Kier Share Discussion Threads

[petersw1] 13/10/2021 15:48

Hmm, the adjustment used on the tradingview.com and ft charts does seem off. I make it more divide by 1.086 to adjust the old prices, or 1.121 if you got both the full open offer and full excess shares (like HL gave me).
Tradingview seems to divide by 1.169.

Still somewhere between 14% and 17% profit depending on how much excess entitlement you got. That is based on the close price of 108p on the day you started posting here and current price of ~113.5.

[wallywoo] 13/10/2021 15:12

No if you owned 1000 shares at 120p then. Bgt 87 (roughly 7 for 8 equity issue) at 85p. You would be;Cost 1.20 X 1000 = £1200870 X 0.85= 739.50 extraSo you would of had to find £739.50 extra money in June and your shares today would be worth:So your original money would of been held for 3 years and be worth;1000 X 1.13 = £1130 (£70 less)If you manage to find extra money for Kier equity issue in June and sell quickly before they fall again, you would make;0.28 X 870= £ 243.60 profitAll the rest of the time your investment would be in loss. So you are saying Sell quickly now before you lose this profit??? I heartily agree!So you think that buying strapped for cash companies that are likely to issue equity all the time (and sell assets) is good because you have a brief period where the share price doesn't fall after??

[petersw1] 13/10/2021 14:31

Wrong, if you'd bought the day you started posting here, took up the full open offer rights, then sold today you'd have made 22.8% profit. ((113.5 - 92.4)/92.4)*100

You are clearly lacking even the most basic understanding of what has happened here in all the time you have been posting.

[wallywoo] 13/10/2021 14:18

What are you talking about Peter. If you held these shares from then, you would of received nothing, forked out 80 percent more money for new shares. What you actually own is much less because their assets have fallen massively


That's not a investment. It's a charity. You can keep gifting money to these clowns but don't critique Pi's who point out the scam it is.

[petersw1] 13/10/2021 14:01

Your first post here was "wallywoo - 17 Jun 2019 - 09:02:36 - 2986 of 23093"
The rebased price then, taking into account the effective split from the open offer, was 92.4 according to tradingview.com.

[wallywoo] 13/10/2021 13:53

I actually told everyone to sell in June 2019, when the share price was 120, and before they had to fork out an awful lot on new shares.


Today Kier are the same money pit. They have another bail out, which will be spent over the next year or two. When the market wakes up to that the share price will fall quickly.


Good investments pay a return, don't dilute with lots of new shares. They invest in assets and the business.


Poor investments shrink their tangible assets each year, issue lots more shares to survive, and sell off assets to pay bills.

[petersw1] 13/10/2021 13:38

Says the poster who told everyone to sell back when it was below 50p.

[wallywoo] 13/10/2021 12:52

Yawn yawn yawn, Stdy. You are not still going on about Kier's miraculous ability to take shareholders money every few years, so they can survive a little longer??


I have admitted, I was surprised that shareholders bailed out Kier again. That still doesn't mean they are anything but a terrible investment and a money pit.


If I was to bang on about every time you said the share price was going higher over the last 2.5 years, we would be here all day and week!!!


This is a poor investment, honeymoon period is over, be very careful now, with the huge amount of shares in issue it can fall very quickly!!

[stdyeddy] 13/10/2021 11:13

wolly, since you have been proven to be a fraud and a liar on here, it's very difficult for anyone to take you seriously. As for Kier's 'tangible assets', they were somewhat less than tangible and written down by Davies again and again. You are distorting the truth. Why do you bother? The shareprice has ticked down; so what? It will tick up and continue ticking up as we approach the next report.

YOU have been completely wrong about Kier for over a year now AND you still haven't given us the apology you promised. You said you would apologise for being wrong about Kier if the share price went past £1. It's been well over £1 for ages now and despite being reminded dozens of time, you STILL HAVE NOT KEPT YOUR WORD. If you want to be taken seriously, show that you can live up to your promises and apologise now.

[wallywoo] 13/10/2021 09:29

Kier's share price on August 25th - 134p, today 114pFTSE on August 25th 7100, today it's 7100I rest my case!!! Idiot!

[ontheforks] 13/10/2021 09:12

Hahaha just proved my point nocredwoo so all markets and shares are down but kier share price is due to the company Hahaha priceless you only pipe up when price goes down never up good luck longs 👍🏻 don't let nocredwoo persuade you to sell make your own decisions

[wallywoo] 13/10/2021 08:30

Forks, Kier have had to raise £491m in the last 3 years from shareholders (£250m in the first equity issue, £241m in the second). Since the market cap today is only £513m only £22m (513-491) of the pre December 18 equity is leftover!!


That's the only reason your company still survive. I have been spot on correct that Kier are a money pit. I was wrong that Kier were able to beg for more money so soon after the last issue.


Over the last few months they have been in a post equity issue honeymoon. That now has ended, and the share price has dropped. The balance sheet is much worse off than after the last equity issue (tangible net assets were -£116m then and -£265m now).


Therefore the chance of the company recovering is much smaller. It is only fair to point out the facts, for Pi's less blinkered than you.

[ontheforks] 13/10/2021 07:39

I see you and steve72 are back with your doom and gloom waldo surely by now you must realise you have no credibility on either forum I myself thought the share price was stable at around £1.20 but unfortunately the ftse100/250 had other ideas and nearly all shares across the board dropped yet you and your team jumped in with both feet proclaimed the sky above kier was falling in and started making up your own stories just like main stream media which tells me and a lot of others you have an agenda here and it certainly isn't an objective opinion as you claim if you're so confident in your opinion open a massive short today good luck longs 👍🏻

[wallywoo] 12/10/2021 14:31

Lol, only on Kier's unaudited babble did they say they made a profit.


The audited p&l shows a £29.7m loss.


That's another problem with Kier for years now they have been saying they are making a fortune. But the actual figures say otherwise. I loved the statements they made 12 months before the first equity issue when they said profits would double digits increase!!! Did you help them with that stuff Stdy? - sounds right up your street!!


Very peculiar, almost fraud IMO. Certainly not a investment!!

[stdyeddy] 12/10/2021 11:58

Yeah, whatever you say wolly. Kier has net cash (ie no net debt), is leading the sector on contract wins and has increased margin progressively over the last four reporting periods and turned a profit in the last report for the first time in two years. But you think it's all terrible. Fine.

[wallywoo] 12/10/2021 11:39

I agree September and October will be a massive months. September the share price fell from 130 to 120. In October the share price will fall from 120 to 105. Then comes the profit warnings!!


The trouble with Kier is there's always plenty of business but they tend to lose cash the more business they take on.


It's the under capitalised balance sheet that causes it (-£265m net tangible assets). Shame really, perhaps you should invest in a company where that doesn't happen?

[bathboy2] 11/10/2021 17:42

Mcalpine, sorry

[bathboy2] 11/10/2021 17:41

How is kier beating the likes of Balfour and mace, by being cheaper and less margin

[stdyeddy] 11/10/2021 17:22

If today is anything to go by, it looks as though October might end up being a massive month for our favourite construction firm, as well as September:

KIER TIPPED TO LAND £50M TOTTENHAM COURT ROAD JOB


Firm beats Mace and McAlpine to land mixed-use scheme

Kier is being tipped to land a £50m mixed-use scheme set to go up close to Tottenham Court Road Crossrail station in London’s West End.

The firm is understood to have beaten Mace and Sir Robert McAlpine to become preferred bidder for the two-stage tender for developer CO-RE which is masterminding the six-storey block with M&G Real Estate.

[stdyeddy] 11/10/2021 17:17

And the contract winning success seems set to continue with yet another framework win; Kier appointed to £1.6bn Public Buildings Framework



An important retention win for Kier since it has been on this very large framework previously, but also an expansion of the framework since Kier has 'Kier has been appointed to all regional areas applied for within workstream 4 - New Build, Refurbishment, and Infrastructure which span England, Scotland and Wales.'

[stdyeddy] 11/10/2021 17:07

Construction Enquirer has noticed our favourite construction firm's superb contract winning performance:



RE-ENERGISED KIER TOPS SEPTEMBER CONTRACTS LEAGUE
Kier has bounced back with a winning streak of contract wins after getting its finances back on track.

The firm tops September’s contracts league with a haul of 22 project wins, including the £200m Liverpool Bixteth Place office scheme for its in-house property division and a £66m project for Thames Water to modernise Mogden Sewage Treatment Works in Isleworth.

The surge of projects last month also lifted Kier from sixth to second place in the 12-month rolling league table of secured work just behind league leader Morgan Sindall.

[bathboy2] 09/10/2021 09:19

Next year is going to be an odd mix, aggregates, cement, haulage, letters are out from the major players, with price increases of between 10-12%, a lot of this is due to the fact that rebated fuel (red diesel) is being taken away from the quarrying and construction industries, with the move to green fuels like HVO, and the pressure being put on by government to construction companies, that their supply chain, ie haulage, and other contractors also use, the new HVO equivalent of white diesel, currently around 10ppl pre vat dearer. This new fuel is not fully available throughout the UK at present, but by Christmas available for bulk tanks, the change from April next year will be interesting if the fuel stations drag their heals on supplying, as they will still supply white, but at a much higher cost. Car drivers beware. Trades prices currently are up from last year 50%+and higher in London. Wood prices and stocks appears to have settled and are predicted to drop 7% next year, the next elephant in the room could be interest rates set to rise, maybe not by much, but it could soften the workload, but it wouldn't be a bad thing, as it is totally crazy, at the moment, aka 2007/2008, and look what happened then, there is also a prediction that property prices could fall upto 30%, i think this is a bit extreme, but never say never, it would be interesting how the government would cover off, as spent out already. It could scupper their plans to raise corporation taxes to 25% and now the OECD of which we are a member, have fixed the minimum at 15%, it could be risky to raise too high

[stdyeddy] 08/10/2021 23:47

A good showing last month for our favourite construction firm. According to Construction Enquirer's league table, Kier ranked first with £373m in contracts won in September.

In the rolling 12 months to September, Kier is currently second only to Morgan Sindall with just 2% in total contract values separating them (£1,507m and £1,534m respectively). Plenty of construction businesses are dealing with challenges, but Kier's scale and reputation gives the business a big advantage in a competitive environment.

Another interesting little detail; Kier Property has itself awarded an enormous number of contracts to other contractors (£200m in September alone), beating even the Dept for Education in the value of contracts. People here who listened to the end-of-year results presentation from Kier might remember an emphasis on the opportunities that Davies and Kesterton saw for profitable higher-margin projects in the Kier Property division. Prior to the sale of Kier Living and the cash-raise, one of the business's challenges had been maintaining sufficient capital for Kier Property along with the rest of the group. Now that the business has shed KL and recapitalised, it seems we might be seeing signs of the hinted at expansion in that area. I look forward to seeing a little detail on this in a few months time at HY1 (the mid-January update). With any luck, Kier Property will be adding momentum to Kier's margin growth from 3.1% towards the upper target of 3.5%.

[petersw1] 08/10/2021 14:25

I've sold a bit over half what I had here on Wednesday, realising a 35.8% profit on that batch. Hasn't been a bad investment at all :)
I did feel a bit conflicted selling, given the value on offer here. Though I find thinking along the lines of capital allocation made the decision easier. The current collection of "crises" has me feeling much more comfortable with Kier at 4% to 5% of my portfolio.

[wallywoo] 08/10/2021 08:28

Lol I was giving a example, not saying I was doing it. SYME is a casino stock, with very little intrinsic value, I would not touch it. You are promoting a stock that is on a year long down trend. The share price is 75 percent less than it was a year ago, but you think it is a great stock to go long on.


That is simply not true!


Go long on a up trend, short on a down trend and you will make a lot more money.

In the meantime, Kier's share price hits lower Low's nearly every day now - not a good sign!!