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[fangorn2] 22/10/2018 14:50

marksp201122 Oct '18 - 10:49 - 21034 of 21038
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Fangorn

Are you suggesting that the rise of the hard right will be a saviour for Europe and prevent war?

What's "Hard right" got to do with it? Simply needs people that want and respect democracy,to govern themselves and live by the laws they make rather than have such foisted upon them.

Such people come from both Left(See Italy), and Right(Germany/Sweden)

Hard Right is nowhere.

Hard Left however is everywhere and a short step from No10!

[fangorn2] 22/10/2018 14:48

@Steeplejack

.One of the reasons I voted remain (whilst being aware of the very real legal and constitutional issues)was because a leave vote would expose us to an extended period of debate by politicians and civil servants who hadn't a clue how to negotiate a trade deal after 45 years in the warm embrace of the European trade pact.This is a UK parliament afterall, who have failed over decades to agree upon the siting of a third runway!Do you really think that this parliament,whether shaded red or blue has the competence to sort out a deal with 27 EU member states.Of course they haven't.

About time they learned then. Not being up to such is no excuse to cede sovereignty and continued control to a foreign power.

Like yourself I was fully aware of the legal/constitutional issues and this was also why I voted LEAVE as Freedom & Independence are worth far more to me having lived up an authoritarian and repressive regime growing up and then working overseas in later life, in a different repressive nation - I hate being governed by people I cannot boot out. I hate being lied to that we joined a trading market only(despite Heath knowing full well it'd lead to UK losing much of its sovereignty)

I also don't want to be a bit part of a federal United States of Europe which is the ultimate aim of these EU bureaucrats, regardless of any opt outs nations have. One by one they'll be taken away until it is too late.

If this crop of parliamentarians aren't up to it perhaps they should consider their positions - especially those who wont honour the Brexit vote or the general Election(2017) manifestos they ran and were elected on imo

[tradejunkie2] 22/10/2018 14:48

50p wiped out in 6 months.

I predict this will be under 100p as the recession starts sometime 2019, interest rates rise, consumer credit credit tightens and Brexit becomes a resistance to the economy.

Bulls in for a bumpy ride.

[omg48] 22/10/2018 14:06

Steeplejack
You give the impression of being very knowledgeable about the “very real legal and constitutional issues”. Perhaps you could enlighten us?

[steeplejack] 22/10/2018 12:18

Putin must of been as happy as larry when the UK voted leave.


As far as exports are concerned,the USA is the most important export market for both Germany and UK.
On Germany's list,the UK is third narrowly beating the Netherlands,a long way behind France.On the UK list,Germany is second.In fact,the engineering industries of the UK and Germany have long had an enviably close trading relationship with the UK producing nuts and bolts for this and Germany screws for that.Yet,at the risk of over simplification,the UK is likely to be much worse impacted by a "no deal" in the short term than Germany.These very basic observations were never really made clear during the Brexit campaign.Immediately after the vote to leave,leave voters were polled asking a simple question,"Would you have voted out if that decision adversely affected your standard of living?"The poll results showed that a sizeable majority wouldn't have voted leave if it resulted in them being worse off

One of the reasons I voted remain (whilst being aware of the very real legal and constitutional issues)was because a leave vote would expose us to an extended period of debate by politicians and civil servants who hadn't a clue how to negotiate a trade deal after 45 years in the warm embrace of the European trade pact.This is a UK parliament afterall, who have failed over decades to agree upon the siting of a third runway!Do you really think that this parliament,whether shaded red or blue has the competence to sort out a deal with 27 EU member states.Of course they haven't.

[disneydonald] 22/10/2018 10:53

Fan. EU pursuing those ideals is one thing, delivering them is another. The EU old guard are set to move on, and would suggest that apart from Macron the new guard will be much more pragmatic and the grand strategies will be put on the back burner. For example, without the UK, who will be the core of an EU Army. Most eastern states will stick with NATO. Either way, only time will tell.

[marksp2011] 22/10/2018 10:49

Fangorn

Are you suggesting that the rise of the hard right will be a saviour for Europe and prevent war?

[jugears] 22/10/2018 10:05

WFL1970- Not something I get involved in once the order has bee placed for our products I rarely see the finished Item on site.

[fangorn2] 22/10/2018 10:03

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EU won’t be able to continue along with its grand strategy, as too many of the member states have been spooked by the lack of control re borders.

Why is the continued march to a United States of Europe still being pursued then?

Have a look at the Eu Defence structures(aka EU Army) that have come together and that Chequers has sucked British Army ffully into - that means EU can deploy British troops without our say so FYI!

The Balkan’s won’t allow any cross fertilisation of religion, and the generosity of the Northern Europeans is now ending.

Matters little to the bureaucrats who will push continued federalism right up to the last minute. As we have seen when votes go against them they keep pursuing the same goal via other means

Add that to the general strengthening of the right, and the EU will struggle.

This last pat is the only salvation for European people.

The EU must be destroyed else it will bring war to the European continent

[disneydonald] 22/10/2018 09:49

EU won’t be able to continue along with its grand strategy, as too many of the member states have been spooked by the lack of control re borders. The Balkan’s won’t allow any cross fertilisation of religion, and the generosity of the Northern Europeans is now ending. Add that to the general strengthening of the right, and the EU will struggle.

[wfl1970] 22/10/2018 09:47

Talking of German goods...
Does anyone know if TW houses have German marque goods installed?


Jug, you're probably the best person on here to answer that with your contacts.

[fangorn2] 22/10/2018 09:38

@Disneydonald

Better to stay in as a major player, and help orchestrate change for thx better.

Anyone who thinks we should stay in just to reform it from within is deluded.
What do you think UK has been trying to do for last 30+ years to no avail - heck the EU wouldn't even reform when we threatened to leave!!! nor have they now that we have voted to LEAVE!!

The EU project is on a slow grind to full federal union - a United States of Europe. Reform is verboten.This is a long term project that Political elites wont allow to be derailed.

[omg48] 22/10/2018 09:19

2016 figures for German car imports 18 billion euro
German machinery 6.8 billion euro

[omg48] 22/10/2018 08:46

Steeplejack

It’s not just BMW
Mercedes
Audi
Volkswagen
Porsche etc

Could you tell us the overall cost to Germany In £Billions please

[shaker44] 22/10/2018 07:24

Agree gbh. We have tried to change it from the inside for 30 years but they are hell bent on their flawed project to build United States of Europe, undemocratically and with inadequate budget control over weak member states.
Better to be out and in control of our own Destiny.

[shaker44] 22/10/2018 07:24

Agree gbh. We have tried to change it from the inside for 30 years but they are hell bent on their flawed project to build United States of Europe, undemocratically and with inadequate budget control over weak member states.
Better to be out and in control of our own Destiny.

[gbh2] 22/10/2018 07:12

The EU is nothing more than a self perpetuating money pit that is and always will be a burden on the Nation tax payers of every country involved.

[disneydonald] 21/10/2018 23:50

Yeah, for what it’s worth, I believe the EU will self correct going forward. Northern Europe, Eastern Europe and UK are not keen on general direction. Better to stay in as a major player, and help orchestrate change for thx better.

[marksp2011] 21/10/2018 14:15

m4rtinu

The less the government tries to "manage" the economy the better off we will all be

[steeplejack] 21/10/2018 13:39

Agree with you.By the by,anyone heard from David Cameron?

[m4rtinu] 21/10/2018 13:32

Steeple - as a Corbyn/ Labour supporter, I find it difficult to accept that the fall in house-builders share price is due to worries about JC getting into number 10. Surely the Tories' lack of ability to manage a domestic economy because they are all tied up with Brexit has something to do with it!

And as for the Persimmon boss' bonus (which I accept you dont' agree with): why should the majority put in a good shift on a Monday morning after reading about that.

However, I'm with you on "As far as the EU is concerned,we should have helped to mould and formulate the rulings of the EU." Absolutely agree. Stay in and change from the inside. MU.

[steeplejack] 21/10/2018 13:17

Or alternatively you encourage BMW to build cars in the UK.Unlikely option going forward.Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't Nissan worried about using the UK as a European manufacturing base divorced from the EU.Have they not managed to extract guarantees from the UK Government.

[dexdringle] 21/10/2018 12:22

....a contraction of the BMW market in the UK is not the end of the world (for BMW)...

But it would be very good news for Jaguar though. Surely Brits buying goods made in the UK has to be better (for the UK) than them buying cars made abroad?

[marksp2011] 21/10/2018 12:01

Sounds like the start of the election campaign. Are they sure Corbyn isn't going to privatise all housing with no compensation ?