Stand.ch.7te%pr Discussion Threads

[kickingking] 17/1/2023 16:21

This is trading on the bid side 4p behind RSAB. Hopefully soon they'll both be above 110p. People will cotton on that these a bargain below 110p

[badtime] 02/12/2022 15:21

Good to see the bid firming ..gives comfort to holders

[rik shaw] 30/11/2022 08:49

Just tried a dummy trade for 5100 with HL and no problem getting a quote.

[stansmith1] 29/11/2022 18:38

what you make of liquidity here, easy to sell?

[aishah] 25/11/2022 09:09

Added here as well.

[rik shaw] 21/11/2022 21:30

Yes LLPE redeemable on 15/9/24, or any fifth anniversary of this date

[redartbmud] 21/11/2022 17:26

I sold LLPE a while ago, and at a decent premium.
I have deleted the prospectus from my records, but apart from thr fear of rising interest rates, I was concerned that Lloyds might do the dirty on holders. I sold LLPC at the same time, for the same reason.

From memory the bank has the option to 'call' the LLPE prefs sometime in 2024 or 2025, and I was betting that they would do so. The call would be at par.

I have bought a few Stab at 97.2 on 11 11.22. Adding to an existing holding.

FWIW.

red

[kickingking] 21/11/2022 16:40

Bought some today to hold for next few years. Paid, all in with cost Average price 97.8p. That is approximately 7.75% interest with potential capital gains in the next few years. My strategy now is to only buy into companies paying a 7%+ dividend with potential capital gains. Will definitely avoid dividend traps.

[ammons] 15/11/2022 11:27

Thats a pretty good strategy IMO but the LLPE prefs do have a lower coupon than the other two. I very much doubt that Aviva will cancel any prefs at par given the trouble they got into trying to do that in 2018 (unless the prefs trade at substantially less than par which seems unlikely to me).

[creme de menthe] 15/11/2022 09:35

I really only consider prefs at par, or near par because of the possibility of cancellation at par, so GACB at 102p, LLPE at 100p and STAB at 98p are the ones I looked at, which minimise redemption loss. There is always a possibilty of 20% gain when inflation falls and about 7.5% income too.

[cassini] 07/11/2022 15:14

Voci,

Looks like it unless there are any surprises. The market is forward-looking.

[voci] 07/11/2022 14:34

Last weeks 3/4% interest rate rise did not appear to have much of a negative impact fixed interest investments.

Are we at the point where the current rising interest rate trend which currently is forecast to peak next year is priced in?

[stansmith1] 05/11/2022 07:33

are the terms for the general accident better / worse than the aviva prefs, presumably the risks are identical?

[cassini] 04/11/2022 20:36

GACA, GACB

[stansmith1] 04/11/2022 17:46

thanks, a few i have not considered there, will take a lookcheers

[wozzitworthit] 04/11/2022 17:35

Having held most of usual suspects previously, this time round I have only so far purchased NWBD and ELLA. I will probably dd to those if price remains around same as at present (or obviously lower)

Thinking of BWRA and maybe NTEA (anyone have any thoughts on this one ?)

Also, possibly STAB and one of the Aviva Prefs (probably GACB)

PIBS and PSBs - Manchester BS - MBSP & MBSR, Coop 42TE, 1SBB and NOTP

Bonds quite a few from before, but more recent;y ENQ1, ENQ2, BT Group 72NS, Tesco 40OS, more BUR3

[voci] 04/11/2022 17:34

These yield just shy of 8%

[stansmith1] 04/11/2022 17:13

just as a matter of interest what other prefs / bonds are people holding..i have av.a, nwbd, stab and am avoiding llpc this time round after the way they behaved...looking for bond/pref ideas

[wozzitworthit] 04/11/2022 10:58

Yup,I think that is the case

[hindsight] 04/11/2022 09:06

Thx for replies. On spreadsheet here inc accured divis stab 7.6% which compares to 6.95% for NWDB or 7.37% LLPD. From memory these use to be similar to UK banks, why I suggest some china discount is offered

[wozzitworthit] 04/11/2022 08:46

These can now be bought for 98p, which with Stamp Duty, but excluding dealing charges gives a yield of 7.52%

There is possibly a bit if comfort in buying below par, but as we have seen over the years with various sagas with Perpetual Subordinated Bonds (nee PIBS), Prefs, ECNs etc, and huge discussions on other boards regarding what is meant by redemption, irredeemable, perpetual etc etc, that may mean nothing.

Even so, I am tempted to buy some of these at this price


Woz

[cerrito] 03/11/2022 19:35

As someone who no longer holds either STAN or HSBA common shares because of the complications with China, I am a relaxed holder of Stab and do not see for one moment the China complications impacting STAN's credit rating such that the credit quality of the prefs would be called into question.
CdeM
STAN must regard these prefs as a real pain but post Aviva I do not see them doing a forced redemption but may well do a LLPC buyback

[hindsight] 31/10/2022 09:39

Think these clearly now have a China discount vs their peers like china stocks do. Question is what is fair for that risk.

[creme de menthe] 13/10/2022 08:46

Is there any expectation the company will be redeeming these notes at par in the near future?
I'm looking to buy in a chunk as part of my long term plan.