 20% in the hedge fund (which given his outlook might be close to net short - info tends to be 1 month delayed cf the ITs).

These ITs are now run almost like a hedge fund or ARV, which is fine by me. I don't want to pay for a tracker

[woracle] 03/4/2007 22:45

Looks like they sold off Sberbank..Totally different portfolio from 12 months ago.

[jhan66] 27/1/2007 12:05

Hi goldilocks,
don't have strong opinions on Russia, I was only concerned how the Gazprom/Shell situation would play out.
I'm currently out of all BP IT's having had a high % at one time + overlap with EST & BEE.
The main reason I'm out is the NAV discount. There were times when it wouldn't budge below 30% and now its only 10-13%. It may remain in fashion & not widen again but my plan is to review situation when/if it rises to +20%

(did trade BLP between 27/12 & 16/1 for 15% net gain, but wish I'd bought some warrants)

[goldlocks] 27/1/2007 00:14

Jhan, I don't agree with your stance on Russia. Sberbank increased with 126% over the past year. East European banks, especially in Russia, have still the best growth prospects. Murray has no exposure in Turkey anymore. His hedge fund now even shorts banks in Turkey, and also banks in US and UK. The IT's hold each 20% in that hedge fund to reduce loss in case of a market correction. He expects a hard landing in US.

BPFV was at a discount. There were a series of large buys BPFV in the past week, share price increased almost 20% in one week and the warrants are now at a low premium.

BPFV became my largest holding. Although I'm anticipating a correction and cashing in on my stocks, especialy China and other emerging markets, BPFV will be the last thing I sell. If there is a correction I will at least double my BPFV shares.

[tuckswood8] 25/1/2007 17:11

Copied my earlier chart to make it easier for me to keep track of relative performances.

I should have got back into BPFU back in December but didn't as funds were tied up elsewhere.

Increased holding of BPFV on 15th January when I thought they looked undervalued again.... good to see quoted spread on the warrants has now narrowed.