Cabot Energy Share Discussion Threads

[hermod von asgard] 22/5/2005 21:55

Markdown / Befuddled

The conversation has started I will keep you informed.

I do not know how much money was paid for Anglo Abrasives, but it was not a lot.
I could not guess, but I shall try to find out.

It would help if there was a lawyer who also was a holder who could give an opinion about the actions of the directors pre administration.

I now know that the first approach was made the day before a board meeting in February and was ignored by the directors, there was a second approach made about 2 weeks later which was also ignored.

The directors failed to advise the administrators of the approaches, and although the administrators were telephoned during the process of the sale, they refused to consider the approach, or to receive the approach again, as they said they had issued a contract. In the end the shareholders did not get the best deal. The remaining German part of the plc also lost from the deal compared with the basis of the approach. So we lost out all round.

Hermod

[befuddled] 18/5/2005 17:34

Hermod,

How much money was involved, if you have this information then you must also have more information on the other remnants of the business, please share it with us it cannot effect the share price or the prospects of any return to shareholders!

[hermod von asgard] 17/5/2005 21:05

We wait to see - but in the meantime, the Anglo organisation in UK has been bought by a company called Abrasive Blades which is not connected to Carbo as I can see. Little money was involved, unfortunately no licence or contracts to support Schroeder were negotiated. I guess nothing left after paying for the accountants.

I think any other remains of Carbo in Uk are as nothing

Keep smiling - Hermod

[markdown] 17/5/2005 08:28

Hermod:
Now there is an offer you can't refuse from a senior manager in this (dis)organisation! Perhaps you can get the inside track on the whole fiasco.
Waiting with baited breath

[grant1] 16/5/2005 14:27

To: Hermod Van Asgard
Please Email me on [e-mail]

[hermod von asgard] 19/4/2005 21:38

Anglo Abrasives has been cherry picked from the wreckage of Carbo in UK and sold on last Friday - as yet I do not know the buyer. The real question for us as holders is why the directors ignored the approach to buy the complete Carbo package in UK, why did the directors ignor the offer to buy the the rights to the use of the Carbo name and brand, why did the directors ignor the proposed contract to continue to purchase the output of Schroeder etc in Germany. Did the directors ever understand their obligations as directors of a plc ? Can the directors be held to account for their inactions ? Look to further announcements to answer the question about self interest - but the shape of the remnants of the plc is very much as might be thought to fit with the directors present interests

[markdown] 12/4/2005 17:32

I would guess that Dusseldorf (which makes Dilumit and Schroder products albeit the Carbo and Schroder Coated is converted at the old Schroder factory), Dorfner and BMA may still be going concerns and be saleable entities. The man who sold BMA to Carbo has,I think, just quit the PLC Board so watch this space. Palu owned (probably still does) Nastroflex in Italy also a Coated convertor.
Hermod you seem close to the action to be aware of approaches made. Do you think there are some MORE self interests about to show?

[befuddled] 12/4/2005 15:00

what? just like the full content of the Attorney General's advice to Tony Blair about the legality of going to war with Iraq or a brief summary?

[oldinvestor] 12/4/2005 13:43

All will be revealed in due course!!

[befuddled] 09/4/2005 12:29

come on oldinvestor, may we have your insight to liven up what is rapidly becoming a wet and dismal day ?

[oldinvestor] 08/4/2005 21:27

There are things going on - !!!!!!

[chris nuttall] 08/4/2005 19:20

Could it be due to the fact that
these shares have been suspended???
chris

[25october1969] 06/4/2005 14:22

I can sell you some, how many do you want?

[patty4] 06/4/2005 14:13

I have just tried to buy some of these and was unable to trade, any ideas why

[hermod von asgard] 05/4/2005 22:13

2 parts of Carbo look to be attractive - Carbo in Uk - which was previously profitable and has now been reduced to a purely distributive role and if I read correctly currently in administration - I am guessing a cheap aquisition for 2 existing and 2 previos directors

Schroeder was always the target because of particular product and manufacturing capabilities. It fits and complements Ekamant and Knaxos. All of the directors -past and present - would be interested here if the value of Schroeder could be shown to be low.

BMA has an interest in both of these parts

Indescision and uncertainty will rapidly reduce the price of these 2 parts.

Olsson may reappear in several places being the lawyer, and chairman of ekamant. His firm hosts the registered offices of several companies holding shares in Carbo I think

Nyqvist is the only one I cannot place unless his departure was contrived in order to head up whatever emerges from the ashes.

I am told that the directors have ignored approaches in the last 2 months for parts of Carbo which would have secured some value for plc shareholders, I am not sure that they should have done so

This leaves DGS and DK for the plc

[befuddled] 05/4/2005 11:30

Interesting,don't forget the resignation of various people just over a month ago,how do they fit in?, I note you say "new owners" of a "business", could this be one of the current Carbo PLC subsidiaries?

[hermod von asgard] 04/4/2005 21:25

Look out for Palu, Moatti, Dootson, Roberts ( although your comment is probably ironic !!)

A number of years of lack of management ability, and strategic thinking have destroyed a potentially good business. Are these people still being paid?

My guess is that the directors have got what they wanted, even though they did not know how to achieve it, in the context of a plc and responsibilities to shareholders and at a cost to the shareholders.

I guess also that those that have resigned will reappear as the new owners of a business carefully constructed to fit with their other activities.

Although they will protest their independence, is it only a coincidence the E & Y are also the group accountants for the directors other businesses ?

I hope that E & Y will be looking at transfer pricing, loan notes etc on our behalf.

I hope that E&Y will be asking the directors if prior to the administration whether they had received any approaches which would have added shareholder value, and if they did, what action was taken, or whether they were ignored.

[befuddled] 29/3/2005 20:49

Are there any directors left on the board?

[befuddled] 25/3/2005 14:35

Last time around in 2002 it was Carborundum Abrasives GB Ltd who were put into administration, so when you say company do you mean Carbo PLC?, if so how is a PLC wound up?

[timely] 25/3/2005 10:46

I hate to say it but imho the wording of the RNS is the standard and often used way of saying that the next step is to wind up the co. because it has run out of cash and has no prospect of raising any more.

[befuddled] 25/3/2005 09:10

Go on then, spell out all the possibilities, can't do any damage now can it?,note that the first time the shares were suspended (25/1/2002) that it was then approximately a further six months before Carborundum Abrasives GB Ltd was put into administration, Carbo PLC shares were suspended under rule 17 the following day, is anything different this time around?

[hermod von asgard] 24/3/2005 20:06

Consider the possibilities - all the directors of Carbo are previous competitors apparently recently turned allies,

The directors are also suppliers to Carbo.

Carbo holds, although with difficulty around £50M turnover

The directors other abrasive businesses operate in similar markets and countries

[dmhzx] 24/3/2005 13:42

25Oct:
They said at results time they were extremely tight for cash and were looking at ways to raise more.

Surely ftom that point on it falls into the section marked 'bleedin obvious'.

A quick look at the ADVFN fundamentals shows them in Negative Equity.
As experience from Screen and others will show, it is much cheaper to raise money with a placing than it is to make a rights issue or an open offer.

As far as I'm concerned, there are only two likely routes

a) A massively discuounted placing with huge dilution,

b) Calling in the administrators. (At which point existing shareholders lose everything. The existing baord buy any decent parts of the business from the administrators they called in for next to nothing, and the administrators stay working at £400 an hour till any remaiing funds are exhausted.)


Either way, the last thing to do at this stage is to buy.


Actions today seem to point to choice b.

Apart fror which, placings are never announced until they've already been done (pending of course shareholder approval (sorry rubber stamping) at an EGM


I hope this answers the question.

[25october1969] 23/3/2005 10:55

dell - I have more or less taken a vow of silence but still feel entitled to ask what placing when someone makes a post which suggests there is to be a placing as there has been no RNS indicating that there will be a placing

[dell314] 23/3/2005 10:32

25Oct - I'm surprised that you haven't been drawn into the inner circle and taken a vow of silence.

Surely, further fundraising looks to be the most likely scenario??

Rgds
dell