Subsea Resources Share Discussion Threads

[norm4n] 23/4/2007 11:32

Someones had a punt with their pocket-money!

[spinvest] 04/4/2007 16:27

Interesting couple of trades today at about 3:30.

250k sold @ 7p as an ordinary trade at 15:32.

250k sold @ 7p as a broker to broker trade at 15:35.

Anyone any clues? Is it the same block of shares 9 normally if it is a rollover of a position there is a small difference in the price?

[lunanbay] 30/3/2007 08:11

Hmmm... I'll get me bowler hat.

[spinvest] 30/3/2007 07:27

Gengulphus,

The probability is that the order, whether it was a sell or a buy, went in to the broker first thing in the morning before the action really started, at 08:01 a 25k sell or buy could have justified a "T" trade, two hours later and it would not.

[gengulphus] 30/3/2007 01:29

Problem I've now got is: Why did a sizeable block of shares trade for such a low price on a day that saw a 60% move up? I mean, who were those people that got diddled out of their shares for just 5.25? I'd have thought someone could have held out for a bit more...

With a T trade, you have no idea when during the day most of the shares were traded. It's even conceivable for example that it was a buy order for 25000 shares at a limit price for the overall order of 5.25p per share, and that the person whose order it was is celebrating an excellent purchase! How that could happen: it mostly gets filled during the first half our or so of the day, when the offer price was 5.25p, getting say 24500 shares at a nicely within-the-spread price of 5.1875p. Then the price shoots up and the last 500 shares end up being left until late in the day, when the whole thing gets tidied up by buying the last 500 shares at 8.3125p. Overall cost = 24500*5.1875p + 500*8.3125p = £1312.50, which is 5.25p per share.

And by the way, at that value it isn't a sizeable block. Nearly half of the day's trades look to have been bigger, and the oddest thing about it to my mind is that someone bothered to use a T trade for such a small amount!

Gengulphus

[lunanbay] 29/3/2007 20:30

spin & gulph -
much obliged.

Problem I've now got is: Why did a sizeable block of shares trade for such a low price on a day that saw a 60% move up? I mean, who were those people that got diddled out of their shares for just 5.25? I'd have thought someone could have held out for a bit more...

Found the LSE Rules:

No mention of pony carts.

On a different tack:
Anyone looking at this from an Elliott perspective?

[gengulphus] 29/3/2007 19:18

lunanbay,

Small trades have to be reported very quickly - within 3 minutes of the trade if I remember correctly. Bigger trades get more reporting leeway - the simplest example is that reporting a trade of 6xNMS or more can be delayed up to 2 hours. The biggest trades often have special arrangements to allow the trade to be "worked" over time and only reported when everything is done - T trades are one example, where a big trade is broken up into a series of smaller trades and then reported at the end.

I.e. basically, the more important the information, the more out-of-date it is! It's why trade-watching is generally not a very useful thing to do - and why, if you do trade-watch, you really need quite a lot of skill at guessing what's really going on behind the reported trades...

Gengulphus

[gilston] 29/3/2007 15:53

FT.today reports that s.p.jumped......"amid speculation that the shipwreck explorer was close to completing a refinancing as part of a strategic review that is due to be announced before the end of April."

[spinvest] 29/3/2007 15:35

Lunanbay,

Definition of a "T" trade:

'T' If reporting a single protected transaction. A protected transaction occurs when a large order is going through the market. The buyer (or seller) may wish to keep the order anonymous from the rest of the market as the size of the order could greatly alter the price of the stock. With a protected transaction, the dealer will put the trade through in small quantities rather than knock the whole order out in one hit. The entire transaction is reported once the deal is completed. The LSE is notified at the start and at the end of the transaction. However, the market as a whole isn't told until the end, thus the order is protected.

I hope this helps.

[lunanbay] 29/3/2007 15:29

spin -
ok so two things then?:
T trade, which was reported late.
The fact that it was a T trade isn't really relevant.
The fact that it was recorded late meant that some software picked it up as coming in at the close: smarter software might have filtered it for time of transaction rather than time reported?
As a separate issue:
Do you happen to know the rules on trade-reporting?
e.g. as long as it's reported by xx:00 hours it's ok.
Seems a funny system the LSE uses: I always imagine some bowler-hatted gent setting out in a pony cart from a broker's office in the back of beyond and just missing the last train to London... "Damn, missed it again! I suppose I'll have to stump up sixpence for a telegram now!"

[spinvest] 29/3/2007 12:55

lunabay,

At the time of the actual transaction the price was within the, then, current spread, it is just that the transaction was reported late as a "T" trade.

[lunanbay] 29/3/2007 10:58

Curlietailz - thanks for the info.
How does this T trade work then?
I mean, how come you can get a price so far out of whack with the "market"?
L.

[andrbea] 29/3/2007 07:37

well, the company didn't issue an RNS to say 'they know of no reason' for 60% increase in SP

maybe it's because they do know of a reason. :-)
LOL

Will have to wait for an update from the mgt I suppose.

strange too that none of the share sites/newspapers mentioned the share.

[curlietailz] 28/3/2007 19:41

lunabay
The last trade was reported at 5.25p a T trade
16:37 5.25p 25,000 £1,312 Sell T

[lunanbay] 28/3/2007 19:12

Thanks. Care to guess where it will be this time tomorrow?

[sirmoori] 28/3/2007 18:26

It finished on 8

[lunanbay] 28/3/2007 18:09

Where did SUB finish? 8 or 5.25? LSE is giving 5.25,as is ADVFN. FT.com is giving 8. 5.25 does make the chart look weird and wonderful. Never mind the first hour, it's the first minute I'll be looking at!

[dhb368] 28/3/2007 17:13

Definitely a few shorters burnt, although I do not understand why anyone would be short at those levels, surely the risk is too great. You can see them squeeling in posts earlier today.

I doubt its any real news, just a few of the many waiting for the right time to get in have jumped on board. This stock is quite tightly held and any buying/selling has an exagerated effect.

[spinvest] 28/3/2007 15:58

Well, I have to say I am pleasantly surprised that we hung on to most of the rise at close.

The first hour of trading tomorrow will bear close scrutiny!

[andrbea] 28/3/2007 14:51

Other risers SubSea Resources 8.25 up 3.25

[robertjt] 28/3/2007 14:13

buys are coming back in now after the small drop

[andrbea] 28/3/2007 13:46

first (filled, protected) 'T' trade

14:43 8.125 250,890 T

only now do we get a real idea of what's been driving the price
could be some more 'T' trades after 16.30h

[edmondj] 28/3/2007 13:34

robertjt,

Yes I was somewhat convinced to invest (sorry, gamble) on SUB, end-04, on a whole raft of supposed intelligent institutions (including RAB) buying in at 20p.

Thankfully I got out in the mid thirties, when the disinformation between website/RNS and the Spanish press became clear.

Some institutions are into gambling just like anyone.

[pugugly] 28/3/2007 13:25

Subject to pricing less that £ 100K's worth bought - No news - Ramp? or shorter being burnt?

Also a number of other abnormal movemetns such as Oxford Catalysts - I suspect MM's may be keeping their books very short on smaller companies and any volume either way produces abnormal and exagerated share price movments

Views?

[smiler 0] 28/3/2007 12:58

SubSea Resources PLC
28 March 2007


SubSea Resources plc.
(AIM: SUB)
28 March 2007


DISCLOSURE OF INTERESTS IN SHARES

SubSea Resources plc ('the Company') announces that it received notification on
23 March 2007 that Fidelity International Limited is indirectly interested in
857,375 Ordinary Shares of 5p each in the capital of the Company representing
0.41 per. cent. of the Company's issued share capital. The notification states
that Fidelity International Limited acts as nominee for Brown Bros Harriman Ltd
Lux.

SubSea Resources plc ('the Company') announces that it received notification on
20 March 2007 that RAB Special Situations (Master) Fund Limited is indirectly
interested in 29,090,000 Ordinary Shares of 5p each in the capital of the
Company representing 13.84 per. cent. of the Company's issued share capital.
The notification states that RAB Capital Plc acts as investment manager for RAB
Special Situations (Master) Fund Limited. RAB Capital Plc does not act as
custodian for its clients and therefore the shares are held in the name of the
custodian of its clients, which is Credit Suisse Client Nominees (UK) Limited.