Time Finance Share Discussion Threads

[paul augustus] 30/7/2009 08:16

As 59d said, the bid price hasn't moved, so my guess is the MM's taking advantage of a couple of sales hoping there might be a few more? Though why anyone would sell at that price (unless they bought @0.5p) is beyond me.

[59david] 30/7/2009 07:05

Understand what you say however important to remember that auditors will not sign off on a going concern basis if the company cannot demonstrate that iot has sufficient funds to continue trading for a year so forecasts on which they have made their assumpitons about cash flow cannot be too optimisitic

[gogoneko] 30/7/2009 00:13

59david,

I'd wondered whether there'd be some support appearing to prevent it falling through the 1.5p mark which the recent placing took place at but I guess not.

With interims due in about 6/7 weeks and no indication at all on current trading the falls could accelerate through bitty selling unless the company makes a reassuring noise (e.g. first bulk NHS supply chain order received, even the wristbands) in the between time. Even though it was interesting to read what you reported from the AGM the majority of investors (who don't read ADVFN and rely solely on RNSs) I would expect have no expectations of positive cashflow any time soon unless a miracle happens. If the management really do believe they can achieve positive cashflow before the money's due to run out there's going to have to be some pretty spectacular news flow between now and the year end!

[59david] 29/7/2009 20:15

Not obvious why sale of just under 100,000 shares at 1.4p would push bid price down so much although fact that spread has increased gives me some comfort that its just a blip. If offer was to fall tomorrow would be very tempted to find some funds and average down as no indication at all at AGM that anything amiss

[barney28] 26/7/2009 12:44

how about, parking meter dispensers on car parks and in city centres? Display in car window.. pre-pay parking? The possibilities are endless...

[boldtrader] 25/7/2009 09:14

Thanks David. what would be a great outcome is that the NHS stipulated a timestrip attached/built into every cannulae,which maybe a feasible situation,then TIME would really be motoring.
This in itself would create acknowledgement of the products TIME have and in turn create larger volumes from customers in different fields that they are already selling to.ie. food, cosmetics, hygeine(toothbrushes,I wonder how that trial is progressing)white goods and fishtanks to name but afew.
The options for this product are endless when you think about it for a second or two! Yep I'm holding and may add afew more (already averaged down from the early days!)if and when funds permit. Thanks again and cheers to all holders.

[59david] 25/7/2009 07:08

Boldtrader,for what its worth my impression (they were as I said appropriately careful with their words) is that the newer products are not low margin at all. Challenge is just getting volumes up. In fact, even with some of the earlier contracts where they have sold to big names such as Nestle the issue is achieving volume. If you look at accounts you will see that gross profit margin for last year is up at 64% (as compared to 36% IN 2007).

On subject of margins, also clear that they have plenty of spare manufacturing capacity at current levels of revenue hence margins should improve for some time as revenues increase.

What was also interesting was the question of competition. Apparently they are finding it much easier to sell products where there are alternatives. For example, there are exepnsive electronic devices which monitor increases in temperature. The advantage they say is that in these cases there is already a market, all they need to demonstrate is how good and cheap their product is. When looking at new markets they first have to convince someone that they need any sort of product at all.

[paul augustus] 24/7/2009 22:38

Echo those sentiments, really appreciate the feedback from today David, thank you.

[boldtrader] 24/7/2009 22:34

David, Many thanks for your thoughts on the AGM. i live many miles from the Capital so could not attend. Like you I have held TIME for 4 or 5 years now and believe in the future of the product. I think the major problem is always going to be the small profit margins.I feel assured that you atteding today and posting an upbeatish appraisal we are on the right track,a slow one, but never the less!! Thanks again and cheers.

[59david] 24/7/2009 22:00

Attended AGM today. In discussions afterwards a few interesting points were made which I though were worth sharing although clearly they were being very careful in terms of what they were saying.

In no particular order:

1. If they meet their current forecasts they will not need to raise any more cash unless they identify something new to invest in - ie meeting forecasts will result in positive cash flows before the money runs out

2. Current forecasts do not include anything from iStrip so not too critical to business if they lose out in US on current patent action

3. Size of market for the medical products is huge. Even just focussing on UK the NHS use approx 50 million cannulae a year (I think they said) and whilst they couldn't disclose what price they currently sell the product for they did indicate a range which I think started at 25p. Hence even it they only got 20% of the UK market for this at say, 25p/unit this would still add £2.5 million to top line.

4. Sensibly they are focusing their energies on higher margin sales (such as the medical ones) rather than on some of the areas where they started where there is nothing wrong woth product but sales prices for items they are trying to attach product to are very depressed in current economic climate

Personally I came away from meeting feeling very positive and, as and when I have surplus cash if price is still anywhere near current level I will be topping up again

[59david] 23/7/2009 20:06

Anyone planning on going to the AGM?

[gogoneko] 22/7/2009 08:21

greengiant,

Always interesting to see people put some numbers forward.

At the moment I think that it's safe to assume that the company will once again be handing the cap out eventually and there'll be more dilution as I doubt that they can ramp up sales sufficient to conserve their remaining funds - unless they also do sign deals quickly for non-UK markets of the new product (TimestripIV on cannulae). This time however I do see the possibility that now they have a distribution agreement into the NHS with this new product that has been requested and so far well-received, they've got an opportunity to grow revenues year-on-year and hence presents them with a much stronger case for further financial support. Previously this management had produced one failure after another (as evidenced by the revenues) and kept returning to the market to fund them, but hopefully this new product will be different so I think it's worth a small punt. I'm very much hoping that we'll get the first indications of sales of the new product in a current trading update in September.

Of course, if the new product isn't seen to be selling before the year-end I'll probably be joining the swollen ranks of TIME investors who have lost money.

[greengiant] 22/7/2009 03:29

Now never been a holder of these and to be honest have never thought they were much good (laying my cards on the table). But I do keep popping in to see how they are doing and to determine whether they would ever rate as a buy for me. My experience is printing in the main in the Food Industry. Now I have looked at the numbers and here are my findings....

........June 08.Dec 08..Total

Turnover268,000 405,485 673,485
COS.....128,000 113,346 241,346
GP......140,000 292,139 432,139
GP %....52.24% 72.05% 64.16%
Admin...843,000 907,619 1,750,619
OP.....(703,000)(615,480)(1,318,480)
OP % -262%...-151%....-195.77%

So the improvement between H1 and H2 was impressive, more impressive was the improvement in GP%. However, offset against this was the slight increase in Admin costs. So slight reduction in Operating loss.

Cash flow was slightly better in 2008 than in 2007. Total Cash Burn for the year was £1.597m versus £1.862m the previous year. With £1.86m post fund raisings the company has just over 1 years cash (and we are 6 months in). Now, that assumes the company is going to flatline at the current levels. So projecting forward let us take 3 scenario's

Scenario 1......Scenario 2......Scenario 3
Turnover 1,000,000......1,500,000.......2,550,000
COS.....(250,000).......(375,000).......(637,500)
GP......750,000.........1,125,000.......1,912,500
GP %....75.00%..........75.00%..........75.00%
Admin...1,838,150.......1,881,915.......1,906,000
OP......(1,088,150).....(756,915).......6,500
OP %....-108.81%........-50.46%.........0.25%

Now I have assumed GM @ 75% and slight increases in Admin costs as the company scales up. The key here is where you believe the numbers will end up. Personally I believe you will be somewhere between Scenario 1 and 2. This will result in a cash outflow of about £1,2m. So in my very humble opinion, I think it will be touch and go as to whether another fundraising is needed.

Still to rich for me, I would prefer to see a run rate toward the top end of Scenario 2. But as usual good luck to all those who have the faith.

gg

[gogoneko] 21/7/2009 21:17

Didn't notice anyone else had posted but some may find it interesting as it's got a small bit about TIME:

[sagem] 16/7/2009 09:32

NOT BAD AT ALL....

Timestrip plc, the Hitchin-based smart label producer, reported a 280 per cent increase in its revenues for 2008, but was unable to specify when it expected to move into profitability.

Reporting its results for the year ended 31 December 2008, the company said it made good progress as 2008 advanced, particularly in the second half when revenue was four times greater than H2 2007.

Revenues reached £673k (2007: £177k) and pretax loss was lowered by £400k to £1.3m (2007 loss: £1.7m) as the company achieved consistent increases in its average selling prices and gross profitability, coupled with a reduction in overheads, despite the detrimental impact of sterling's weakness on its overseas manufacturing cost base.

The results represent strong progress for the firm which in the first half of 2008 sought a £1.16m shares subscription to generate enough cash flow to keep the business running.

Since the year end, Timestrip has strengthened its cash resources with two further share placings, raising £1m and taking its cash position to £812k (2007: £834k).

"There remains a clear focus on reaching the key milestone of profitability as quickly as possible," said Timestrip chairman, Stephen Oakes. "Accordingly we are concentrating our resources on the products and markets that are capable of yielding profitable orders in the shortest possible timeframe.

"With a stronger balance sheet and a greater range of products we look forward to continued progress during 2009." Timestrip's share price rose 5 per cent, up 0.08p to 1.58p a share.

[c91nfy] 16/7/2009 08:11

and the award for most pompous and self-important pr*ck on this board goes to.....

[gogoneko] 15/7/2009 15:15

As I'd hinted at the beginning of the month regarding obtaining a suitable deal for Timestrip on the cannulae I've actually taken a small punt on the Vygon deal being good enough to raise enough revenue for them to reduce operating losses in H2 and beyond to enable them to survive beyond my previously anticipated 12-month timescale before needing another fundraising - so I'd expect that to provide some support to the share price. I'm not talking profitability, but if the concept catches on and they can work an extension to the deal to include supplying non-UK operations then that would be a possibility.

That's still not to say that I'll suddenly change my tune about some awful H1 numbers appearing which may hit the share price, nor that I have any real trust or confidence in the management to deliver, I'm just gambling that they'd have to be amongst the worst management ever not to turn this into a reliable revenue stream.

[sharethelovearound] 15/7/2009 14:29

i'm not sure that a few thousand pounds of sells is a crisis of confidence. Not that you'll be selling as you never bought any in the first place.

[gogoneko] 14/7/2009 17:30

Uh! Oh! Someone's having a crisis of confidence judging by today's sells.

With the AGM due at the end of next week I'd hope for some indication of trading considering they haven't given any quantifiable indication for H1 - but it'll probably be unpleasant. It'll be too early for the Vygon deal to have generated any revenues (but perhaps a dollop of jam may appear) but they may be able to give indications for how the Brenmoor partnership is working out. By the time H1 numbers are formally revealed in a couple of months it'll have given time for both the Brenmoor and Vygon agreements to have generated some revenues - so it'll be interesting to see how things develop during the next couple of months.

[boldtrader] 07/7/2009 10:15

You sometimes think new inventions will only lead to pie in the sky,as many do, but can you imagine the simplicity yet usefulness of the timestripIV.Now in partnership with Vygon the benefits to hospitals around the world(USA etc) could be immense. This could be Huge!! Heres hoping, good luck to all holders

[sharethelovearound] 07/7/2009 10:10

you misunderestimate the diversity of opinion within the nursing community if you think that any one of the applications for TimestripIV is now ready for the back burner. The beauty of this technology is in the way the company can deliver it - it is so flexible that it can be put on a wristband, on a cauula, on the patients forehead if they are comatose - which means that there are very few buying objections that cannot be overcome. I would share your thought that this is probably THE deal to get them into the NHS and the RNS specifically talks about Vygon agreeing to be a reseller to other manufacturers.

[gogoneko] 07/7/2009 00:08

wisteria2,

A natural progression would be to gain access to markets outside the UK. As boldtrader pointed out; Vygon (UK) is part of Vygon family of companies ( ) which covers 16 countries, including the US. Building on what I alluded to earlier: If Vygon are prepared to commit significant resources (as today's RNS says) to TimestripIV then I believe the concept has the potential to take off a lot quicker than any efforts which could have been achieved by TIME alone. I don't know the way NHS supply chain stuff works, but I would question whether it would be appropriate for TIME to sign further agreements with other companies on the NHS supply chain for similar products. Perhaps instead another avenue would be via those supplying directly to trusts, rather than via the NHS supply chain? Maybe someone NHS-aware could provide insight.

I really think that the Brenmoor partnership will be placed on the back burner now and perhaps forgotten about - who needs a TimestripIV on a wristband when there's one on the cannulae?

[still waiting] 06/7/2009 23:30

exactly.

they wouldn't set this up if sales were to be minimal or product disregarded.

[wisteria2] 06/7/2009 20:32

Re news to agreement with distribution company.Just a guess, but seems to me a prelude before more significant news in regards to nhs.implementing distribution for all the uk!.

[still waiting] 06/7/2009 11:32

plenty of strings to its bow now.

I like co's that have motivated partners/ resellers, PPR have done a few like this and they seem to be making progress as well.