Angel Biotechnology Share Discussion Threads

[the_doctor] 31/1/2013 19:59

'I'm struggling to understand how the expansion was realised without any type of pre-contractual assurances'

hedgehog - I'm willing to bet your contract manager experience was not in biologics manufacturing
There's high risk throughout the biotech/pharma development chain!
it's not the same as getting a contract where you can actually guarantee commitment, such as say, outsourcing fabrication of t-shirts

'I'm only guessing of course, but had the company approached the banks for the level of investment they required, I'm sure they'd have required some sort of assurance'

Of course!
Tell me bright spark - how much assurance does any biotech or pharma company have of generating income if its products are still in trials? None
For that reason, they're generally financed through equity issuance arent they.



'I admire your stance, though can't help feeling your comments resemble veiled excuses and fail to see how they explain how they've got us where we are now exactly.'

then you havent read my posts. It's very simple
They were struggling to reach breakeven/grow from Pentlands alone - agreed?
This was perhaps due to having to offer more competitive terms to win contracts than was originally anticipated
So they raised cash to resurrect Cramlington and hopefully bring in more contracts there to make the whole company profitable and grow.

Perhaps because order visibility was falling, perhaps because of a great opportunity, or perhaps because someone was greedy or foolish... they then acquire the biomedical collagen business
At the end of the day, this does help bring in more business and is a good fit


BUT, it used up a lot of cash that ABH is now desperate for.
That may have been a critical mistake
ABH attempted two expansion strategies at the same time, which caused even more of a cash drain unless the biomedical side is already generating cash (?)
I would though add that part of ABH's cash may have been raised specifically to use on the biomedical acq, in which case, we cant really say that cash should have been saved

[bronislav] 31/1/2013 18:42

.This may very well go to the wall but it will probably go kicking and screaming and have the odd decent bounce ,but hey there are too many experts on here and its easy to be an expert when not an investor.no offence intended to anyone ,just my opinion.

[hedgehog33] 31/1/2013 18:38

is that 100% up or downwards..?

[bronislav] 31/1/2013 18:33

I loved the immigration hold up excuse.Could the Russians not just come in on the back of a lorry like all the others do.remeber folks its always darkest before the dawn.Plenty updates to come with a possible 100 per cent from the current lows .probably worth waiting a few days maybe into next week as timing is of the essence .dyor.imho.

[hedgehog33] 31/1/2013 18:31

It would be truly amazing if you really were Dr Harper... doc

Suppose you'd have more time to frequent the bb these days..

With a bit of luck we'll see the_sherriff appearing shortly.

What are they going to do without you..

Joking aside.. I admire your stance, though can't help feeling your comments resemble veiled excuses and fail to see how they explain how they've got us where we are now exactly.

I hear what you say, though as an ex-Contract Manager myself I'm struggling to understand how the expansion was realised without any type of pre-contractual assurances.

I'm only guessing of course, but had the company approached the banks for the level of investment they required, I'm sure they'd have required some sort of assurance.

[the_doctor] 31/1/2013 18:14

rocket fuel, you have a habit of making irrelevant comments
It rather highlights your lack of logic
where have I suggested the chart isnt dire?
how does that in any way impact what I have said? It doesnt.
what is wrong with you?

[inside2] 31/1/2013 17:46

Click the link. I've been told it's JakNife.

[rocket fuel] 31/1/2013 17:22

hope all is ok doc, you're having one of those Harold Shipman days. have you had a look at the chart lately?

[the_doctor] 31/1/2013 17:18

no offence edin, but you're clearly and investor that gambled without having any understanding of this business or the challenges.
I guess it's easier on you to believe your naive guff than accept you are also to blame.

you're making utterly silly comments. If you actually stopped, read my posts and thought about things, you'd maybe come to see what I'm on about.

[knocknock] 31/1/2013 17:04

Edinsteadofodat, not everyone here was misled.............. Although lambing season will ensure that many are led to final slaughter very soon, maybe even tommorrow

[edinstead] 31/1/2013 17:02

You really must be Harper to even have the audacity to write some of this stuff. The directors have destroyed this company with their incompetence, misleading investors in a shocking way with their wildly unrealistic statements, and it would be astonishing if they managed to salvage anything of value from this mess. Of course, for this to happen they would actually need want to salvage the company and I seriously doubt that they do as they would forgo their salaries pending salvation if they cared.

[inside2] 31/1/2013 16:48

Go away loser.

[the_doctor] 31/1/2013 16:38

All said, there's nothing to suggest that H1 2012 comment wasnt fair

'discussions currently at advanced stages to sign significant new contracts with new clients'
- they didnt say they were done and could therefore fall through

'All are of a size and nature such that they could not be undertaken without access to the facilities at Cramlington and a number have indicated a need for the contracts to commence before June 2012'

- it became clear as June 2012 approached that some of those contracts were therefore not going to happen

[knocknock] 31/1/2013 15:34

Fee fi foe fum
I smell the blood of a
Scottish man

Fi fi foe fum
Same Scottish man who has been taken
Up the bum

Bend over once
Bend over twice
Clueless as headless chickens
And the three blind mice

[knocknock] 31/1/2013 15:34

Fee fi foe fum
I smell the blood of a
Scottish man

Fi fi foe fum
Same Scottish man who has been taken
Up the bum

Bend over once
Bend over twice
Clueless as headless chickens
And the three blind mice

[knocknock] 31/1/2013 15:30

I smell a suspension coming!

[knocknock] 31/1/2013 15:28

Wheres Wig when you need him. Lol! Perhaps Wig is Dr Harper in drag ;;-)

[edinstead] 31/1/2013 14:43

Well, the buying seems to have stopped now and I will bet my last 47p of ABH shares that the directors won't be wasting any of their "easily earned reward for failure" on shares. Talking up your company and encouraging others to invest when you are not willing to use your own money and when you know it is in major trouble is nothing short of criminal in my book.

[rocket fuel] 31/1/2013 14:27

a lot of mug punters bought in the other day hoping for a quick turn. when they realise there is only one direction for this stock and want out, it will be driven down to 0.01

[rocket fuel] 31/1/2013 14:11

harper jumped ship with a trouser full of booty!
die hard holders from 0.6 days still hold the faith.
reckon harper is in california selling sum sort of religion!

[knocknock] 31/1/2013 14:10

Plan? Pmsl!!!!!!!!

[george57] 31/1/2013 14:09

I have been reading this thread with interest for the past few months, i was fortunate enough to get out a while ago just doing a few quid. I sympathise with the ones left here, but understand why. Could it have something to do with the kind of comment printed below from around a year ago? loads of promise, but nothing has transpired. Lots were "taken in" by this, and one has to ask the question: what exactly happened? It really does stink..and unfortunately happens too aften in the AIM market.

Business Development:
-- Dr Stewart White joined the Board in the newly created post of Commercial Director. -- Further support for the decision to focus on Advanced Biologics is evidenced by the discussions currently at advanced stages to sign significant new contracts with new clients. The current value of bids for new business is more than GBP12.5m. These prospective clients are based mainly in the US and await confirmation on the availability of manufacturing slots at Cramlington. All are of a size and nature such that they could not be undertaken without access to the facilities at Cramlington and a number have indicated a need for the contracts to commence before June 2012.

[edinstead] 31/1/2013 14:08

The saving of Harper's wages would not have been a saving if he and the other directors had had the decency to forgo their wages in light of their inability to earn them! And yet the current directors continue to squeeze every penny out of the company, unless you believe that they are going to display some competence for the first time in years.