Metnor Share Discussion Threads

[hugepants] 23/3/2009 19:09

Im gobsmacked Directors can legally buy shares in the market after announcing a delisting.



The FSA should be taking a long hard look at this racket. There are many AIM stocks with majority shareholders who could probably get a delisting passed at an EGM. Are they then going to be allowed to mop up the shares sold by minority shareholders at rock bottom prices?

[rcturner2] 20/3/2009 09:10

Great article. Boy I'm glad I sold out long ago.

But you can still find people like Rainmaker defending the indefensible.

[davidosh] 20/3/2009 09:07

This does suggest the waiver of the takeover panel rules was a bad move..

[rcturner2] 20/3/2009 08:15

Rainmaker, unfortunately you are just plain wrong. Your ability to sell an asset very much affects its value. The number of potential purchasers of Metnor as a delisted company is far lower than as a listed company. You understand price and supply and demand yes?

There is no "fundamental value" of anything other than what you can get for it.

[davidosh] 20/3/2009 02:31

There are many cheap listed companies to invest in so I doubt many will want to stay or invest in Metnor now. The AGM is today

[rainmaker] 20/3/2009 01:35

Hi Guys- A delisting will not affect the fundamental value or trading of Metnor one iota.They will still have the same value of assets and the same number of shares etc. The management have to pay you the same dividend per share for your shares as they receive for theirs.


I'd call this a technical rather than a fundamental factor that is adversely affecting the share price and creating a fantastic buying opportunity, as there is undoubtably a negative bias against Companies that delist(nobody on this thread would argue with that) and as Safman points out Institutions won't hold the shares and there are accounts such as SIPP that won't permit it.This whole situation is exacerbated by a lack of buyers because of the delisting bias mentioned earlier.

I sincerely wish you all the best with your trades

regards

[safman] 19/3/2009 15:58

also i would to that rainmaker, that institutions become forced sellers as they cannot hold / will not hold private company shares..

saffy....

[safman] 19/3/2009 15:56

delistings are the worst possible outcome.. AIM rule 41.. should be upped to 90%

saffy..

[rcturner2] 19/3/2009 15:54

Rainmaker, so you think delisting is "fair to shareholders"? Get a grip man. Someone had to dump at 1p they were so desperate to get out.

You have seen a lot of delistings have you? Almost always they end up shafting the small shareholder. If you can build up 5% nice work, but for people with under £10k which is what I am talking about they will be royally shafted.

[ben value] 19/3/2009 14:58

I hold my Metnor shares in a SIPP. I have been told by the SIPP provider that I must sell them by 24th March of they will sell them for me. Has anyone else been given a deadline before 31st March to sell their shares?

regards

[rainmaker] 13/3/2009 22:43

Somebody obviously knows what they are doing-announced today,Value Investments have taken a 5.04% stake at a fraction of the Co's liquidation value.They've paid approximately what the Company has paid out, on average,in dividends each year over the last five years. Nice.

regards

[rainmaker] 10/3/2009 11:35

No I'm not.Look at the Company history, have they not been fair to the shareholders say in terms of dividends paid? I have to remind shareholders that they are under no obligation to sell.

regards

[rcturner2] 10/3/2009 09:54

Rainmaker - you sound like one of the board - you're not are you?

Shares get downrated for a reason, and when the board control so many shares it is a PLC in name only. People stear clear of such companies for the very reason that we are now seeing - they will delist and sod the small shareholders.

[rainmaker] 10/3/2009 01:33

At the current price of 15p Metnor(MTG) have a market cap of just £2.3mln yet they have net working capital of £15mln or £1 a share(that is liquid assest less ALL liabilities) so they have a quite staggering "Bargain ratio" of 6.5. Plus you get another £6mln of Property Assets and another £6.6mln of Property, Plant and Machinery Fixed Assets thrown in for absolutely nothing. Tell me isn't that a good deal? Isn't that a sufficient margin of safety?

regards

[davidosh] 09/3/2009 17:06

Agreed....where is a list of all companies that delisted to prove that the £150k saved actually went on to give shareholders even better profits in the year after or future years for that matter ?

[rcturner2] 09/3/2009 12:50

I do not believe that £150k saving is behind a move like this given the amount of management time it will soak up. Sorry but delistings are notorious for shafting the small shareholders. Show me one that went well for the little guy?

Fortunately I sold out of these long ago.

[dumbarton2] 09/3/2009 11:28

Telegrpah had a large article on Metnor today and it did not read good. Octopus have a stake and they did not like the delisting either.

Sorry I cant seem to trace the article online but you guys might try, its worth reading.

[tara7] 08/3/2009 13:13

Not bid proof if they like the bid, also need 90% to get hold of the company, [that might be the plan long term.]

[rainmaker] 08/3/2009 00:29

Hi All, The management own 70.3% so it's bid proof. I just feel it needs to emphasised that Management want to delist because they are fed up with the lack of interest in their shares where I believe that daily volumes average just 4k and often don't trade, the short termism of the typical Investor which is ironic since this delisting measure has IMHO created a great short(medium and long for that matter)term trading opportunity. Presumably they also believe that the Market fails to value their shares properly-I wouldn't disagree on that score.It seems thesedays everyone is looking for a conspiracy theory and are looking for a Company to have a hidden ulterior motive. I'm just accepting their reasons which are quite plausible at face value.Sometimes it pays not too think too hard.


regards

[dumbarton2] 07/3/2009 10:21

tara7,

Sorry but you are way out on both assumptions.

First the management control most the stock so a bid is most unlikely, notwithstanding who would bid for a property related co in this economic climate.

Secondly it again cant be voted down as again the majority of votes are held by management and they are the ones that want a delisting.

You need a minimum of 25% to vote the proposal down !

[tara7] 06/3/2009 20:11

Two points, first this could get a bid, or the delisting be voted down. Very hard to get the 90% to get rid of all the small shareholders. If you have 10 years on your side buy the lot.

[rainmaker] 06/3/2009 18:20

Hi Pvee-Forgive me but I think you are being way to cynical which is no bad thing but I don't think the Management's history warrants it. They've been fair to shareholders and paid large regular dividends and generally done a good job running the Company. All they are doing is deciding that their listing isn't worth £150k a year as frequently the shares don't trade or there is low volume and (probably they generally feel that the Market doesn't value the shares properly)so they will no longer be quoted but the Company will continue to be operated as before.

regards

[dumbarton2] 06/3/2009 09:38

RC turner I think you are right.

I knew a guy that had about 70,000 shares and someone dumped 70,000 at 1p today. i dont know whether it was him however he is a millionaire and it could be him taking the hit as a tax loss against his gains this year. He sold a lot of his holdings before the market drop of late.

[rcturner2] 06/3/2009 09:23

I think that when shareholdings reach a certain level they can compulsory purchase any remaining shares. This has happened in the past to other companies. They delist, squeeze out the small guys and then magically relist 5 years later at a much higher level.

[pvee] 06/3/2009 09:03

Thanks for your comments Rainmaker and I agree about the potential and underlying value of the company.

I think the rub is: what price will the Directors offer in the future and have they got the power to impose this, noting that one of them already has a controlling stake and what control have minority shareholders over their capacity to influence the true value of the busines is reflected in our investment

Unfortunately the way the share price has plumetted this morning doesn't make me feel very optimistic but I have no choice but to hold