Scancell Share Discussion Threads

[ivyspivey] 07/7/2021 07:02

Morning Small crow,
As you will know I was extremely confident in MTFB given the successful p3 results,the institutional backing and many other things but as Inanaco says it was a binary bet on FDA Approval but it was de risked far beyond any of the SCLP platforms as it had gone much further down the regulatory Approval pathway.
As Inanaco says the beauty here is the variety and diversity of the platforms and the potential huge upside.
With these multiple shots at goal I am very confident that from these levels will come in but it needs real quantifiable data to truly validate these platforms and until that time there is the risk.
I was more confident in the other one so had more invested there as it was much closer to commercialisation whereas this is much further away and we know what happened to the other one so a salutary lesson not to get too emotionally involved in any share
ATB

[inanaco] 07/7/2021 06:58

part 2

this is the Key which the majority don't get

a natural T cell is a t cell .........

we know they work

Scancell is not creating some magical T cell ..... what it is doing is "activating them" in the most efficient way

a T cell against cancer is the same as a t cell against a virus

what is the most potent t cell for cancer will also will eradicate a Virus

it does NOT matter what the target is .... if it can be killed by a T cell ... immunobody can be programmed with it ....

that is the essence of Confidence ... understanding that we are programming T cells

its the T cells that do the work ...... Proven by millions of years of evolution

and they work best at a very specific "activation" process

so Check points like Keytruda bind to Natural T cells ..... and they synergise

its an approved drug .... thus if a vaccine technology has validated High Avidity t cell then keytruda will bind to it .... the cancers PD-1 ligand is Blocked

the risk of trial failure becomes tiny because the efficacy argument has been removed ie we already know because its validated ... so probably only down to AE events which a more likely to be the check point because its systemic than the t cell activated by immunobody

because if the t cell attacked self it would have attacked any off target cell that expressed the antigen ... in over 30 patients ... an auto immune response but "nothing" detected

[inanaco] 07/7/2021 06:41

small crow .. part 1

I am going to use Burbles text in the reply ...my posting history also contains similar MTFB was a singular target share one shot on goal if that had been successful you may have got spin offs from it.

but the Key to understanding the value currently in Scancell is immunobody its been through a major trial and all other targets have all yielded "High Avidity" that is an easy test all you doing its simulating blood with a tiny amount of target antigen, low avidity t cells don't respond high avidity does.

""The availability of the TCR, coreceptors, and peptide-MHC complexes to interact with each other determine T-cell structural avidity (Figure 1). Additionally, the sensitivity of a T cell to triggering by its antigen is termed “functional avidity” or “avidity”; and is defined as the concentration of peptide able to induce 50% activation of the antigen-specific T-cell pool. Basically this is a measure of passing activation thresholds and subsequent induction of signaling and biological function upon establishing a stable interaction with the APC""

Burble

As a pipeline, what stands out for Scancell vs. other pharma/biotech startups is the fact that the bulk of their products are platforms. This means they have almost infinite scope to generate new therapies once the platform is proved to work. So whilst there is risk with any product and platforms are no different, once one of these makes it through trials to the clinic, the platform is validated and so any number of 'flavours' of that platform, targetting any number of targets becomes available. Covidity validates Immunobody and Avidimab and a new needle-free delivery system in a single set of trials. SCIB1 trials validates immunobody in cancer and the new Moditope trial (esp. phase 2) is 4 hard to treat cancer trials in one.

If you compare this to a lot of biotechs/pharma they put all their eggs in a single basket with a single product. If that fails, it's back to the drawing board. If it works, many companies will buy that product and incorporate it into their own portfolio. Scancell platforms if validated could be v.v.valuable especially if licenced out to any number of players in the field of infectious disease or oncology.

[small crow] 06/7/2021 23:36

Ivyspivey, Are you more or less confident of this than you were of MTFB??

[panama7] 06/7/2021 23:08

Wigwammwe, your last post sums up perfectly what a bed wetter you are. anyone with an ounce of humanity will treat people with humanity and not expect them to be treated any differently jabbed or unjabbed. It is pretty obvious you have zero humanity hence why your stuck behind your sofa scared to venture out into the big wide world just in case some stranger comes within 6 feet of you and you don't know whether they have taken the experimental medical treatment or not.

[ivyspivey] 06/7/2021 21:34

I would imagine they would ideally look to do a head to head as they would have pretty good data on all combinations of boosters of current Vax which mainly work on S protein via nABs.
So what they would be looking for imo is the T Cell response and maybe some memory response which we think SCLP is much more likely to generate.
So although I expect SN15 or 17 t9 be used as a booster from Autumn 2022 I think the really big potential is in following years as they have a lot more data on length of immunity of different approaches.
Other question is what variants may be around at the time and hiw existing Vax work.
I know they have high hopes of the intra nasal Vax so SCLP needs its niche

[wigwammer] 06/7/2021 20:57

PeePee7 - well I can't imagine why people think you will bore all and sundry about covid at any opportunity!! The waitress would correctly be far more confident about taking the mask off if she knew the people in the restaurant were vaxxed.. you are not.. (control group, behind the sofa, scared of needles).. :)

[emptyend] 06/7/2021 20:45

I think if there was a challenge trial leg (backed by government) they would want to go head to head to pick the best late 2022 booster shot.

[emptyend] 06/7/2021 20:43

Spot on with that thinking, I suspect, Ivy.

[bermudashorts] 06/7/2021 20:11

Ivan

If they carried out a phase II as a challenge trial, would they run it as a single arm trial or would they do a head to head comparison with one of the approved vax boosters?

[gooosed] 06/7/2021 20:01

Thanks for that . . . so possibly consistent with the nano-delivery system method talked about over a year ago.

[bermudashorts] 06/7/2021 19:56

Gooosed - yes, so much we still don't know about.

I'm sure at some stage Scancell said that UoN partners were developing a peptide delivery system but according to the recent RNS they're testing 2 needle-free delivery methods in South Africa. I'm not sure whether this is as well as, or instead of the peptide system. It's possible that one or both may be proprietary systems that already have approval.

[ivyspivey] 06/7/2021 19:52

Hi EE,
Probably the most natural time to do a HC trial is a p2 but Codagenix a intra nasal Covid Vax is currently finishing a p1 abd the MHRA has said it will accept HC trials as part of the regulatory pathway so could replicate a p3 as well.
Normally pharma would come in at p2 completion stage and before p3 for well known reasons.
There is no reason why a U.K. booster could not be done as a Challenge trial in fact I can see the sense.
I do think the SA trial is to get the trials underway and assess which is best way forward abd U.K. arm is then to really confirm earlier findings.
I suspect SCLP are aiming for to be available as boosters for Autumn 2022 but of course new variants and a particular need to develop a universal Covid Vax can change everything

[gooosed] 06/7/2021 19:37

Bermuda - I understood (possibly incorrectly) that the delivery method(s) was/were also in trial(s) as which could have consequences going forward for Immunobody. Have I got that wrong ?

[bermudashorts] 06/7/2021 19:28

Loggy - you too!

EE - yes, anything is possible really. Just hope that Scancell stick to timescales now and once clinical trial approval is received they move quickly to actually commence the trial.

[thelogman] 06/7/2021 19:21

Bermuda, thanks for your reply. Hope you make more cracking profits.

[bermudashorts] 06/7/2021 19:15

Loggy,

I don't actively trade any stocks but at times I have sold some Scancell stock and have also bought at other times. All of my AIM investments are true long positions and they're nearly all biotechs. Mind you, I didn't expect Scancell to be quite so long.

It's horses for courses, but I find investing long is much more enjoyable, less stressful and it works well for me. I've made some bad decisions and lost money but I've also made some cracking profits.

Hope that answers your question and thanks for the kind words!!

[emptyend] 06/7/2021 19:11

Useful summary. Thanks for that, bs.My expectations are:1. South African trial approval in July2. Trial recruitment in August3. Initial phase 1 safety results in November (though if two doses are to be tested, that element will be delayed)4. UK approval for part 2 in December5. Swift recruitment in Jan, due to booster vaccines tiering down from the 70+ group who will get boosted in 2021.6. Results by Apr/MayI agree with Ivy that a challenge trial may also be used (indeed, could the UK booster trial actually be structured as a challenge trial??)But partnering timeframe etc may well depend on the degree to which government moves in to support the testing once safety has been proven. If the government piles in to support an early challenge trial then it surely must make sense to get scale manufacturing lined up for Q4 2022 boosters - and that may mean partnering in Q1?

[thelogman] 06/7/2021 18:32

Bermuda as the most respected poster on this board imo, as well as others who respect your posts, have you not traded scancell in all the time you have been invested. You are far more into the technicals than I can understand. Tel me to do one by all means. I do not really understand the science, and have no intention to try and understand it. My objective is to invest and make a profit. Scancell has done me absolutely fine. Just curious to how you deal with scancell.

[ivyspivey] 06/7/2021 18:18

Just to add if I can.
I am sure that SCLP would like to partner before phase 2 but not sure if they will be in a position to get a deal without the full p1 results from both SA and U.K. My guess would possibly be a p2 Human Challenge and possibly then a deal.
I think the SA results will not be on their own enough and are mainly there to decide moving forward which formulation,protocol and specific Vax to take forward in U.K.

[bermudashorts] 06/7/2021 18:04

Plasbryn,

It's possible that they may have some data from the South African trial in Q4 but it depends entirely on speed of approval from the SA regulators, speed of recruitment and also dosing regime. By that I mean if it's a two dose regime then the no. of weeks between doses will impact how quickly the trial is completed.

It's not clear whether Scancell will have to wait for full results from the S. African trial before applying to the MHRA for approval to commence the UK trial. If so that means the UK trial follows on after the S. African with the obvious impact on timescales. On the other hand, it may be that as soon as the correct dose and best delivery method has been established in South Africa, they'll have enough safety data to get approval from the UK regulators and can run both trials concurrently.

We really know very little at this stage and I feel the manufacture of SN17 may also impact timescales.

As for phase II or even phase III - it depends entirely on the results, the funding situation and the state of play with Covid. My gut feel is that Scancell would probably prefer to partner before phase II.

[emptyend] 06/7/2021 18:00

Me too. He was talking to Elvis and rode off on Shergar.....

[plasybryn] 06/7/2021 17:36

Technical help please. If we carry out Phase One trials successfully in the U.K. and in South Africa in H2 2021, when would we expect to go into Phase Two trials?Are we expecting tho get the Phase One results before the end of 2021? How long can Scancell expect to remain independent? Would a successful Phase One result see a take over bid or is this unlikely to occur until after Phase 2?

[panama7] 06/7/2021 17:21

Wigwammer, why on earth would I need to warn a Waitress if I was va xx ed or not. Is that now how you judge people and how you begin a conversation. I bet your riveting company on a night out, oh but of course you don't go out, too busy posting rubbish from behind your sofa while being double masked.