Cloudified Share Discussion Threads

[neo26] 29/8/2016 15:03

Pat VeraShe is very dangerous.. :)

[carlo sartori] 29/8/2016 14:29

I'm with you on this one neo26 (7532). How Noor failing to turn up because he might be embarrassed could possibly be construed as a positive for RoI is beyond me!

I do not propose that this case is a slam dunk or anything like it. I do think that that those who feel chl will win the case are able to set out very clear and detailed reasons to support their case while those who suggest that Churchill may lose the case seem to have difficulty setting out as clear reasoning..........and many merely scare-monger the negativities.

In the overall, this is a gamble, but personally I very much like the odds in what is effectively a 2-horse race. From the evidence that we know of, which is all in the public domain, I would be shocked if RoI win their case.....................it MIGHT happen, but I am comfortable to bet that it won't.

GLA.

Carlo.

[keeptoyourown] 29/8/2016 13:29

I expect it is Patty. As I noticed a sell vote changed into a buy vote.

Stans Energy rose 133% on Friday. Looks like it is Churchill's turn next.

[neo26] 29/8/2016 12:48

keeptoyourown

you a bluey now, :)

dont worry Gbot will be topping up first thing or is it Patty?

[neo26] 29/8/2016 12:42

Carcosa

"...At the end of the day I believe there was plenty of opportunity for RoI to make a case and indeed it can be construed that Noor's refusal to appear before the tribunal is suggestive that indeed he was sufficiently embarrassed by his failings, that he did not wish to be exposed in such a way. Thus the Noor issue becomes a positive for RoI."

How does Noor issue become a positive for Roi?

[neo26] 29/8/2016 12:36

Wulber, Its sept, but one can speculate it will be early sept as Quinny was expecting the results in June if you listen to his podcast and presentation.

Flying C, the main reason why i am confident is because Isran Noor was the man in charge and issued these licenses, he was the one that put these allegations of forgery once the "world class" resources were found. He gave his written evidence to the tribunal and when they told him to come in for cross examination he point blanked refused, the tribunal even tried to make it easier for him to give his evidence via video link he still refused claiming he was too busy.

Now why would one do that? Whos knows once forgery verdict is out we may be looking back and say this was such a no brainer, but this is the main reason that makes me favour chl chances...

But you never know Roi might pull something out of the hat we just dont know.

dyor, imho

[carcosa] 29/8/2016 12:31

Hello Flying C,

I think it's necessary to consider what the hearing is about; and I'm not entirely sure we do know the details and I'm sure that the nuances are what will ultimately decide how the ICSID will rule.

The various aspects, I believe, are whether or not the documents are authentic, if authentic documents should/should not have hand written signatures, and whether the chops are appropriate. I also suspect the validity of such documents are dependent upon various processes

I cannot believe for one minute that CHL would go ahead with the claim if they felt any of the documents e.g. survey and exploration licenses are forged. The problem, as I see it, relates to the RoI processes.

For example, RoI could claim the processes under which the documents were issued violated RoI laws etc and therefore although appearing genuine they do, in fact, have no merit. Also the signatures were signed by someone who has no legal jurisdiction to sign them, or perhaps the incorrect chops were used. Or perhaps the documentation was not registered or lodged in the appropriate manner.

All of the above may well be simply unknown to CHL and indeed perhaps all of the parties at the time, from both sides, were acting in good faith but ultimately incorrectly.

At the end of the day I believe there was plenty of opportunity for RoI to make a case and indeed it can be construed that Noor's refusal to appear before the tribunal is suggestive that indeed he was sufficiently embarrassed by his failings, that he did not wish to be exposed in such a way. Thus the Noor issue becomes a positive for RoI.

So it may be that ICSID rule the documents are genuine but because certain subsequent processes had yet to be completed their validity/meaning/worth remains in question thus rendering CHL, who acted in good faith, without a substantial claim against RoI.

Then the next obvious question is if the documents are valid then 'what do they mean or infer'? Having a language barrier affords plenty of opportunity to interpret what words specifically mean especially in a legal sense. Normally such documents in English will have a caveat on them which basically says that should there be any disagreement between the English and Indonesian version then it is the Indonesian version which has authority over the English version. Add in the fact that the documents are likely drawn up in less than ideal bahasa Indonesia then further scope for confusion/interpretation exists.

So overall this is far far from a slam dunk that many people seem to anticipate. What CHL thought they had may in fact be something else entirely through no fault of their own.

Whether RoI will prevail in this matter depends perhaps on how much ICSID believe was issued on good faith at the time by both parties versus a strict interpretation of what may have actually been issued. Given the ICSID are not a court of criminal law they have much more freedom to interpret the meaning and forgive 'mistakes' and on that basis I think CHL will have a favourable judgement.

[keeptoyourown] 29/8/2016 11:44

Funny how it has only taken 2 days for all my fears to be cleared up about this share.

[neo26] 28/8/2016 22:37

The illegal logging will not hold, this is the issue the forgery allegations, I believe if roi lose they will give up and settle.IMHO, dyor..

[debbiegee] 28/8/2016 22:22

I think IF the outcome of the forgery case is positive there is not much more to sort.
I guess you saw the quote I posted from an rns which answered the logging questions .

DQ put 1yr to 18 months max for the final result in the podcast and ICSID said something about the timeframes being kept to schedule and no further delays although those familiar with Icsid proceedings keep saying it could take longer?

I would not like to put a price on it IF we get through this round but it will be based on the odds of winning and expected award then only a percetage of that depending on the perceived [until announced ]time factor.

So quiet a lot of scope for everyman to calculate his price LOL

[neo26] 28/8/2016 21:50

Debbie

IF forgery case falls in our favour this stock will be £1+, the city boys will join the party. Once tribunal deem the licenses to be genuine then one can speculate that CHL will get some sort of payment from roi. I won't be surprised if roi do settle just after the verdict.

Imho

[debbiegee] 28/8/2016 20:32

Thanks weegeordie I did manage to fix it in the end from the toolbar [each programme or pg individualy ]

I have c+p your instructions for another time so thanks again Debbie

[weegeordie] 28/8/2016 15:02

... or this several times
CTRL + SHIFT + < = Decrease font size

Never had the problem so don't know which might work.

[weegeordie] 28/8/2016 15:00

... or one of these
CTRL + SHIFT Shortcuts From A-Z:

CTRL + SHIFT + C =Copy Formats
CTRL + SHIFT + D = Double Underline text
CTRL + SHIFT + E = Track changes
CTRL + SHIFT + F = Change the font
CTRL + SHIFT + H = Apply hidden text formatting
CTRL + SHIFT + K = Format letters as small capitals
CTRL + SHIFT + L = Apply the List style
CTRL + SHIFT + M = Remove a paragraph indent from the left
CTRL + SHIFT + N = Apply the Normal Style
CTRL + SHIFT + P = Change the font size
CTRL + SHIFT + Q = Change the selection to the Symbol font
CTRL + SHIFT + S = Apply a style
CTRL + SHIFT + T= Reduce a hanging indent
CTRL + SHIFT + V =Paste Formats
CTRL + SHIFT + W = Underline words but not spaces

[weegeordie] 28/8/2016 14:58

Debbie - Ctrl + F5 perhaps?

[stephen1946] 28/8/2016 14:09

Just to nail the oxus tale, the CEO at the end was a different ceo at the start of the misappropriation process, Shead was a huge shareholder as was Gibbons. Both have disappeared from the face of the earth. Shead was an obnoxious bully, gibbons perhaps was a pseudonym. The original Board of OXUS have never made a statement. It was a con-trick worthy of an AIM company.

[debbiegee] 28/8/2016 13:27

Thanks Stephen but that did not help.I have done the + /- in chrome settings but then everything else is too small to read.
I have also done system restore but has not helped.
Last time I phoned advfn and they just told me 2 buttons to press at the same time .Anybody else got any ideas please ?
Im all sorted thanks :-)))))))))))