Sunkar Share Discussion Threads

[augustusgloop] 23/8/2014 18:50

paulb,


Simple question.

if you hadn't been suspicious of me and had trusted my advice
how much money would you have saved yourself??

I started saying sell - at 39p

-----------------------

Just remember - given the last update - they could convert some of the loan and force you to sell.

They aren't doing that.

Do you think that they are resisting taking your shares at 1.8p - because they want to be nice?

[paulb10] 23/8/2014 18:32

I've always been suspicious of you elban but now your knickers are really starting to show. I personally am not selling, and I hold close to one million shares.

[gekks] 22/8/2014 22:59

Elban, Fk It, I'm not selling - having lost £120k on VGM , the £13k invested here is chicken feed - remaining £2k be interesting to see what happens

[augustusgloop] 22/8/2014 22:03

from when SAPC regained control in late 2011:


RED IS IN 23 Dec'11 - 14:30 - 32061 of 32424 0 0

Those involved in acquiring the license now have control of the company, as expected

From the admission doc;
On 31 Dec 2007, the Company issued 10,000,000 shares for cash at 0.1p [£10k in total] to Teratorn International Ltd. beneficially owned by the CFOs cousin Thomas Sinclair, and Sun Avenue Partners Corp. beneficially owned by Almas Mynbayev

Teratorn International held 13,500,000 shares (10.2%) worth £16.2m at IPO
Apr 30th 2009: sold down to 11,000,000
May 13th 2009: sold down to 9,650,000
Feb 10th 2010: sold below 3%

Sun Avenue Partners Corp. held 6,000,000 shares (4.6%) worth £7.2m at IPO
Mar 25th 2009: increased holding to 8,750,000 after acquiring 2,750,000 from Garen Development Group owned by Aydin Temirbayev, another one who picked up 0.1p shares
Mar 10th 2010: Holdings RNS disclosed Sun Avenue Partners had sold down to zero

Dec 2011: Sun Avenue Partners Corp. (Almas Mynbayev) acquires 51% controlling stake after providing loans of £1.787m and £6.383m convertible at 4.68p (-96.1% below IPO) with interest payable in cash at 10%



ELBAN 23 Dec'11 - 14:51 - 32062 of 32424 0 0

faza3

given the information provided by RED above--

do you still think that my speculation that they were running the business down so that their partners could pick it up on the cheap was far-fetched???

[augustusgloop] 22/8/2014 21:55

Your decision to sell is based on maybes.

Maybe they will treat you fairly OR maybe they will not.
Maybe they will keep you informed OR maybe they will not.
Maybe you will be able to sell in the future OR maybe you will not.

You have a few days to decide if you are going to sell or hold.

NONE of the above required information will be available to you in this time.


So your decision will be based on maybe.

You would like to base your decision on facts --- tough!

[paulb10] 22/8/2014 21:14

So i take it that no one went to the agm, disappointing . August please keep up with factual information updates please, and please do not post maybes. why are you so persistent in trying to get people to " SELL ".

[oilbethere] 22/8/2014 15:43

Any feedback from AGM???

Thnx

[augustusgloop] 22/8/2014 13:30

I see that all information for investors has now been removed from the website.

So, you may not even be able to find out if the AGM actually took place.

Zero information in the future will probably become the norm for any shareholders that choose not to sell.

[paulb10] 21/8/2014 19:43

did anybody go to the agm ?

[paulb10] 20/8/2014 18:51

trigger blade your shares were delisted from the aim on the 7th of august. You still own those shares in skr but at the moment you cannot sell them on the aim market.

[augustusgloop] 20/8/2014 14:45

Trigger,

yes.

I think that the alternative may be nothing at all.
And a long uncertain wait in the meantime.

Once they are a private company, there is no need for a website with information for shareholders.

Any information that they send out would probably not be in English.

The Kaz rules may or may not require them to send you annual reports - and if they do, they will not be in English.

Its a bad situation - the CABAL have made about £100 million - that means that other investors have lost a similar amount.

The simple question is: "would you trust SAPC to treat you fairly"?

[trigger blade] 20/8/2014 14:36

augustus,

I only have a small holding and if I accept the offer (which I didn't via my online TDA account), I'll drop about £1500.

Today, through the post, I've had the letter to say the offer expires on 5th September.

Until now, I've taken the view that I was so annoyed by what's happened, I'd be prepared to lose even the £800 I could get back to make life difficult for SAPC, but that's emotional, not rational.

When you say that you wouldn't stay invested in such a company, do I take that to mean that in my position, you'd accept the offer, because the alternative really might be nothing at all?

[augustusgloop] 20/8/2014 10:54

targatarga,

I did look over BAO about 3 years ago.

Thought that it was ok.
Didn't have enough to go on to judge the management.

I don't often like early stage developments - because of the need to frequently raise new money - funded be the big boys that get a better deal than you.

[targatarga] 20/8/2014 09:25

August - wouldn't suppose you ran your rule over the Mozambique disasters - nvta,bao and bhr. Can't help but feel tery're all similar to skr[eventually].

[augustusgloop] 19/8/2014 22:08

It looks like they could convert some of their loan to shares and easily go above 90% - making the sale of your shares compulsory.

Since they are not doing this - you must ask "why not"?

My view is that they will simply shaft those that continue to hold - picking up the final 10% for more or less nothing.

This will soon become an unlisted company registered in Kazakhstan.
That will mean no redress in uk courts and no uk regulation.

-------------------

Would I stay invested in such a company - even without the history here?

NOT A BLOODY CHANCE!

[the skipper] 19/8/2014 21:16

Regretfully I couldn't make it but note the penultimate paragraph of the small print beneath the RNS. It ain't over till the fat lady sings...

[hereford29] 19/8/2014 18:00

anyone go to the agm?

[danandrews] 19/8/2014 15:08

Correction closure date is 5 September 2014.

[one day soon1] 18/8/2014 17:53

Well Lloydd`s told me earlier today that my shares were being comp purchased because skr have de listed from AIM...... Unbelievable isn`t it. Does anyone actually know what is going on now?

[one day soon1] 15/8/2014 14:18

19 August 2014 at 11.00 a.m....Offer price is closed.

Is this from the AGM?

[bogeybazaar] 14/8/2014 22:10

paulb10

You may be right, but I don't think there's really any desperate shortage of fertiliser, feedstock or unmined phosphate rock in the world, so I doubt the world is holding its breath waiting to see what the company delivers. The company IPO'd on the crest of a price boom that's now bust. Their price/profit projections are probably now well out of date.

Even if they do eventually turn up trumps (and if I could remain a shareholder then of course I would just love that) I can't see any reason other than megalomaniac greed/spite for SAPC wanting to erase the small PIs 100% instead of simply tolerating them as minor interests thus at least letting them enjoy their small slice of the action if and when success should come.

[hereford29] 14/8/2014 22:04

Well they failed to get a technical director on board who could ensure a successful bfs - the chap that was wheeled out at one of the agms, forget his name, small bald fellow, was totally hopeless. He didn't speak Russian and while he may have known about phosphate, he had zero understanding of environmental impact assessments in Kazakhstan.

[paulb10] 14/8/2014 21:17

bogeybazaar,
thanks for that, your point that there are hints that the outlook for the product isn't so good. I would think this is possibly true, because the phosphate concentration is low, and there are few countries that use direct application rock ( KAZ being one of them). But I seem to remember that with benefaction the phosphate content can be brought up to acceptable levels with the equipment SKR now have on site even for DAR direct application rock use. I also understand that in the originally proposed chemical plant development program that this low grade bulk phosphate ore could used as a feed stock and be technically upgraded, and then converted, to products that are fully acceptable to the world standard fertiliser materials market converting them into such fetilzers as DAP diammonium phosphate, or Map mono ammonium phosphate, and that the detailed technical work in order to design a chemical plant to do job has job been paid for, and carried out by a reputable world class third party company and found to be completely feasible.

I think that (for whats its worth) that SAPC have lined up a company who are prepared to fund and build such a chemical plant that is required to convert the ore they have to DAP MAP.

The reason why they have continued to mine the ore(in my opinion) is to retain the ore mining licence with the kaz government, order to give them time to use shareholders money prove the concept, get rid of the pi shareholders that originally funded the effort, and then make a deal with a third party that has the financial mussel, operationally and commercial capability to push it through to completion

[bogeybazaar] 14/8/2014 20:03

This link gives you unaudited half year balance sheet and P & L in Russian:

hxxp://www.kase.kz/news/show/1226857

There's nothing on the Kaz exchange either to say the offer itself has closed or that compulsory buyout is afoot.

I've now read through the Company report and there are various hints in the text signalling awareness that the outlook for the product isn't so good eg admitting once-touted potential customers are developing their own supplies, and that regional economies may be faltering too.

I'm still puzzled why the Company is so keen to fulfil the SUC merely to continue stockpiling something neither the local nor international markets want to buy. They say they dug up 90% ie 270k tons of their 300k requirement during last Oct & Nov alone and only an early Winter put the lid on the remaining 30k. Fantastic, but why bother? Why would a company so desperately want to retain the rights to a contract whose fulfilment has almost brought the company to its knees?

Could it be that they're still stupid addle-brained communists at heart or are they hoping for a huge spike in the price of this stuff so they take the money and run?

[hereford29] 14/8/2014 19:26

Has it gone to compulsory purchase now?