R&q Insurance Share Discussion Threads

[profit7] 16/4/2024 13:49

$500m sale this Quarter
Mcap £10m

Do one mms this should be 40p

Because 60p on sale

[sbb1x] 08/2/2024 11:56

4.50 on the bid, any chance of a turn around here.....

[foreverbull] 02/2/2024 16:50

Looks like this is going towards (sad) demise !

[sbb1x] 23/1/2024 11:47

New 52 week low

[catabrit] 22/12/2023 09:56

More bad news. I just do not know how the average PI can underwrite the risk reward of this thing.

[controlledmadness] 14/12/2023 09:03

This deal seems bad. The items that R&Q are committed to from the purchase price seem to be there to make the price sound better.
I can almost understand the load of 46 million having to be repaid .
The capital contribution to Accredited should come with some value like shares or be made by the buyer.
I am not sure what the extra collateral is for but if it is accredited then the buyer should be paying it.
The assumed debt 0f 27 million from accredited should not left with accredited.
So at best 27+76 million =103 million should be deducted from the purchase price with the buyer just giving the money to Accredited.
So the purchase price is actually 362 million.
If the collateral is for Accredited then another 40-80 million need to be deducted from the purchase price.

[sbb1x] 17/11/2023 15:48

Up 18 percent and no posts...

[topvest] 15/11/2023 14:12

Very interesting developments here. I did well out of this by backing Ken Randall and exiting when he did. Phoenix and Slater thought they new best and have come thoroughly unstuck. I wonder whether Ken Randall may be tempted back? He would need to buy one of the larger holders shares first. It's back to what it was, with the legacy business, at 1/10th of the price!

[hybrasil] 24/10/2023 17:35

Yes a friend sent me that article.
I made good money historically from R&Q. Having read that article I decided it was barge pole material

[simon gordon] 24/10/2023 15:02

Here's how the Insurer is covering it, article is paywalled:

R&Q sells the Accredited crown jewels but proceeds represent only half of debt

The $465mn enterprise value put on Accredited in its proposed sale to Onex Partners appears to be broadly in line with expectations, but net cash proceeds available to R&Q after the deal closes may cover as little as half of the beleaguered parent’s debt, analysis by The Insurer shows.

[catabrit] 24/10/2023 13:35

Yeah, spot on. None of the newcomers have done well. Enstar have bossed it and that is probably because they have been in the game for thirty years and own 30% of the stock.

[foreverbull] 24/10/2023 13:31

I think the problem with legacy business is they may have priced the acquisitions aggressively which is haunting them now....

[catabrit] 24/10/2023 12:53

Market is saying TBV is likely lower as liabilities have not been priced properly. I would rather own Enstar Group at 0.9x book and likely lower when you take into account their conservatism.

[willemers0n] 24/10/2023 12:47

Agree not uncommon to trade below book, and anything below <0.5 book generally pricing as highly distressed. Interesting to note, 3mn shares traded since yesterday on a float of approx. 374mn or 0.8% - illiquid small cap. Someone could come in and be comfortable at 0.6x book following de-levering and that's be a 2x from here. But ofc it's insurance and not even mgmt seem to know where liabilities are landing...

[willemers0n] 24/10/2023 10:25

Indeed, but at 20 pence a share, it's now trading at 0.31 P/book or .21 P/ tangible book. They're getting $50mn working cap and liquidity for RQ next 18 months operations, plus that's assuming the top end of $80mn in collateral for RQ legacy liabilities and only $170mn de-levering. They're also injecting $76mn equity to Accredited ex-post transaction, so RQ should still own a stake in accredited right? Unless they're quite listerally asset stripping and leaving a doomed ship, in which case they'll have lawsuits coming their way from main shareholders. Would love ppls thoughts

[catabrit] 24/10/2023 10:10

Legacy insurance run by a management team with little skin in the game seldom ends well.

[spectoacc] 24/10/2023 09:39

"simon gordon23 Oct '23 - 14:53 - 1444 of 1447
0 0 0
If this goes to zero, Slater will have lost £82m by turning down 170p. Phoenix about £26m. What a dog's dinner."


Isn't as if they weren't warned. Never ceases to amaze me how badly "OPM" gets managed.

[catabrit] 23/10/2023 17:51

Sadly this is what happens when you buy something you know little about. I put this on the watchlist after it was recommended to me on Twitter. I did about an hour of work on it at 50p ish and put it in the too hard pile. For me, legacy insurance with zero competitive advantage is a no-go area almost at any price. Especially if there’s no real alignment.

[simon gordon] 23/10/2023 15:12

Edward,

According to R&Q's website they are still a holder.

[edwardt] 23/10/2023 15:08

phoenix sold out a while back i recall

[simon gordon] 23/10/2023 13:53

If this goes to zero, Slater will have lost £82m by turning down 170p. Phoenix about £26m. What a dog's dinner.

[simon gordon] 23/10/2023 13:49

Control,

There is quite a bit of debt in preference shares to be paid off, including a recent raise of $60m. It looks like most of the money from the sale is going to pay off debt.

The toxic Legacy book has destroyed all the value in the company.

If Gibson RE 1 doesn't work out they are stuffed.

It would have been best if they could have sold Legacy and kept Accredited, obviously nobody wants to go near it. Slater and Phoenix so screwed up on this one, all the signals were flashing sell at 170p and they said no.