S & U Share Discussion Threads

[wildshot] 15/10/2019 14:39

f15jcm all the versions related to that story that I'm hearing or reading today relate to PCPs. S&U have stated a number of times that they don't get involved in PCP so I don't think they'll be directly affected by this story, although maybe sold down in a general market reaction without sellers looking into the dynamics of S&U.

[f15jcm] 15/10/2019 14:33

Do you think this poses significant risk?

[plasybryn] 15/10/2019 12:54

Thanks jeffian. And of course goes ex dividend on 24th October and paid 15th November.
34p dividend for Christmas!

[jeffian] 15/10/2019 12:47

Gets a write-up in Telegraph's Questor column today. Nothing we don't already know. Concludes it's a "Hold". It may get a fillip tomorrow when all the old Colonels wake up and send a letter to their brokers to buy. It's so illiquid, any trades affect the price either way.

[gabsterx] 24/9/2019 08:38

Nice steady results and nice appointment as Plasybryn mentioned. As long as Coombs is chairman I believe we should see more of the same conservative growth.

On another note is anyone else seeing SUS as 'non-tradable' in their brokerage account? Not sure what's happening.

[plasybryn] 24/9/2019 08:15

Great new appointment. A real heavyweight. Wonder how that will play out. Will he want to expand the business faster? Or will the age old attitude to risk and prudency prevail?How will he fit in to this very family focussed Co.? Will be interesting to watch. Hopefully his new ideas, experience, contacts and enthusiasm will do great things for the Co. & the share price.

[plasybryn] 23/9/2019 14:57

1 share traded. Mean something?

[gabsterx] 20/8/2019 09:08

I tried to do a DCF of S&U, since FCF is very hard to assess for a financial company due to the nature of the business I've used net income instead. My inputs are:

- Earnings growth of 7% for the next 5 years (last 10 years was 19%)
- Long term growth rate of 1% afterwards
- Discount rate of 9%
- Net debt of 108M

This gives me a fair value for the stock of 2950p which implies a 30% margin of safety at today's price. I'm tempted to add more today, have some extra cash from the RPC sale that should find a nice home at S&U!

EDIT: Was ready to take the plunge but saw a bid-ask spread of 140p! That's a 7% premium, absolute madness..

EDIT 2: It's 160 now, lol.. volume at 11. Greedy market makers.

[prospective investor] 16/8/2019 09:21

Down down down, wider economic uncertainties causing this? If it breaches £20 we might see £18. I belive this is a great company, so cash on the side ready to add.

[rogash] 08/8/2019 14:26

Very disappointed in the reaction to the trading update, especially in view of the recent fall in the share price.

[gabsterx] 08/8/2019 13:54

I think Buffett would agree with you, he calls it 'diworsification' and claims 'diversification is protection against ignorance'. However as I'm still a novice investor with barely a year under my belt, so playing it safe by targeting a maximum of 5% weight on each position. I only have 2 companies that exceed that, one being SUS (couldn't resist adding at 1800p levels) and the other SBUX (blew up by 95% since I bought in June last year).

As I gain a bit more confidence I'll be looking at increasing my top 3 or 4 positions to 10%+, hopefully at a big margin of safety!

[jeffian] 08/8/2019 10:10

I was quietly cursing the positive update as I had every intention of hoovering up more at these levels, and maybe below if the market is rattled by political upheaval.

Re "overweight", I know that everyone's appetite for risk is different (and mine seems particularly high!) but my experience is that maintaining "balance" tends to mediocrity as you force yourself to sell winners if they grow to be a large proportion of your portfolio. My largest holding represented +/-50% of my share portfolio for years and the second largest was around 15% - both now subject to takeovers so desperately looking for somewhere to reinvest and this is one place I'm looking. SUS currently represents about 5% of my share portfolio but I would not be concerned if that became 10-15%. (Mind you, the outperformance when they go up is mirrored by the opposite when they go down, so you need to be someone who can sleep at night when things turn against you!).

[ilostthelot] 05/8/2019 13:24

Quite a big drop on known share options.

[tudes100] 31/7/2019 05:07

Financial calendar on S&U site now updated till May 2020, includes all trading updates

[jeffian] 23/7/2019 16:05

I am thinking the same. Besides RPC (now banked) my biggest single holding by far is now subject to an agreed bid so I am desperately looking for a new home for the ill-gotten gains!

[ilostthelot] 23/7/2019 15:08

That opportunity may be approaching as its dipped from recent highs of £24+. Looking at the 5 year chart it's pretty much went side ways. £20 looks like a good entry point imho.

[jeffian] 21/7/2019 14:33

Don't worry about the 'off topic'. Only sensible investors here so quiet thread and no rudery, which is a relief. Happy to read about other things too.

Re comments about never buying enough of good shares, I have been invested here since 2001 when it fitted my criteria of 'low PER/high yield' and there came a time when I had a good hard look at my investing method and found that I was so busy looking for 'the next big thing' that I forgot to look at the gems already in my portfolio. I changed my approach to continuing to add to quality shares as long as they looked cheap to me and this one made the cut (along with DPLM, RPC (now taken over) and GNK among others) so I have a considerable holding now and am happy to add more as opportunities arise.

[plasybryn] 21/7/2019 12:05

I used to go to the CEY AGM's. I wonder if we ever met?

[chrismcglone] 21/7/2019 11:06

Cheers Plasy, not exactly a busy board so hopefully the occ digression not too objectionable for others. In the very early days of the first CEY B Board, when you could easily go a week with no posts, a few of us shared some good knowledge and research on other companies while we waited for things to happen at Centamin. No harm occasionally. Anyway, back to sleep here :-)

[plasybryn] 20/7/2019 19:15

I'm with you. I like Dividend payers and trade them to maximise returns where I can.I bought into AAZ also end of last year and am glad I did. This is one I'm holding or adding, as again it ticks the boxes. I have been in CEY years ago but not recently. And Golden Prospect which will do well if gold continues to rise.Other divvy stocks, amongst others I trade, include TEP, SSPG, 3IN, CAML and HGM.I also like EVR which has a good yield which I hold onto - growth & income. Ariana (AAU) is my main growth stock as the Mkt Cap is only £25m and I expect Salinbas etc to be a multi million oz resource. Kiziltepe (50% owned & profitable) will be joined by a second mine at Tavsan in 2 years more than doubling production/profits. With costs around $600 per oz and discovery costs around $15 per oz., this is an exceptional Co. waiting to be discovered. Panmure Gordon have it as a BUY. Once the debt is repaid (Easter next year) I think there is a chance of a maiden dividend as the free cash flow will be impressive. I apologise if other SUS investors have found this exchange unacceptable. SUS is a core holding for me and I'm expecting capital gains here, albeit on a smaller scale. Good luck.

[chrismcglone] 20/7/2019 14:16

Thanks Plasy. I’ve picked up some good tips from trusted posters on here over the years (ie, not obvious rampers). I’ve been in many a gold miner over the past 20yrs. Golden Prospect was my first, closely followed by Centamin - which I first started buying at 7p. Have held various amounts ever since and it has paid for a fair few house improvements over the years. Still in a few speculative golds with AAZ being the best performer of late - at long last. Another long term buy and hold and at least I’m back into positive territory now.

As I said above, I’m now moving into a period of my life where income is far more a priority that capital appreciation and that’s the companies I tend to keep an eye out for and research. Got onto this via an early speculation in Lloyd’s insurance syndicates which was a very specialist area. Was put onto them by a close friend who worked in the business. Unless something dramatic happened here I can’t see anything that would make me sell and if anything, I will continue to drip feed.

[plasybryn] 19/7/2019 19:48

I must admit I also have a sizeable holding in Ariana Resources (AAU) which is also coming good. I started investing 10 yrs ago in the Co. but bought in heavy sub 1p a few years ago. It probably will in time pay a dividend by I bought it for much the same reasons as SUS. 1. I trust & respect the prime movers. Got to know them well over a long time. 2. Skin in the game - not as much as SUS but they aren't as wealthy 3. I believe in gold & Silver - cycle starting to turn perhaps.4. I believe in the business proposition (like I do with SUS) and the potential for AAU to multi bag over the next 3 years. More steady rate of climb with SUS, but less risk.Sorry to go off topic, but thought it might be of interest.

[chrismcglone] 19/7/2019 19:18

And as alluded to in the header, a significant purchase would probably have generated a huge spread so I would prob have been limited to what I could have bought.

[chrismcglone] 19/7/2019 19:16

I recall looking at the dividend yield when I bought my first stake Plasy. It was around 12%. After the crash and as the share price dropped with everything else. Ordinarily you could bet your house on a divi cut under those circumstances. However,a couple of things persuaded me otherwise to take a gamble. The very small free float/shares traded and the significant family holdings, particularly family members already retired. I reckoned they had a particular vested interest in maintaining the dividend and the company could just about ride it out so long as they flew under the radar. As I said, my only regret was failing to put my money behind my gut instinct and conviction of my own research. But hey, I’m not greedy and as I said, I try and top up occ, even at these levels. I’m no longer looking for capital growth.