Itv Share Discussion Threads

[nige co] 17/2/2021 15:37

Thanks Stag, I only come to the conclusion that LG have made a good return based on what they have reported, regarding their current position in ITV is at 75p. I'm just as surprised as you are to be honest.

[stag6] 17/2/2021 14:58

Nige..it doesn't make any sense, you say GS are making a very good return, then someone else says Liberty have made millions on the holding. There are no losers in this scenario.

I haven't a clue what is going on, smoke and mirrors must be the answer, both players have made hundreds of millions while the share price didn't soar back from the lows, many FTSE shares did far better while ITV sometimes hardly moved in days and weeks.

Even with the market on your side there is no possible way that Liberty's stake owe them 75p a share. I don't believe it! and I ain't Victor Meldrew.

I have missed something, somewhere.

[nige co] 17/2/2021 12:20

Stag, do you have an opinion on why LG would recall their ITV shareholding, if GS are making them a very good return? I can only think that LG have plans for their ITV 9.9% holding? ie a buyer lined up, or they intend to make a move themselves, otherwise why would they recall their holding? Or am I simply reading too much in to this?

[stag6] 17/2/2021 12:08

hades..back up to 110p on market maker adjustments, no real action is happening.

I bought some earlier today at a tad below 109.86p to replace some I sold a couple of days ago at 113p......I am happy to make a few hundred a trade on these, I believe they are as safe a houses with the bonus of a breakout to 125p soon.

[hades1] 17/2/2021 12:01

We are back above 110p - now 110.8p with volume above 3m traded

[stag6] 17/2/2021 11:58

Where does it say in that Liberty report that Liberty's ITV shares owe them 75p each. They bought into ITV at 185p, they may well have collected premiums for options and loaning out the stake, but these are tiny percentages and as someone who has dealt in derivatives for years and it isn't possible to hedge and consistently make a the kind of profit that would get the price of your original stake down by 60%. Why bother taking a stake in the first place, just go long on forward calls and short with puts

I can't see how they have collected a huge amount of money on this. What is the point in taking a stake in any company if you directly put the stake at risk from other predators. Sure you can hedge, but again these things can cost you if the market goes against you.

I do not believe that even with the shenanigans often played with the help of GS, that Liberty's stake in ITV owe them 75p a share.

Maybe I should go back to school, but if it is true that their stake owes the only 40% of the original stake, they must be the smartest people on the planet.

Am I missing something?

[nige co] 17/2/2021 11:25

I can only think that with Liberty Global loaning Goldman Sachs their 9.9% of ITV shares that they have brought their average price down to 75p through OTC Swap/Put Call options hedge arrangement.

[hades1] 17/2/2021 11:20

At least it looks like today's shake has driven up the volume.
Still above Fri close of 109.3p?

[anhar] 17/2/2021 11:15

I don't know Ivan but my question is, why should I care?

[ivanborsky] 17/2/2021 10:48

Anhar, I will explain. July 2014, Liberty picked up a 6.4% stake in ITV for £481m (or £1.85p a share) and the following year increased their stake to 9.9% or an extra 140m shares for ZERO cost. They paid nothing courtesy of an OTC Swap/Put Call hedge arrangement with GS which we all know about. So they had 400million shares in ITV in total at average cost of £1.20 (i.e £481m divided by 400m shares). So where do Liberty get 75p from ?

[netcurtains] 17/2/2021 10:16

I dont want to jinx it but I think buying ITV for 109.8 is a good price

[anhar] 17/2/2021 10:09

So tell us

[hades1] 17/2/2021 10:09

It matters to me for reasons which seem obvious?
But clearly not obvious to all.

[anhar] 17/2/2021 10:02

"...I'm still trying to work out how Liberty have 7% of ITV at an average price of 75p. And I have a first in Pure and Applied Mathematics !!!!!!"

Why does this matter at all to private investors like us? I'm not being funny, I wouldn't even know about this stuff if I didn't look in here, and now that I do know, it makes no difference at all to any decisions I might make about my substantial holding in ITV.

[hades1] 17/2/2021 09:53

Fighting to take 110p again.
Not ideal but it's ITV!

[ivanborsky] 17/2/2021 09:45

No problem at all Nige. I'm still trying to work out how Liberty have 7% of ITV at an average price of 75p. And I have a first in Pure and Applied Mathematics !!!!!!

[nige co] 17/2/2021 09:02

Found it Ivan. cheers.

[pj84] 16/2/2021 22:36

Hopefully that works

[nige co] 16/2/2021 15:45

The link is dead Ivan.

If memory serves me correctly didn't Liberty claim that they were 30% up on their ITV holding after all the games that Goldman have been playing on their behalf?

The big question is still, why have Liberty recalled their 9.9% ITV holding, why not let Goldman carry on playing their games to reduce Liberty's average price further? This makes me wonder if something is about to happen.

[ivanborsky] 16/2/2021 15:08

Just looking through the Power Point presentation of Liberty's numbers. Page 6 states that the unwinding of the ITV collar agreement has resulted in Liberty holding 7% of ITV shares at 75p no less !! Bizarre really considering they announced a $415m hit in ITV as disclosed in their full year accounts. These Yanks love to play games. Time to don the deer stalker hat and magnifying glass to 'read between the lines' here !!

hxxps://www.libertyglobal.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Liberty-Global-Q4-2020-Investor-Call-Presentation.pdf

[nige co] 16/2/2021 12:10

Ready for lift off...

[ivanborsky] 16/2/2021 09:07

Just looking through Liberty's numbers out last night. No mention of ITV with the exception of a booked 'loss' of $415m in its collar loan arrangement on page 18. There is a conference call for the results at 02:00pm today but not sure if that's our time or USA time.
hxxps://www.libertyglobal.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/LG-Q4-2020-Press-Release.pdf

[anhar] 16/2/2021 08:53

"...But for good old pensioners this will be a disaster stock longer term..."

I probably qualify on two out of three of the above, "old" and "pensioner". Not too sure about the "good".

Thanks, I'm encouraged by the comment, already have a substantial holding and may add some more after reading this, especially if dividends are restarted. Someone who thinks this will be a disaster stock long term is someone for whom I'd consider strongly doing the opposite of what they say.

Nobody knows the long term, or the short term either. The stronger your belief that you think you do know, and refusal to accept that you cannot, the greater the likelihood of being a poor investor.

What investors actually do is to rely on hope, with the more skilled ones basing this on an analysis of fundamentals, but because the future is uncertain it's still just hope. Often it will work out in time, particularly for long term and income investors on balance, though not with every share.

But a lot refuse to accept that it's all based on hope, even for the most skilled, let alone some of the clowns you see here. We cannot possibly know what the future holds and ridiculously positive statements like the quote above, refusing to see the obvious uncertainty contained within any risk investment, are the mark of a loser or someone with an axe to grind.

[netcurtains] 16/2/2021 07:47

stockready filtered.

[stockready] 15/2/2021 23:20

Tlobs2

Points taken
Sorry about that
I do have a great interest in this share but sadly without Carolyne in charge

I don't think she is the one to guide this share to safety and manage the massive waves ahead.

I predicted this will rise shorter term and if you are here to make quick bucks then good for you
But for good old pensioners this will be a disaster stock longer term.

But lets keep the politics away and points taken, but can't resist not answering some people with agenda here and i will keep doing that.

All the best

Thank you