Seneca Growth Capital Vct Share Discussion Threads

[edmondj] 25/11/2004 12:13

Curious indeed, when the message (even) at the start of September was HYG being on course for good profits, amid property/land sales, with independent projections on Swaylands underpinning a financial transformation over the next 3 years!

[alfred] 25/11/2004 11:58

Doesn't the value of the offer suggest that all was not as it seemed with regard to HYG's accounts?

[ukhawk] 25/11/2004 11:44

RFTurner2, do you know what arrangement the HYG directors have ? I'm sure it's a lot more cosy than your average shareholder.

[ukhawk] 25/11/2004 11:42

Salpara, if the value of HYG is that low why have the company not previously put out a trading statement ? It's now 2 months since their end of year, and at no stage has HYG attempted to advise the LSE that trading has not been as expected.
I've been investing in the stock market for a good many years, and am aware of all the possible outcomes in a situation like this, but still, wrongly in this case, trust directors to safeguard the interests of ALL shareholders.

[rcturner2] 25/11/2004 11:40

Its a wierd one this, because the directors are getting shafted the same as everyone else. I can only imagine that they feel the only way forward for the company is to sell out - implying difficulties?!

[salpara111] 25/11/2004 10:01

Not a holder but am not surprised by the reaction on the board here and I cant say that I blame anyone. Having said that I guess all you can do is say that it has been a painful learning experience and most importantly remember for the future that agreed bids for companies often come in below the current market price rather than at a premium.

[ukhawk] 25/11/2004 09:33

What a total shafting. Either the market has been given mis-leading information, or the directors have screwed the small shareholders to line their own pockets.

[shawzie] 25/11/2004 09:13

the writing has been on the wall for some time.
some you win - some you lose.

15 Sep'03 - 19:25 - 21 of 447
sale of 1.5M shares. is this company a possible takeover by Artisan ?

19 May'04 - 10:41 - 61 of 447
I sold 20,000 @ 11.5p around 10.15a.m. this morning and the bid price dropped
immediately to 11.0p.
However, I have yet to see the sale showing on L2.
Sale now through and bid back to 11.5p.
NAV per share too low relative to market price for my liking

[d8raider] 25/11/2004 09:12

I'm thinking keep the hyg shares for now and then take the OKD ones - at least then there's the chance (?) of getting some profit back in due course. Sell HYG now and you make a loss for sure.
Is this a sound approach to be taking or are there some alternative thoughts out there?

[shanklin] 25/11/2004 09:09

tiswas

RAB have warrants on HYG shares at 10p on a 1 for 1 basis with their current 24.4% holding. These have been diluted by OKD's offer which is offering 1 OKD share per 80 HYG warrants vs the 1 OKD share per 12 HYG shares which the rest of us have the great joy (heavy irony here) of being offered.

If HYG receive an offer of 11p share, RAB's warrants are in the money and they'll want a bigger share of the action. I'm sure the rest of us would also prefer on offer at or above 11p.

Thankfully HYG is my smallest holding... ...and getting smaller by the minute, although even at 8 a.m. I intended to make the best of a bad job by taking up the OKD shares rather than selling the HYG ones

Cheers, Martin

[a0148009] 25/11/2004 09:09

The directors and related parties 42.5% and RAB 22.3% are binding unless there is a competing bid of 11p or more which is a premium of 45% over the current bid.

[tiswas] 25/11/2004 08:54

I would be interested in Edmund Jackson's thoughts as I believe he had a decent holding. In August he said on Citywire "I think it is likely this £14 million housebuilder gets acquired. I do not intend to sell or reduce."

Why have RAB got the right to withdraw their acceptance if a bidder comes in at 11p+. Is that designed to force someones hand or is it saying that even if someone offers 10p the majority shareholders wont take it so the small guy is stuffed even more?

[pugugly] 25/11/2004 08:43

He may well lose his shirt. Swaylands has already been through the hands of a number of developers. It is largely (I believe) a developments of very high priced homes on the top of a hill about 1 mile form Penshurst. I would suspect that given the increase in bank rate and worries about the economy there has been a significant reduction in the price obtainable for the properties. I used to know the area well - great views etc but am currently out of touch with the trend of property prices there but have been told by a man who still lives there that top end have dropped by 10%+

[hybrasil] 25/11/2004 08:37

So Mr Wray has rescued Honeygrove. Were they not lucky to have him as a shareholder.

[barryrog] 25/11/2004 08:20

why have a go at Hawk,for what purpose.
all the small shareholders have lost money,its criminal letting people buy at 10.25p yesterday.

[rcturner2] 25/11/2004 08:16

ukhawk - i await your comments with interest

[barryrog] 25/11/2004 07:42

SO THE SMALL GUY GETS SHAFTED YET AGAIN!!!

[ukhawk] 24/11/2004 22:39

Barry, the actual spread hasn't been as much as that for a while. I had a little top-up today. As you've pointed out earlier, the full year results are now available for due diligence, this could have been the reason why it's dragged on. Might also have pushed the price up, hopefully. Even if the takeover doesn't happen, the company should be able to soften the blow somewhat with decent results.

[ukhawk] 24/11/2004 15:14

From last friday's RNS, "The directors expect to make a further announcement in the near future."

This must be close now, and the share-price is no higher than when the bid talks were first mentioned.

[barryrog] 20/11/2004 13:20

hi charlie,
your right it is not that easy to unravel.
however ,we know the major assets i.e land, are grossly undervalued.(apparently they are all booked at cost). Swaysland alone ,on the books at £8 mill and they have already turned down an offer of twice that amount for the site.
in addition,they have been reducing the debt.
remains very interesting,but remember it was the gross undervaluation of the co.that prompted the bid in the first place.
rgds.

[charlie] 20/11/2004 13:08

Not so unbelievable for a south-eastern housebuilder at this point.

The negative goodwill restatement has prompted me to have a closer look at the accounts. It is actually quite difficult to work out what this company is worth. For starters, £5.2m of capitalised interest in work-in-progress? That's more than half the book value of the equity.

I'm not saying there's necessarily anything wrong. Just that it is difficult to tell. The net worth is the small difference between large debt and large assets. If the assets include significant amounts of items like capitalised interest, you need to be very careful.

[barryrog] 20/11/2004 10:10

morning Hawk,
only just seen yesterdays' announcement and putting aside the takeover talks for a mo and focusing on the comment regarding profitability,this is really good news.
people may have lost sight of this under the current circumstances but the financial year end closed on 30/9/2004 and the co.is obviously now aware of the full year results.
to remind everybody,here is the Brokers forecast:-

TURNOVER £33.0 mill
PROFIT £5.4 mill
EPS 3.1p
DIV 0.6p

this gives a p/e of just 3.3 meaning that the cos. profits for this year are in fact equal to 1/3rd of the cos.total capitalisation.UNBELIEVABLE!

[ukhawk] 19/11/2004 16:22

Sounds like we're close !