Premier Technical Services Share Discussion Threads

[baddeal] 23/6/2018 21:53

Ezymoney Remember on acquisitions you only consolidate revenue for part and of the year but you show the full debtor balance so you can't calculate debtor days based upon revenue and debtors

[rivaldo] 22/6/2018 14:33

Another impressive new contract win covering 18 cities and providing a variety of services....



"PTSG rules the roost for Student Roost

Premier Technical Services Group PLC (PTSG) has won an impressive national contract to provide a multitude of specialist services to Student Roost properties.

Student Roost is a major student accommodation provider, with properties in university cities across the UK, all the way from Aberdeen to Bournemouth.

Teams from two of the Group’s divisions; Access & Safety and Electrical Services, will travel to 18 cities in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland to test lightning protection and fall arrest systems, as well as carrying out fixed wire testing and portable appliance testing (PAT).

PTSG holds multidisciplinary contracts like this one with hundreds of customers across the UK, helping them avoid the difficulty of procuring a variety of niche specialist services from different providers. This makes customers’ lives easier, whilst also ensuring PTSG always provides a cost-effective and high-quality service."

[eezymunny] 22/6/2018 10:12

8m+ accrued income? One supposes that they consider that to be work they have done, but not yet invoiced. Not a word of explanation in the AR.

Doesn't float my barge.

[rivaldo] 21/6/2018 12:09

The true net trade receivables figure is £20.2m. The rest of the £32.5m is mostly accrued income, plus prepayments etc.

But an investor actually has to read the Annual Report to know this detail rather than rely on superficial and incorrect numbers.

And of that £20.2m, £14.8m is due within 120 days - the rest represents retentions and other recoverables.

The true "trade debtor" balance is therefore only £14.8m. And that was boosted sharply by terrific Q4 trading and acquisitions which would only have contributed partially to turnover for the year. That represents around 3.3 months - which will
presumably be improved for H1 when the effects of the acquisitions and Q4 trading are evened out.

It's too soon to make sweeping statements without all the facts. If there's no improvement this year then it's worth asking questions.

[eezymunny] 21/6/2018 09:52

So an average customers are taking 7 months to pay? 32.5m receivables vs 53m revenue?

SEVEN MONTHS!!!!!! Can you find a worse payment profile for any listed stock?

If this goes sour investors will only have themselves to blame IMVHO...

[rivaldo] 21/6/2018 08:23

The fact that £4.3m of shares can be slotted almost instantly - and at above the mid-price at 172.5p - indicates very high demand from institutions at current levels.

PTSG IPO'd at 52p only 40 months ago. That's right - 52p. Which is when the MD's targets were set and have been met.

I'm also no fan of nil cost schemes. And remuneration is high. But management have done a fine job here. And note that the MD has only sold what he has to sell to meet the income tax liabilities which arise IMMEDIATELY on exercise of these shares being issued. He's retained all of his remaining shares.

As for debtors, you merely have to look at PTSG's customer base, the wide spread of those customers and the necessity of their services to be reassured that they will pay, or that bad debts should be minimal - as with Carillion. Given Q4's strong trading and sales, and the various acquisitions, it may be instructive to review the next set of figures before making premature judgements.

[panic investor] 21/6/2018 08:00

Might sell today - might be better places

[redartbmud] 21/6/2018 07:57

A case of very obese cat excess!!

[longshanks] 21/6/2018 07:36

Certainly today's news on a rather substantial award of nil-priced options to the group MD does highlight the fact that directors are very well remunerated at PTSG - possibly too well.The fact that statutory profit fell over the year due in part to such awards should perhaps be of some concern.

[eezymunny] 21/6/2018 07:32

So customers not paying or paying very very slowly and the MD gets a huge pile of nil cost shares (and sells a big chunk of them) based on EBITDA performance (ie heavily motivated to show as much profit as possible, and no need to actually collect cash).

www.investegate.co.uk/premier-technical--ptsg-/rns/director-shareholding/201806210700040628S/

Maybe it's all OK, but I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole.... I've never seen a company with late paying customers and no good reasons for it end well...

[masurenguy] 20/6/2018 17:07

Chasbas - nobody is saying that the debtors constitute a "red flag". High sales growth can be a contributory factor but while sales increased by 35% last year debtors actually increased by 60%.

Current debtor ratio is now over 200 day sales outstanding, which is very much on the high side and this is an issue that management should address. I just don't buy the glib "management explained that it was simply the standard terms in their industry" justification. What makes them so different from any other building services company in that particular context ?

The RCF was increased by £12m last year to help fund acquisitions but they would need to borrow less if they got their receivables down by at least 40% to circa 120 days, which coincidentally would be the equivalent of a £12m improvement in their cash flow.

[rogers8] 20/6/2018 16:55

I should have contained the comment "unfair" to the 9 month chart which feels like Paul Scott is showing the company in the worst light. 1 year and 2 year charts tells the actual story. PTSG has been on Paul Scott's radar for a while. Had he been an early investor I am certain he would have a better view on the company. I work in the FM industry and understand how the sector works. High debtor concerns are understandable but what is the worst that can happen? Carillion, one of PTSG's largest customers went bust and the charge was £300k, which had no material hit to the results. Most of PTSG's work is to do with compliance which is driven by government. If a customer is struggling financially, paying the compliance/certificate bills to keep the lights on/directors out of jail is why PTSG gets paid unless there is a bust situation. Happy to have suffered an increase in the share price of 100% over 18 months. Once the early director share options and acquisitions positions play out this £40m turnover company with £9m net profit share price will fly, again.

[chasbas] 20/6/2018 16:19

I remember that Paul Scott interviewed management and expressed his reservation about high debtors. Management explained that it was simply the standard terms in their industry. Doesn't fast growth imply high debtors? They always get the money...IMHO this is not a red flag

[masurenguy] 20/6/2018 15:36

I am also a long term, happy shareholder. I originally invested in September 2016 and, with subsequent top ups, have an average cost price of under 90p. However, it is also very important to be aware of the potential downsides in any investment. Paul Scott's comments are perfectly reasonable - he states that "the bull case is pretty good" with PTSG being "high margin niche business, together with canny management making decent acquisitions". His only real reservation is the size of the debtors and that is an issue that any company, and its shareholders, needs to focus upon.

[rogers8] 20/6/2018 10:22

Paul Scott's view of PTSGs performance over the past 9 months is unfair. If you take a 12 month view the performance is outstanding circa £1.20 to £1.72. The major rise last year was in the build up to the September numbers. With the guidance from the January's statement I expect a similar increase in price. Should be an interesting 3 months. Long term very happy shareholder.

[rivaldo] 18/6/2018 15:18

Forecasts were increased following the Jan'18 statement. It's too soon for PTSG to give a more bullish view than they expressed today, especially in an AGM statement.

The early August trading statement - only a few weeks away - should give us a better idea, though the interims the next month would probably be the ideal time to look ahead if forward visibility looked absolutely clear.

[baddeal] 18/6/2018 14:41

Jaf11, if the board thought it was trading outside of broker forecasts, ie market consensus, it is obliged to update the market

[cottoner] 18/6/2018 07:47

As a reminder , in Jan 2018.

PTSG stated :

'In addition, the Board expects that the results for the year ended 31 December 2018 will be materially ahead of current market forecasts. This reflects the strength of the Group's order book and successful integration, and ongoing progress at its recently acquired businesses.'

[shanklin] 18/6/2018 07:47

No position at PTSG but I guess their sprinkler business can only be helped by poor decision making such as here...

...

[apad] 18/6/2018 07:46

PTSG AGM statement.
Lots about orders, particularly emphasising the last two acquisitions.
Nothing about restructuring, and the meaningless:
".... in line with the Board's expectations."
Disappointing.
Interims Sept.

apad

[jaf111] 18/6/2018 07:43

Thanks Rivaldo...not wishing to be picky it would have been better / more helpful if the company had given an indication of whether it was performing in line with the broker forecasts rather than the Board's expectations.

[fizzypop] 18/6/2018 07:36

AGM - all strongly positive. Posted below:

AGM Statement

At today's Annual General Meeting of Premier Technical Services Group PLC, the niche specialist services provider, John Foley, Chairman, will provide the following update to shareholders:

"I am pleased to report that the Group has seen continued sales growth and strong levels of orders in the year to date. In addition, working capital utilisation, margin and profit levels are in line with the Board's expectations.

"Contract renewal rates remain high and a number of significant three to five year contracts and framework agreements have been signed across all disciplines with new and existing customers since the beginning of the financial year, underpinning our organic growth strategy.

"The acquisitions completed last year are contributing significantly to the growth of the Group. We have been particularly pleased with the improvement in the contract renewal rates for BEST since its acquisition last year. In addition, we are seeing unprecedented demand for Fire Solutions with UK Sprinklers trading 50% ahead of the acquired business."

"The Board is confident that the business is in a strong position to continue to grow both organically and through carefully selected acquisitions. These acquisitions have allowed PTSG to evolve its highly compelling installation, service and testing offer and confidently target sector dominance in our markets that are underpinned by regulatory compliance and an increasing focus on regular testing."

[rampmeister] 18/6/2018 07:31

11p and 12.2p according to Digital Look.

RM

[rivaldo] 18/6/2018 07:27

Indeed - can't ask for more at this stage. Terrifically confident and a very positive outlook.

I particularly like the regulatory compliance aspect, as well as the high revenue visibility:

"Contract renewal rates remain high and a number of significant three to five year contracts and framework agreements have been signed across all disciplines with new and existing customers"

And "unprecedented demand for Fire Solutions with UK Sprinklers trading 50% ahead of the acquired business."

JAF111, the only main analyst forecast out there is Numis' of 12.2p EPS this year (with a 2p dividend).