Hansard Global Share Discussion Threads

[envirovision] 09/4/2011 20:52

So fxdealer3, err what planet are you from then?

In todays FT, Peter Temple disagrees:

Published: April 8 2011

My main equity purchase in the past month has been Hansard.............................................................................................Hansard's embedded value is around 192p versus a share price of less than 160p. Embedded value looks at the value of the company's policies in force, but bearing in mind that they will be profitable for many years into the future as premiums continue to be paid.

For shares in a company such as this to trade at a discount to its embedded value strongly suggests that it is undervalued.

[fxdealer3] 02/4/2011 22:34

U may start analysis by NAV of 38p and share price £1.55 .

Dividends can be cut at any given time and buying on div alone is fool hardy .

EEV is never used by funds for basing investing decisons .It is nice to read but not financially relevant under global appraisal methods .

HSD chart does not make good reading and some of stats I use show it is overvalued without div yield .The 5 yr chart is very bad .

Be careful

Fx

[simon gordon] 31/3/2011 11:52

In the hunt for yield you'd think HSD would be 180p not 157p and trending lower.

[grahamburn] 31/3/2011 11:42

Don't intend to drag on the discussion about gross dividends or an applicable tax credit but it does vary from foreign company to foreign company depending on their size and trading activities. For instance, Charlemagne Capital dividends are definitively paid gross whilst the "gross" dividends from Public Service Properties do come with a notional tax credit of 1/9th which needs to be added on. Furthermore, looking at the dividend voucher for the Hansard dividend payable today it is quite clear that it is paid gross without any notional tax credit. This confirms the unambiguous guidance given by the company via email.

[envirovision] 31/3/2011 08:24

Growth in Asia, but its really a mistake to buy this for capital growth imo, rather as an income stock. This stock is ideal for the rich and retired.

Currently though its on offer at a cracking price, I doubt you will be able to pick it up any lower. I have divi re-investment plan so am happy.

[simon gordon] 31/3/2011 08:13

I'm tempted to buy for the value but the chart has been in a relentless downtrend for the past year.

Fundies don't seem that interested in the stock.

What will be the catalyst to get this moving to the top of the trading range?

[papy02] 31/3/2011 08:02

If you guys want to pay excess tax, I guess we can't stop you.

Enviro, where in the links given do you see anything about company size?

The opening para of charlie's link says
"As a result of changes made in the 2008 and 2009 Finance Acts, tax credits also attach to most 'relevant distributions' from companies non-resident in the United Kingdom which are made either to residents of the United Kingdom or "

Dividends are paid out of taxed corporate income. That's why there is a tax credit. Arm twisting, no doubt by EU amongst others means that is now applicable to non-UK-source dividends.

What's not to like?

(Got mine in an ISA anyway but the discussion is relevant to other holdings I have)

[pote] 31/3/2011 01:24

The "tax credit" is notional. As far as we are concerned it doesn't exist.

[envirovision] 30/3/2011 23:51

Yea but charlie, thats only for small companies with a balance sheet of 50 Million or less. Its a ruling to make it simple for UK part owners or partners of private foreign businesses to be able to take a dividend profit from the company without paying tax twice since normally the profits would have already have been subjected to tax in the resident country.

For a PLC like this, HMRC can hardly give a tax credit can they, because in effect they would be paying you extra money on top of what the company was paying you.

HMRC are there to take money away, not give money away. What you have to do is declare the dividend as untaxed income and pay income tax on it in your year end tax return. (Since there is no tax credit).

If you are not asked to fill out a tax return, you still by law must tell the revenue you have received untaxed income from foreign company. The revenue will then ask you to complete a tax return and you may have to pay some income tax on this depending on any other income sources you may also have.

[charlie] 30/3/2011 23:22

NO sir. The answer Hansard gave was true, but I don't think you fully understand the question.

Hansard pay the dividend gross (ie with no deduction of tax) to shareholders in any territory anywhere in the world, and they don't know about anything called a "tax credit."

But for a UK resident, that's not the point. The point is that under UK legislation, a UK resident taxpayer receiving the Hansard dividend is entitled to a tax credit of 1/9 of the gross dividend(provided he doesn't own more than 10% of Hansard).

Anyone who wants to understand this should read the legislation. Sections 397A and 397AA of the Income Tax (Trading and Other Income) Act 2005.

[grahamburn] 30/3/2011 10:29

charlie. Note your new link, but again (as I pointed out in above in mid-February), not relevant to Hansard. Email the company (as I did) and you'll get a definitive answer that their dividends are paid gross and any tax liability is the responsibility of the recipient.

[charlie] 29/3/2011 22:36

With regard to the discussion above about tax credits. I believe a UK resident receiving a dividend from Hansard is entitled to a tax credit.

The Foreign page Notes (SA106) which was linked above is very badly worded. The HMRC Savings Manual (internal guidance to HMRC Inspectors) is clearer:

[envirovision] 04/3/2011 14:24

Covered in todays IC page 59 with a BUY rec.

[envirovision] 01/3/2011 16:00

xd tomorrow

[loganair] 01/3/2011 15:56

Leonard Polonsky, Chairman of Hansard Global plc, commented:

"I am delighted that our continued investment in distribution infrastructure and focus on particular growth markets has delivered new business growth of 50% over the previous year.

The Group's confidence in its future prospects is reflected in the Board's decision to increase the interim dividend by 4.5% to 5.75 pence per share, which is covered by IFRS earnings in the period. Payment date - 31 March 2011

[chrisb1103] 22/2/2011 21:22

Nice bit of buying lately - 1/2yr results Thursday and we'll see how much of their impressive new business has reached the bottom line. Surely got to be good news? Panmure have reiterated their price target of 215p. Current yield of 8% and the interim divi's been creeping up y.o.y... If the CEO is looking for a nice pay rise we'll get one too :)

[irkin] 16/2/2011 19:38

Not my understanding. Just means Jersey/IOM can't tax residents on company retained profits as if they were dividends - we will continue to receive Hansard dividends gross.

Btw, Richard Murphy is a complete and utter small minded sanctimonious moron.

[envirovision] 16/2/2011 15:56

so i guess this means our divis will be paid with a tax credit now

[papy02] 13/2/2011 20:18

Many thanks for that. I'll take care to check out any other IoM company before I invest in it outside an ISA !

[grahamburn] 13/2/2011 19:42

Papy02. For clarification, the company has confirmed to me that dividends are paid gross and without any tax credit attached, though they added that "some nominee accounts" may for their own internal procedures deduct the tax credit, though if that is the case I personally find that strange.

[papy02] 13/2/2011 16:50

Hmm - I read the list of excluded countries as applying to test 3, and as Hansard passes test 1 it's not an issue. But I accept the relevant text is not formatted under test 3 so my interpretation could be wrong.

I don't see any ref to whether dividends are paid gross.

But this is not an issue for me either way as mine are in an ISA.
Just interested for future investments in IoM registered companies.

Cheers

[grahamburn] 12/2/2011 20:31

See list of excluded countries in note 2 on next page.

Plus company has confirmed dividends are paid gross.

[papy02] 12/2/2011 20:05

Hi Grahamburn

so why do you think that



page FN9, rule 1, does not apply to Hansard ?

Many thanks

[grahamburn] 12/2/2011 18:16

Re the discussion a few days ago on the tax status of the dividend, believe the position is as follows....

1. Hansard, as an Isle of Man based company, pay their dividend gross (ie without deduction of tax).

2. The dividend will, therefore, be taxable in the hands of the recipient, (assuming they are liable to tax!) so will be taxed at their highest appliable rate of tax (eg 20%, 40% or 50%) - the non-refundable 10% tax credit rate is (presumably) not applicable.