U And I Share Discussion Threads

[asmodeus] 21/4/2017 07:38

Thank you for your first paragraph, masuren, confirming my pont. - And, of course, the second paragraph is irrefutable.

[kazoom] 20/4/2017 18:20

One also has to wonder given such a sharp one day move whether someone has an inkling as to what might be in the results. Ohh hush my mouth!!

Fairly small time if this is the case, but you never know.

[skyship] 20/4/2017 16:45

Went to 183.5p bid, dropped back to offered at 180p, then finished up again at 183p bid. A great day as the share price breaks the downtrend. If it can hold above 180p then it would seem secure for further good rises with the Finals due next Wednesday (26th):


free stock charts from uk.advfn.com

[masurenguy] 20/4/2017 16:03

In some cases institutions are buying on the instruction of clients or automatically for tracker funds and in other cases they are buying themselves for discretionary managed funds. You will never know what that mix is so it is pointless consideration in an investment context. Nevertheless it is interesting to see the extent of institutional investment in any small stock - circa 78% declared where UAI is concerned - since there are many other small caps where there are minimal or zero institutional holders.

My post detailing the current institutional investors is both interesting and also a valid piece of investment research which of course you are completely at liberty to disregard.

[asmodeus] 20/4/2017 15:08

Just a small point, Masuren - I used to be influenced at what appeared to be Institutional buying, but it was explained to me that it is not necessarily they themselves putting there own money where their convictions are, but often just their clients.

[masurenguy] 20/4/2017 14:05

Interesting portfolio of current institutional shareholders in UAI

Miton Asset Management Ltd. 612.50k. 5.57%
Hargreave Hale Ltd. 545.00k. 4.96%
Unicorn Asset Management Ltd. 415.00k. 3.77%
Chelverton Asset Management Ltd. 250.00k. 2.27%
Hargreaves Lansdown Stockbrokers Ltd. 152.00k. 1.38%
Jarvis Investment Management Ltd. 115.00k. 1.05%
Barclays Bank Plc (Private Banking). 100.00k. 0.91%
TD Direct Investing (Europe) Ltd. 57.00k. 0.52%
Hargreaves Lansdown Asset Management Ltd. 55.00k. 0.50%
Athelney Trust Plc (Investment Management). 24.50k. 0.22%

[skyship] 20/4/2017 13:29

free stock charts from uk.advfn.com

[skyship] 20/4/2017 13:26

181p BID - a pretty impressive performance here today!

[kazoom] 20/4/2017 08:32

I think that only covers some of the properties though?

Weren't those already "in service" at mark to market values already?

[sharpshare] 20/4/2017 08:22

From the accounts last year:

"Following discussions with stakeholders, the Group will, in future years report an EPRA NAV which includes an external valuation of the properties held at cost on our Balance Sheet. This will bring the Group into line with the majority of its peer group. The first reporting period prepared in this way will be the financial year ending 28th February 2017."

Results out on 26 April 2017

Looks like newly revalued development properties may boost the NAV?

[kazoom] 17/4/2017 20:36

No other compators in mind - I don't ordinarily look at property companies, but I thought I'd read somewhere in the dim and distant past to expect to see significant discounts to asset values. Which would make some sense to me especially for commercial property where the value is strongly linked to the existence or potential for paying tenants.

Anyway, happy to accept if this valuation is actually unusual.

As to the roller-coaster yes I noticed that- it would have been a good trade to buy at 170 in 2013 and sell for 290 in 2015 and then be considering buying again, but IC refering to this as their "long standing tip" made be chortle!

[skyship] 17/4/2017 17:59

Hm - the Market so often gets it wrong as institutions change tack and sell down a holding regardless of value - hence SREI when Lloyds sold it down to a crazy 40% discount - when tap exhausted the stock rallied 25% in 6weeks. Also CIC which were sold down to a similar 40% discount before rising 100% the next year. Take a look at the charts for the timing.

My experience is that the 40% discount threshold is very often a turning point.

[my retirement fund] 17/4/2017 12:43

In my experience most property companies with abnormal nav discounts turn out to have been a case where the original investments ie. Land or buildings, were simply overvalued to begin with. So inevitably what happens is that the share price with respect to nav gradually opens up and that GAP simply gets wider and wider until crunch day comes round and the asset has to be sold, the accounts can no longer hide the deciept and the equity owners get the nasty shafting theve been so long fearing.The usual culprit behind this kind of thing is what I term soft fraud.Examples are where the valuation consultants are given a bung to state the properties are worth say X then loans are raised to an agreed covenant level Y with lenders often in on the scam and equity raised to say Z so that Y+Z=X. However when X is shown for what it really is worth Z becomes worth a lot less.Generally the winners from the soft scam are the original property owners who sold it to the trustees as well as those who got the bungs, not to mention the management and board members who get to cream off loads of fees, expenses and salaries.I'm not saying any of this kind of stuff has occurred here but you need to ask yourself if it may have.I have seen this kind of stuff time and time again over the years myself.

[skyship] 17/4/2017 08:23

kazoom - maybe MRF can; but I'm not aware of any.

Can you suggest any other as I'm sure many of us would like to take a look at them!

Incidentally, re the slow burner comment, UAI were up at 290p in Jun'15 - see chart in the Header. More of a rapid roller-coaster!

[hugepants] 16/4/2017 23:34

kazoom16 Apr '17 - 19:04 - 789 of 790 0 0
But isn't that "whopping" discount to NAV that IC refer to fairly typical for this type of company?

I don't think so. Unless anyone can provide some examples?

[kazoom] 16/4/2017 19:04

But isn't that "whopping" discount to NAV that IC refer to fairly typical for this type of company?

(A bit of a "slow burner" this if IC tipped it at 170p 4 years ago!)

[skyship] 14/4/2017 07:41

MRT - UAI's earnings are "lumpy" due to the uncertain completions of large developments. Some earnings f/c to fall this year have been pushed back into next year. This IC Summary of Oct'16 elucidates the f/c stats:

"U+I expects to pay further special dividends (8p in 2015 and 2016) equivalent to 40-50 per cent of free cash flow. This implies a yield over the next three years of 5 per cent, 11 per cent and 10 per cent, on Liberum's figures. But, despite this, the shares trade on a whopping 43 per cent discount to Liberum's adjusted NAV forecast of 280p at February 2017. We're sticking with our long-standing tip (170p, 22 May 2013). Buy."

Peel Hunt f/c 8.9p total dividend (Yld 5.2%) and the same 280p NAV as at 28/02/17.

[mrthomas] 13/4/2017 22:03

thanks the special dividend is a lot lower than the last two years of 8p was assuming that was going to be paid out in May if its what you say then will stay on the side lines for now

[skyship] 13/4/2017 16:03

Coiled spring and a rising trendline - hoping for that elusive breakout toward 200p:


free stock charts from uk.advfn.com

[hugepants] 13/4/2017 14:28

Mr Thomas,
I think the brokers are forecasting a yield of around 5% this year. They've already paid a maintained interim divi of 2.4p. Therefore I think they'll pay a maintained final year divi of 3.5p and a special dividend of 2p-2.5p.

The results are out in less than 2 weeks and there could be an upward NAV revaluation due to way they calculate the NAV (see previous posts).

[mrthomas] 12/4/2017 20:59

thinking of buying a question do you think there be a special dividend in May of 8p like last year and when will shareholders be informed thks

[jimblack513] 07/4/2017 10:56

There's been a mini bull run in property company share prices this week but U & I has not joined the party.

[mad foetus] 03/4/2017 16:45

Interesting afternoon, is it the reversal we've been hoping for? Probably not!

[mad foetus] 21/3/2017 11:41

Big sale gone through. Is this the bottom or an omen. Time will tell