F&c Commercial Property Share Discussion Threads

[not manu] 31/10/2007 16:50

chopshs - I did mean investors like JP and discount busters like Carousel Capital, Laxey Partners etc. Agree re reducing debt and buy backs but the management companies wouldn't like the lower management fees on the lower gross assets.

[chopshs] 28/10/2007 21:38

not manu - please clarify 'arbs getting involved'. Do you mean people like Jack Petchey taking a stake in TAP (presumable with intention of shaking things up or full takeover)?
Best thing for these companies at the present time would be for them to sell properties, reduce gearing and buy back shares. But I don't see that happening in any meaningful way for the moment.

[not manu] 26/10/2007 13:13

"not manu - 3 Jul'07 - 23:00 - 7 of 14 edit
I hold this in my pension. I like the low debt level and the quality assets. Though, it wouldn't surprise me if the discount were to widen to 25-30%".

I sold down the holding by 75% during July and Aug. The advantage with FCPT is that the debt level is much lower than all the other closed ended InvCos such as IRET IPI etc. At these large discounts there is the possibility of arbs getting involved, though the illiquid nature of the assets is a problem.

[chopshs] 24/10/2007 18:15

I've been out of the property investment trusts for a while Washbrook. Fortunately my last holding in this sector was UBR which I got lucky on. On the face of it these funds are now looking good value with big discounts to NAV and attractive dividends. 30% discounts to NAV are becoming the norm i.e. IFD, IRET, IPI... However, I suspect they will continue to get cheaper... Underlying capital values are falling and I reckon this will continue for a while. Certainly to year end. The gearing in these trusts means that their NAV's will fall faster. CAL are now trading at a discount to NAV of nearly 50% and that takes no account of the value of their fund management division. I accept CAL are a prop co but it's the same market... My view is that it's best to watch from the sidelines for the moment. Remember that most of these trusts are run by fund managers who are arguably more interested in collecting the management fees than maximising short term returns to shareholders. Most do not have the same entrepreneurial skills of say WPF, so don't expect the property portfolios to be sold to generate value for shareholders.

[washbrook] 24/10/2007 17:27

@24.10.07 on NAV at last valuation of 143.3p
26% discount nav

[washbrook] 12/10/2007 15:08

12.10.07 113p discount @21.14% on reduced nav of 143.3p for September 2007
Also 5 @ 1.5p dividends in 2007.

[washbrook] 10/9/2007 15:44

29.12.06; 131p n.a.v 134.3p discount 2.5%

2.1.07... .132p...n.a.v 135.9p ...... discount 3.6%

10.9.07...124.5p .n.a.v .147.4p ...discount 15.5% ( assuming N.A.V same as 30.6.07 )

[jonwig] 31/7/2007 18:57

Property trust shares must rise 10% in 22 days
By Rob Mackinlay

The UK's largest commercial property investment trust must see a 10% increase in share price in 22 days or management will have to call an EGM.


The £917m F&C Commercial Property Trust, a FTSE 250 company, has seen no more than 0.25p or 0.2% price movement since making the announcement in its interim results this afternoon.

In the report the trust's management reminds shareholders that its prospectus requires a share buy back if the share price falls more than five per cent below the published net asset value for 20 dealing days or more.

It is also states that if the discount stays above 5% for 90 dealing days or more, the directors will convene an Extraordinary General Meeting to consider winding up the trust. The deadline is 22 August.

The condition was written into the prospectus as a safety net for investors if the venture was failing. The current consensus is that the trust is performing well but some investors expect the EGM to boost share prices and narrow the current 15% discount.

Daniel Lockyer, manager of Iimia's £25m income fund, says that Iimia as a whole has increased its stake in F&C Commercial Property Trust over the last six weeks. He says that the reason for the increase is the large discount but also the threat of an EGM which he believes will boost share prices.

Lockyer points out that Friends Provident owns more than 50% of the commercial property trust, and that in the unlikely circumstance that shareholders vote to close the trust, there will be potential buyers for the whole portfolio.

Paul Herrington managing director of F&C Property Asset Management, says that the clause was put in the prospectus to establish whether shareholders wanted the trust to carry on with business.

He says that the scenario for which this clause was designed is not the current one: "At every one of the investor presentations we go to they are all very happy with what they have bought into."

However he confirmed that the deadline for the EGM would be on 22 August with the meeting having to take place within three months.

[not manu] 13/7/2007 22:42

extract of RNS 2359A below

"RNS Number:2359A
F&C Commercial Property Trust Ltd
13 July 2007


To: Company Announcements
Date: 13 July 2007
Company: F&C Commercial Property Trust Limited

Subject: Net Asset Value

Net Asset Value

The unaudited Net Asset Value per share of F&C Commercial Property Trust Limited
as at 30 June 2007 was 147.4 pence, representing an increase of 2.6 per cent
over the quarter. This Net Asset Value figure incorporates the external
portfolio valuation as at 30 June 2007................................"

[not manu] 03/7/2007 23:00

I hold this in my pension. I like the low debt level and the quality assets. Though, it wouldn't surprise me if the discount were to widen to 25-30%.

[nickcduk] 27/6/2007 14:59

The discount is narrower than that afforded to property stocks. Im not sure thats justified.

[washbrook] 27/6/2007 14:54

27.6.07 Nav 143.6 (if Nav is same as April 2007)
at a discount of 15.39% on share price of 121.5

[washbrook] 02/1/2007 22:22

2.1.07... .132p...n.a.v 135.9...... discount 3.6%

[washbrook] 02/1/2007 13:17

29.12.06; 131p n.a.v 134.3 discount 2.5%

[washbrook] 12/12/2006 17:40

An interesting play came to the market in 18.3.05 closed first day at 107p.
No stamp duty paid on the contract note on my purchase..