Welsh Industrial Share Discussion Threads

[topvest] 07/7/2010 21:13

Anyone received their shares in Space and People or Wheelsure? I've not received mine yet.

[topvest] 01/4/2010 20:26

Looks like it's all gone through then. Cheque and share distributions to come!

[topvest] 14/3/2010 20:53

It will be interesting to see what happens here. 62% voting for liquidation, 19.5% abstaining.

It all comes down to the small shareholders.

I've voted for liquidation. I've nothing against Stirling and he seems to have done a good job, but I will get all my original investment back straight away and then ...... SpaceandPeople shares and Wheelsure straight + a 6p dividend + a final distribution in a year's time.

If Stirling has convinced some larger holders to support him though, they won't get the 75% - interesting fight.

[topvest] 07/11/2009 09:49

Some additional thoughts;

It appears that Stirling and Murray control 271k shares or 20%. If they want to be difficult then they may decide not to vote for the member's voluntary liquidation. They would only need another 5% to support them.

I'm not sure that this is necessarily game over!

Accordingly, whilst Mr Murray and Mr Stirling (Chairman), who comprise the
majority of the Board, disagree with the proposed new investment policy, they do not, despite their personal views, consider that it will be worthwhile in the current circumstances for the Company to incur the expense of convening a
General Meeting for the purpose of merely confirming the views of the requisite
majority of the shareholders. The Board will therefore begin to implement a
short term realisation policy endeavouring to achieve the best prices for the
investments available to it in the circumstances.

It must be appreciated that in order to return capital to shareholders it will
be necessary to place the company into members voluntary liquidation, for which
it will not only be necessary to convene a General Meeting but at which an
affirmative vote of at least 75% of the shareholders attending such meeting and
voting on the Resolution will be required. There can be no guarantee that such
a resolution will be passed.

On Mr Stirling's thoughts:

""You may imagine how disappointed I feel because during my stewardship as investment manager of the Company the net assets of the Company have increased substantially. In 1973 when I was first appointed the net assets were approximately GBP61,000, to which GBP54,519 was added by way of a rights issue two years later, making approximately GBP115,500. The net assets have subsequently increased to over GBP4.5m, as announced on 5th October, 2009. This represents a gain of about 39 times the original value of the portfolio over 34 years, which is an average of approximately 115% per annum over a third of a century. The short term view taken by those shareholders who have made their request since the results were announced, and during what has been recently a very turbulent market, is in my view wrong and I believe a long term view in line with the Company's historic and successful investment policy would be much more appropriate."

I have some sympathy. Undoubtedly, this has not been a good performer over the last few years, but over the long-run he has done very well. He is no doubt rather upset to have been dumped at Gresham and now the same parties look to be about to drop his only other listed vehicle. Overall though, he has a better record than most. Retirement beckons for Mr Stirling I suspect. It was probably the ill timed expansion by Gresham into real estate that was his downfall. Nevertheless, he has survived longer than most and if you don't own the majority of shares then you always get pushed at some point!

[topvest] 07/11/2009 09:40

Yes, the performance has not been good recently. Over the long term he did ok with his investments in Gresham and Welshpool, so he has a point there. The bottom line on this investment trust is that it's too small to cover the modest central costs. The stake in Space and People needs to be sold sensibly as this could be worth a fair bit to the right buyer.

[sandbank] 07/11/2009 08:19

TOPVEST: Agreed - but it's high time something was done about the woeful performance of this trust.

The RNS issued by Stirling yesterday was appalling - the most dreadful piece of self-serving drivel and selective reporting I've ever seen.

The true state of affairs over the last few years is revealed by the share price graph.

[topvest] 06/11/2009 22:18

Looks like this investment trust is about to be placed in member's voluntary liquidation. Lets hope they sell the assets in an optimal manner. Space and People is the interesting one. Selling this stake is going to be tricky unless there is an interested buyer.

[markxzym] 12/9/2009 17:36

Agree it is not a bad investment trust in terms of portfolio and share selections. Th eproblem is that this is simply too small to be economical and the trust should be wound-up to give the invester the best value. With a portfolio of around 2-3 million, and assuming a year-on-year return of 10%, the return can bearly pay for the cost of director salaries and other running cost. Not much for investors. With such a big discount, winding up should give investor a decent return immediately.

[topvest] 11/8/2009 11:41

It's not a bad little investment trust, although they need to do something about the spread. I've bought a few; not to trade, but to hold long term as Fred Stirling has a reasonable small company record. It's interesting what will happen here now that Fred is serving his notice period at Gresham.

Gresham have lots of shares in this and similar small co investments, but want out so that they can concentrate on their leveraged property assets.

There was an interesting comment in the Gresham accounts saying that "Your board is exploring ways of helping the company (i.e Welsh IT) to expand the asset base in order that this investment can be realised in due course". Presumably, Fred has more time to devote to Welsh IT once his involvement in Gresham ends.

Given Gresham were originally trying to offload their property assets into a REIT may be better to sell their investments to Welsh, if they could raise funds in some way. All quite tricky though because of the various shareholdings. Anyway, bought on the basis of £2 for £3 of assets (with upside) and a 3% yield.

[sandbank] 04/3/2004 21:58

Good rise today. Looking strong for further upward movement. Great to be on a private excalator that hardly anyone else has heard of.

[john e g] 06/9/2001 15:47

So who are Rock Nominees, to whom directors have sold?

[kenball] 06/9/2001 13:12

Haven't a clue and would like to know too

[john e g] 04/9/2001 14:53

Can anyone explain to me how this top performing Inv trust is assessed? Don't like the wide spread but how is that the price moves without any trading - particular downwards once special div announced, now upwards when it's gone ex? And the MM has done it again today (Wed) Come on.. answers, pls - same thing again today (Thurs)