Lloyds Grp 9.25 Discussion Threads

[fxbond] 04/8/2009 12:20

Well LLOY Prefs look all very nice until you read the small print inthe Prospectus! They can pay part or no dividend if they have no profits to pay them ie A LOSS and also if you read a bit further down they can exchange them for new Tier 1 without reference to shareholders whenever they like. Thanks very much Libor plus a little per cent. LloydsPrefs not a great buy at present prices if better than 5% less tax in the building society at the moment that is.

[davidosh] 01/8/2009 18:20

OBR....Thank you for all your excellent work btw.

[old boy returns] 01/8/2009 13:38

narja - the xd dates are only relevant to those stocks which trade dirty rather than clean with accrued interest. All the bonds, PIBs and some of the prefs (those traded on Euroclear such as LLPL and LLPG) trade clean so theere are no xd dates.

For the prefs which trade dirty the xd dates are not announced very far in advance hence, in general, they simply are not available or known. Where they are and I can find them I will add them in future.

[nerja] 01/8/2009 10:04

old boy returns

I hope you dont mind me asking but is there any chance of you putting the XD dates on the spreadsheet, I think it would be a great timing help for building positions. I know the paydates are there but the XDs the investment date that matters, IMO

TIA

Nerja

[pillion] 31/7/2009 23:14

Are HALB as safe as HALP ?

[cerrito] 28/7/2009 23:15

old boy returns
Thanks for that google link
As a holder of 20k of FAP I was interested to read the prospectus and indeed interested to see that when they were issued they were not owned by RBS.
FAP's price seems very stuck compared to what has been going on in the last 10 days with the PIBS and instruments like LLPC.
Remember if you buy FAP do not put it in a ISA/PEP or SIPP as interest is paid with a 20% withholding.

[old boy returns] 28/7/2009 23:15

Hi Pillion - the LBG 13% Step-up Perps are already on my fixed income spreadsheet - they are the 76AG and 76AH under LBG. All the details you ask for are on there except the price is mid only as I cannot find an online source of bid and offer for most institutional type bonds. Note they do not have an ex-div date because they trade clean with accrued interest.

[pillion] 28/7/2009 22:20

Old BR

Thanks for the spreadsheet

The FAP & NWBD are too long and complex for me to digest

Been trying to find info on these Step Up Perps

LLOYDS TSB BANK PLC 13% STEP-UP PERP CAP SECS CALL 19 BR £

Any idea how the buy sell price, ex divi dates etc can be traced ?

I realise that one needs a tidy wallop of £££ to invest in them

[old boy returns] 28/7/2009 13:39

For those interested I have managed to get hold fo the FAP and NWBD prospectuses and have uploaded them to Google Docs. You can access the link (may need to register - free - first) from my Fixed Interest spreadsheet at:

[pillion] 24/7/2009 17:16

These look interesting but I can't find any charts etc

LLOYDS TSB BANK PLC 13% STEP-UP PERP CAP SECS CALL 19 BR £

[pillion] 23/7/2009 16:31

Folderboy
Thanks for the link

HALP looks OK

[pillion] 23/7/2009 15:13

Sol
What is the yield on HALP at present share price ?

[solomon9] 22/7/2009 15:21

That's right massive spread plus small income gain from selling LLPC and buying HALP - HALP is DIRT CHEAP at 73

[jaws6] 22/7/2009 09:19

Lord G
yes you can have halp in isa. not sure difference for isa and outside.i do in isa to save me tax problems.

[old boy returns] 22/7/2009 09:15

But against that gains on most bonds are tax free whereas those on preference shares are subject to capital gains tax.

[lord gnome] 22/7/2009 08:44

kiwi - my point exactly. HALP are bonds not prefs ergo they must be paid gross and subject to tax. This could help to explain why the yields are apparantly so generous when compared with prefs.

Next Question: Can bonds be held in an ISA? If they can, then that tasty gross yield can indeed be captured.

[kiwi2007] 22/7/2009 07:05

The initial rise seemed to tie in with a 'puff' from the Times for LLPF and hence more PIs entering the market.


More to it than that though I'm sure.

-----------

Lord Gnome.

Prefs dividends as I understand it arre paid from corporate profits which have already been taxed so qualify as tax paid for basic rate taxpayers. I am open to correction on that though.

[kbass] 22/7/2009 06:54

Any reason for the rapid leap from 70 to 82?

[lord gnome] 18/7/2009 11:21

Excuse my ignorance pp, but do HALP pay dividends gross at 9.375% (as with prefs) or are they subject to income tax? I always thought that you paid tax on bonds whereas the divi on prefs was tax paid for standard rate tax payers. In which case, the income from your prefs will surely be lower after tax.

[pennypunter] 18/7/2009 10:48

Right I've sold all my Lloyds 9.25% prefs at 70 -and bought HALP 9.375% at 66
reckon this is a smart move, - takes out 4p pure profit and adds a little more income.

[pyemckay] 12/7/2009 16:57

LLPF tipped in Sunday Times.

[kbass] 22/6/2009 05:33

Extrader, most helpful, thanks a lot.

[solomon9] 21/6/2009 21:10

Check out RB01 this warrant pays a return 2x the FTSE 100 return to April 2014. Base index value is 4080 I think. Each warrant certificate is around £112. Max payout in April 2014 is £280.