Pcf Share Discussion Threads

[geraldus] 03/6/2021 11:00

Looked at some Trustpilot reviews.Far from favourable recently,having been top notch.

[carcosa] 03/6/2021 10:29

I would expect, given the length of time investing, that similar suspension events have occurred with an occasional holding in your portfolio. Suspensions in the manner that has occurred with PCF never end well.

Idle speculation serves no purpose other than to feed conspiracy theories. A usually partial explanation will be provided ahead of the shares resuming trading (if they ever do). As an investor there is nothing to be gained or lost financially even if an entire explanation is forthcoming. You can't profitably trade your way out of it as the share price will be re-aligned upon the suspension being lifted; and you can bet your bottom dollar that retail investors will not be able to sell shares in any quantity until well after the opening unless you have a full service broker.

One thing is practically guaranteed... the share price will open substantially lower. Best case scenario, otherwise PCF is worthless.

Given all the talk years ago on Stockopedia (am no longer a subscriber) regarding red flags there was, as usual, ample opportunity to get out of PCF prior to the suspension. But some lessons need to be re-learnt several times, it seems.

[graham1ty] 03/6/2021 09:42

Even if shares remain suspended, surely they can give an outline of the problem ?

There has been nothing in the press, trade press, or blogs that sheds any light. Surely Simon Thompson had a direct line to Scott ? And having tipped it so often, ST must surely be wanting to let his readers know what is going on, ASAP ?

Does the PRA not have a duty to either reassure, or warn, punters ? What are the brokers saying to clients and shareholders ?

Etc etc, all speculation. And some of us have a lot of money tied up here.....

[seasidehippo] 03/6/2021 09:14

Doesn't "In due course" mean either they haven't a clue what they are looking for or they do know what they are looking for but they can't/will not either define it and/or provide a timeline for its resolution/completion?
Surely after more than 2 weeks they must now have some idea and should at least provide an update to shareholders and retail customers.
Hopefully they haven't been waiting for Friday!!

[cc2014] 03/6/2021 07:41

It's my view that PCF continuing to accept money from savers tells us nothing. Regardless of how good or bad the situation is the PRA aren't going to intervence in the very short term on this matter, particuarly as PCF haven't breached any covenants or capital ratios (and I think they would have to inform the market of that regardless of suspension)

If they were going to intervene it would be firstly on PCF's ability to write new loans, which as far as I can tell from their website is continuing.


Scott leaving. 2 scenarios. First is he's been asked to resign because he's part of whatever has gone wrong. Second is he's resigned because he feels the Board are not functioning appropriately and is worried about his personal liability.

We cannot say which but what we do see is a company that can't get it's accounts done on time, have already had to correct them and have unknown issues with financial controls and reporting processes.

I perceive the length of time this is taking to sort out is not good.

[dandigirl] 02/6/2021 19:54

They may or may not have been asleep but another week has now passed. There must have been some exchanges with their regulators - that is required of the board who now have personal liability. The regulator will have been kept informed daily and suspended their licence if things had been that bad. Likewise, the FSCS would not allow PCF to take on new deposits and therefore add to their liability if things were that bad.

Sad to see Scott go but I have seen CEO's go for lesser deeds.

No, I don't agree with your thoughts at all.

[graham1ty] 02/6/2021 19:23

But something is bad enough for Scott to have gone......

We cannot rule out that the PRA may be asleep on the job......PCF has no warnings, no restrictions etc on the PRA website, and having spoken to them last week, they said they had no alerts and no concerns about PCF ( they might have been hiding the truth)

I think “it can’t be that bad” is wishful thinking......though I hope I am wrong

[dandigirl] 02/6/2021 18:45

Reassuring that PCF continues to operate.

Just looked at trying to place funds with them and it was possible to do so.

Both regulators and the FSCS must be content to allow business to continue.

Things can't be really bad, surely. Otherwise banking licence would be suspended and FSCS would withdraw guarantee.

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 14:24

Oh! I agree. But I think it's a bad look to jump ship now. Besides any buyer would want to extra due diligence given these shenanigans. Better for Somers to try and get it at rock bottom and sell-on/re-float later. That banking licence has cost a lot to get and is valuable in the right hands, subject to regulatory approval.

As I posted before, this is an opportunity for Somers, one that doesn't come along every day. Could bring grief for the rest of us though.

That said, the buyers of COOP Bank are probably regretting their involvement.

[seasidehippo] 01/6/2021 13:43

Many thanks, much appreciated.

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 13:41

... and it would be a good fit with SUS.

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 13:40

My thoughts were that at 24p the market cap is shown as £60m.

38% not owned by Somers etc - £23m.

Write that figure down by whatever takes your fancy but whatever you get to it isn't a lot of money for private equity.

and seaside, yes they would have to buy us out but the question is: at what price? And that depends upon the findings among other things.

Just musing.

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 13:29

I can go with that. Just hoping that there isn't any fraud involved.

[cc2014] 01/6/2021 11:54

My guess is that the accounts, accounts systems and other off system-systems are a mess, don't consistently add up and the transactions aren't sufficiently evidenced.


Based on their accounts should have been signed off some time ago. An extension from AIM is highly unusual. Also based on they've already admitted having to change them for a number or reasons by £1m.

But mostly based on: "PCF announces that trading in the Group's shares has been temporarily suspended while the Group undertakes a further review in relation to its financial controls and reporting processes"


If I choose to speculate and be really picky about the last RNS, financial controls would worry me about people acting in excess of their authority, or loose controls leading to bad lending. And then reporting processes suggests the systems are chucking out the wrong answers or that the Board aren't being provided information they should.

[seasidehippo] 01/6/2021 11:49

IF Somers/Bermuda were to take it Private what happens to our shares? Do they have to buy them from us?

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 11:32

Doubt it.

At 63%, by now, Somers/Bermuda will have trawled all over the books and know them better than most.

Who else might be interested at this point, why and at a price to induce S/B to sell?

[cjd190573] 01/6/2021 11:07

Perhaps! Or there could equally be another interested party.

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 10:56

O.K. let's play guessing games

Maybe Somers/Bermuda are trying to take PCF private?

[cjd190573] 01/6/2021 10:47

Still just seems a little too co-incidental that the person who has been head of transformation for the past six months, is now head of the Group, albeit on an interim basis. Can’t help feeling that there is going to be a lot of mixed news to come.

[cc2014] 01/6/2021 10:38

I tried over the weekend to work out what the CET ratio would go to if a one off loss of £5m, £10m or £20m occurred.

This was made rather challenging as in their year end results for Sept 20, I could not see the they had shown the detail so this left with trying to work it out based on Sept 2019 and then winding a year forward.

Tbh I became distinterested as the sun was out. What I did find out is that PCF have taken on a Tier 2 capital facility since Sept 2019 in the amount of £7m with capacity to draw up to £15m in total (altough I would think that a problem whilst shares suspended). On the Tier 2 they are paying 8% which is higher than I would have expected. The T2 capital is not sourced from Somers

My rough calculations in my head shows that a loss of £10m would not breach their capital limits. Indeed there would appear to be headroom above their capital limit even for a £20m loss, although it would put their massive expansion plans on hold. BAU would be ok though.


So, I cannot see why the shares are suspended.

The lack of RNS this morning is disappointing. One can only hope there is a board meeting taking place this morning to digest everything and a RNS will flow later in the day.

Whilst the PRA are not in the business of destroying businesses by taking unncessarily quick action, I cannot see they will be too impressed with what's going on. I'm sure letters will have been sent both ways.

What surprises me most is that the suspension will damage PCF's ability long term to borrow from the market. They aren't going to be able to renew that Tier 2 at 8%, nor will the wholesale markets go near them now for a while. Clearly they get most of their funding from savers, 99% of whom won't know about this suspension.


More than anything I can't see why PCF aren't doing more to control reputational damage or potential damage.

[dandigirl] 01/6/2021 09:08

Somers & Bermuda playing hard.

Who can blame them for taking the opportunity?

.. and then there is a small Dutch contingent who must be distraught at this turn in events.

We can but wait in anticipation. No point in playing guessing games.

[seasidehippo] 01/6/2021 07:59

I agree with cjd this may not necessarily be a bad thing!!

[graham1ty] 01/6/2021 07:52

Oh dear. Still silence.....