Stanley Gibbons Share Discussion Threads

[jasdan] 25/8/2018 21:15

Am now expecting trading volumes to begin picking up in this stock from Tuesday onwards as everyone builds their positions - it looks like things have calmed down completely and all the legacy issues are out in the open and accounted for.

[jasdan] 21/8/2018 22:04

Just over a month now until the full year update.

[jasdan] 11/8/2018 16:51

I see there is an interesting update from the newish CEO in the September issue of SG's magazine. Quite interesting reading and pretty bullish. They are going back to basics and re-establishing core values etc. It sounds like we are going to see SG a lot more at regional stamp shows.

[jasdan] 11/8/2018 16:44

I also do not think that SG's stock is valued at the sale prices in their guides. Those are their selling prices, not the prices goods have been bought for, and I have no idea what mark up they make on QV stock for example. I would imagine that since they had not been buying for a while, their stock is all already accounted for, and paid for - hence the figures for stock showing in their accounts.

I wonder if they make a higher profit per item on coins or stamps?

[jasdan] 11/8/2018 16:38

Augustus, my point simply is that buying via the internet has grown so much in the last few years that sellers are often now getting good prices for their stamps. QV India is an especial case in point. I am not so sure about high value GB QV, here I suspect there is a slower market, but I do not imagine many of these owners are likely to want to sell a prized mint £5 orange for example. Even so, how many can there be?

At that level, I do not know how many buyers are around, presumably the sort of folk who can afford to buy such stamps are often on the look out for such items as they can only rarely be coming up for sale.

Balgray, good posting, but SG's GB high valued stock was never going to fly out of the shop at any time, for exactly the same reason - how many items can there be at that level, equally how many buyers [or sellers] can there be? I do think that anyone who has invested in such high value items as part of an investment portfolio is more than likely to only put a small part of their holdings into stamps as they are clearly less of a flexible investment that cash / shares etc. Frankly, I would have thought that buying these shares was now a great idea since all the legacy stuff is cleared up and Phoenix are backing SG. Perhaps portfolio holders will sell their stamps and buy SG's shares?

[augustusgloop] 11/8/2018 10:05

"The way things are going, most of these portfolio holders will achieve reasonable returns by simply selling on ebay in the future so I cannot see where the crisis is."

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If that was the case - there would have been no problem in Guernsey - and the company wouldn't have collapsed!

[balgray] 10/8/2018 22:50

I'm afraid I don't share your implied optimism, jasdan. I know two investors who were awaiting the return of their items, and who wish to sell. One was somewhat concerned at the delay, but that is not the issue. It is how the release affects the thread we are following - the future of SG. There are, as you say, very many valuable items within the portfolios, some of which will now be on offer (I certainly don't agree with your 5%). Some may be offered to SG. Do they have the liquidity to re-enter the fray? At what price? Do they not have enough high-end stock at catalogue prices?
Indian States may be short supply, jasdan, and I know nothing about their pricing, but SG have a large stock of GB line-engraved stuff on their website at catalogue prices (or above!)which has barely moved - if at ail - since my last post in May. Whither the ex-investment items then? To auctions or other dealers where it will go for less than the 'investment', leaving SG's stock higher and drier ?. Back to the dual problem I outlined in May. SG catalogues versus SD prices,

[jasdan] 08/8/2018 11:11

In January PWC reported that:
"There are over 4,000 investment portfolios which collectively hold approximately 22,000 individual items of stock. These items have historically been stored by reference to the individual item number rather than by client portfolio, so in addition to reconciling each investor’s collections to the Company’s records, it has been necessary to collate portfolios so that they are stored in a manner that will facilitate the return of these items to investors, as appropriate, in due course.
Stocks are delivered daily from the secure storage facility to the Company’s premises for processing, but due to insurance limits on the value of items that can be held on site at any given time, there is a restriction on the number of items that can be sorted on any one day. There are also fixed delivery and collection windows for the items delivered to the Company’s premises so we are unable to work extended hours to expedite this process."
It seems the reason for any delay in valuing / returning the stamps to owners was down to pretty ordinary circumstances that have now been dealt with.

[jasdan] 08/8/2018 11:08

I have now read PWC's January statement and I cannot see what the fuss is about. There are roughly 22,000 items held which are all deemed to be the higher end items of GB or Commonwealth philately. If someone wants to sell me a mint or used block of penny blacks for £100 I am absolutely up for it. But of course, in reality, the sort of holders of these portfolios were very wealthy individuals / owners for whom the stamps probably only represented a most minor part of their overall portfolios. I would be surprised to see even 5% of them selling their portfolios at the moment. Certainly, as a frequent bidder on ebay, especially for Indian States, it is getting progressively harder and more expensive to buy any high value items. The way things are going, most of these portfolio holders will achieve reasonable returns by simply selling on ebay in the future so I cannot see where the crisis is.
These are very unlikely to be holders who are desperate to sell, or who need to sell at the moment.

[analyst] 08/8/2018 09:39

All moving towards resolution.
Portfolio reconciliation has been completed.
They are organising insured courier delivery for those who want to take their stamps home from Guernsey (but will cost 2% of price paid, and some VAT will likely be payable on import to UK) and have given out a list of firms willing to take over portfolios for those who don't want delivery.

[jasdan] 08/8/2018 08:32

I would also comment that there are more Than enough collectors willing to pick up great stamps at discounted prices - if holders of those portfolios want to sell them for a song, then that’s their problem! It will have no effect on SG as they are now disconnected from Guernsey.

[jasdan] 08/8/2018 08:28

I think that eight months on, PCW have probably reconciled the remaining 35% so if the portfolios were going to be sold, their effect would have been seen.

More relevantly, as you know, the administration of Guernsey is ring fenced from SG so there cannot be claims against Sg

[balgray] 07/8/2018 22:28

Indeed, augustusgloop - spot on!

One bit of news that has to come out soon - either from the administrators or the parent company - is what has happened/what is still happening with the wind-up of the Guernsey operation. I see on the Pricewaterhouse website that in a letter to the investors at the end of January they said the administrators were 65% of the way through the reconcilliation of the 4000+ portfolios, and that that had to be completed before any investor could receive his or her collection. Now..what happens when they are released..what kind of effect will that have on the top-end market? Unhappy/desperate investors looking for a quick sale? SG adding to their overpriced stock at knock-down prices ....or other more prudent dealers buying and bringing prices down to sensible levels?

[augustusgloop] 06/8/2018 18:53

jasdan,

with a bit of experience, you will realise that when companies have good news to deliver - they shout it from the rafters as soon as possible.

But when there is only bad news - they keep it quiet until the last possible moment.

[jasdan] 06/8/2018 13:27

Looks like the price is firming - just been quoted close to 5p to buy some of these.

[jasdan] 04/8/2018 12:18

I must admit that the price is definitely firming at the moment, so you might see your 6p price soon.

Why are announcements so 'rare' from SG at the moment? There seems to be a full year announcement at the beginning of October each year, followed by the half year update at the end of December, but basically, other than that, nothing.

At the next AGM shareholders should ask for a more spread out newsflow. From January - September each year we are all flying blind, and let's face it, there are no blind stamp collectors, so is this reasonable?

[clocktower] 27/7/2018 09:05

Recovery in SGI`s share price maybe just around the corner - notice the slight firmness in price over the last month - forming a solid base to bounce a little way towards 6p I suggest. DYOR.

[dsct] 21/7/2018 15:42

As part of a long-overdue 'folio clean up, I sold my small SGI speculative/recovery punt this month.

Down 60%, I needed a 2.5x recovery to break even and can't see that happening in the near, or medium term.

SGI plus other's I've sold as part of this clean-up, have given me a more substantial sum to invest, in hopefully something more sensible ! lol

I'll still keep popping in to read what's happening and wish all holders/buyers the best.

[augustusgloop] 21/7/2018 14:08

jasdan,

It was a great investment for them.

Even if SGI goes bust - they will receive their money back with interest.

You simply choose to believe that they invested substantially more than they actually did.

The deal was structured in the way that it was - to stop you knowing what a great deal they actually got.
There was no other benefit in arranging such a complex set up - all it did was keep certain information, pertaining to what Pheonix's genuine investment was - out of the SGI accounts.

[jasdan] 21/7/2018 12:39

I must admit I am turning more negative on this by the minute. The well publicised issues on the high street must be affecting SGI and when I went to see how bad things were last week, there was no one in the store at 399 - and this around 3pm!! The store assistant blamed it on Brexit and the hot summer. Clearly, people are not wandering in to buy stamps in the hot weather.

I cannot see how their sales can be on track, if not then they cannot be paying off debt. I am going to hold off buying any now until next year until there is some sort of improvement. Good luck to the rest of you - I note even the current value of the group is still markedly less than Phoenix's recent investment. It is clearly not a great investment for them either.

Shame, but that is the shape of the high street currently.

[superiorshares] 09/7/2018 01:39

Jasdan.....Im waiting for 2p

[superiorshares] 04/5/2018 22:19

Balgray. I pay full catalogue when I see something I want . you are correct SG do not handle defective stamps. The Items priced at 100,0000 and more will sell. Selling those items, you have to be able to keep that capital tied up until a buyer comes along . Phoenix has provided that. You have hit the nail on the head " most of these items are not available elsewhere ". Jasdan you still don't understand, Phoenix profit is coming from the loans they made to SG. And you shouldn't be wasting your time on here, but topping up your shareholding, before the price drops further :-)

[balgray] 04/5/2018 21:04

Indeed, dsct, but with the prices as currently pitched, the items are not selling = no profit. There are 24 items on the GB part of the website priced at £100,000.00 or more, these being at full SG catalogue prices or higher. I accept that most of these are not available elsewhere, but the maxim that "I'm not paying full catalogue - or anything like it" -applies to the vast majority of collectors - and especially those who could afford that kind of fun!
Jasdan: lower down the pecking order (all relative,of course) your figures are not quite correct. A mint block of four 1840 2d blues, if they had one, would be £280,000.00 (full catalogue, like those around it)...the best they have at present is a mint pair of them at £125,000.00 (against their own catalogue of £110,000.00 - albeit it is a marginal pair). The 'cheapest' 1d black on their website is £325 - again reflecting their full catalogue. I have never seen an SG 1d black at £125 - it would have to be (for their pricing philosophy)a 3-margin or otherwise defective stamp (which SG do not, in my experience, handle). My point is , however, that many of the long-standing, good and sound GB dealers WILL sell you a 4-margin 1d black for that. SG, as I said in my previous post, need to look at the catalogue prices vs. their selling prices.

[augustusgloop] 04/5/2018 11:53

dsct,

correct

[dsct] 04/5/2018 11:17

With regards to the stock value.

This 'should' be on the balance sheet at the cost price, but not checked to see if it has been/is revalued at SGI.

e.g.
Buy stamp for £100.
On the balance sheet :
Stock : + £100
Bank : - £100

It's only when sold that the profit is realised.